Analysis The Rebuilds Of Hawthorn and Geelong and their Future Prospects

[Strapping Young Lad]

Well both sides are rebuilding, playing with a very young and new midfield and defence. We seem to be a fair way above them on the ladder though.

Being honest I don't think either club has many of the players required to win a flag (if you exclude our guys who are nearly done).

Players under 50 games in last weeks side's.

Melbourne 4
Brisbane 6
Geelong 4
Port 7
WB 6
Collingwood 5
Hawthorn 12

One of these teams is rebuilding.

 

[The 747]

Players under 50 games in last weeks side's.

Melbourne 4
Brisbane 6
Geelong 4
Port 7
WB 6
Collingwood 5
Hawthorn 12

One of these teams is rebuilding.

Oh it's old mate the cherrypicker. Not interested.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Oh it's old mate the cherrypicker. Not interested.

How is that cherry picking?

You’ve just claimed that you’re rebuilding and playing a very young midfield and defence, and you’re playing less kids than just about every side in the top 8.

 

[The 747]

How is that cherry picking?

You’ve just claimed that you’re rebuilding and playing a very young midfield and defence, and you’re playing less kids than just about every side in the top 8.

I'll give you a serious answer. You pick and choose which stats to focus on, and try to reduce things to arguments like we have X number of debutants or we are 3rd for clearances when the ball is bounced, then you chuck a tanty when the conversation doesn't go your way or the 747 reminds you of the ladder.

For Geelong this year has been rebuilding; we have played a lot more younger players than we usually do.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

I'll give you a serious answer. You pick and choose which stats to focus on, and try to reduce things to arguments like we have X number of debutants or we are 3rd for clearances when the ball is bounced, then you chuck a tanty when the conversation doesn't go your way or the 747 reminds you of the ladder.

For Geelong this year has been rebuilding; we have played a lot more younger players than we usually do.

Really? “The 747”.

I talk with context of our list and specific areas of growth, meanwhile you make dumb arguments like “yeah, but you’re 16th on the ladder”.

Geelong are playing just 4 players under 50 games.
Just because you’d usually have an average age of 29 doesn’t mean your rebuilding.


When at least a third of your side are under 50 games I’ll let you claim that Geelong are rebuilding without laughing at it.

 

[The 747]

Really? “The 747”.

I talk with context of our list and specific areas of growth, meanwhile you make dumb arguments like “yeah, but you’re 16th on the ladder”.

Geelong are playing just 4 players under 50 games.
Just because you’d usually have an average age of 29 doesn’t mean your rebuilding.


When at least a third of your side are under 50 games I’ll let you claim that Geelong are rebuilding without laughing at it.

Talk to the wing mate.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Talk to the wing mate.

Weak as water.

 

[Roby]

For Geelong this year has been rebuilding; we have played a lot more younger players than we usually do.

Tomorrow Geelong are playing a team at home that is pleading for Priority Picks, and yet they are ahead of their rebuild compared to yours. You'll see first hand than younger players are miles ahead of your younger players tomorrow.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Players under 50 games in last weeks side's.

Melbourne 4
Brisbane 6
Geelong 4
Port 7
WB 6
Collingwood 5
Hawthorn 12

One of these teams is rebuilding.

Ignored Adelaide as usual (11 I believe) & we in the top 8.

How about Essendon too.

But anything to avoid comparing the Hawks to similar sides rebuilding.

 

[STPer18]

Tomorrow Geelong are playing a team at home that is pleading for Priority Picks, and yet they are ahead of their rebuild compared to yours. You'll see first hand than younger players are miles ahead of your younger players tomorrow.

Geelong are the reigning premiers and North have been a basket case for even longer than the Hawks. Are we supposed to be envious of North or something?

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Geelong are the reigning premiers and North have been a basket case for even longer than the Hawks. Are we supposed to be envious of North or something?

Cats will rebuild & win another flag before Roos imo.

 

[Warhorse]

Hawthorn has already hit bottom. With a clear run of injuries Geelong will try and continue to contend.

Rather than turning it into ashit slugging match its better to look at how the teams are going about a rebuild.

Geelong are targeting younger players who have spend a few years at other clubs who were high draft picks - Such as Bruhn, Henry and now trying to grab Ash. If they can get a decent free agent or 2 and look to continue to find value with the picks then the drop will be less severe but will also have less early draft talent.

Hawthorn on the other hand tried what Geelong had tried - trying to top up and remain competitive 5 or so years ago. They are now all in with a focus on youth and the draft. I like what Hawthorn is cooking up and feel they will be within the 8 within 3 years

 

[PhatBoy]

Man there is some extreme reaching in this thread.

To read some of the stuff masquerading as informed opinion here you would swear blind that teams aren’t competing for flags anymore, they’re actually competing for right to say they’re building for one.

Who cares how many kids you play. Who cares how many top 10 picks you have.

I don’t watch footy to get ready for something that’s happening in 5 years I watch it to hopefully see my team win.

 

[Roby]

Geelong are the reigning premiers and North have been a basket case for even longer than the Hawks. Are we supposed to be envious of North or something?

You just completely misrepresented what I just said. Congratulations on your lack of reasoning for everybody to see.

 

[PhatBoy]

You just completely misrepresented what I just said. Congratulations on your lack of reasoning for everybody to see.

Not sure how he misrepresented it.

All you did was say ‘this rubbish team who have been rubbish for a while and have had no choice but to draft and play young kids, will be playing more young kids that they’ve drafted when you meet tomorrow.’

What point were you making, exactly?

By my count the Suns, Giants, Blues, Adelaide, Essendon, Fremantle, Saints, Lions have all been through at least one full flag-less rebuild since we won the flag in 2007 and Hawthorn, North and the Eagles are all at various stages of one now, and at the very least you could argue that 7 of them are no closer than we are to their next flag. You could maybe throw Port in there too, I can’t remember a lot about their status going back before Hinkley arrived. And that’s on the proviso that none of the Hawks, Roos or Eagles stuff their current one up, and that the Lions don’t go through their current ‘up’ period without winning one. We’ve done that while staying relevant the entire time without having to do a full one ourselves

So forgive people if they don’t immediately jump to attention and say ‘oh this team has young players so we may as well concede that we won’t compete with them over the next five years.’

 

[STPer18]

You just completely misrepresented what I just said. Congratulations on your lack of reasoning for everybody to see.

North's last three years has seen finishes of 18th, 18th and 17th, in that same time Geelong has played off in two grand finals and won a premiership. Super insightful to suggest that they're ahead of their 'rebuild' when we've been focused on winning flags and games. Geelong were predicted to need a 'rebuild' after 2010 yet here we are again, and still the scribes insist the only way to 'rebuild' a list is to gut it and see the bottom of the club fall out ala North Melbourne and more recently Hawthorn when there's zero guarantee that it will result in any sort of future success ie Carlton.

 

[PhatBoy]

North's last three years has seen finishes of 18th, 18th and 17th, in that same time Geelong has played off in two grand finals and won a premiership. Super insightful to suggest that they're ahead of their 'rebuild' when we've been focused on winning flags and games. Geelong were predicted to need a 'rebuild' after 2010 yet here we are again, and still the scribes insist the only way to 'rebuild' a list is to gut it and see the bottom of the club fall out ala North Melbourne and more recently Hawthorn when there's zero guarantee that it will result in any sort of future success ie Carlton.

You would think after 13 seasons of this s**t people would just hold back on this sort of thing wouldn’t you.

 

[STPer18]

You would think after 13 seasons of this s**t people would just hold back on this sort of thing wouldn’t you.

When we finally turn into a club that's young and s**t and I'm going to have a field day on here I reckon. BigFooty.com loves that sort of list profile.

 

[PhatBoy]

When we finally turn into a club that's young and s**t and I'm going to have a field day on here I reckon. BigFooty.com loves that sort of list profile.

It will be the new measure of club success.

Flags no longer matter.

The MCG will become a ghost town on grand final day as hundreds of thousands of fans descend on the department of births, deaths and marriages to see when each club’s players were born.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Ignored Adelaide as usual (11 I believe) & we in the top 8.

How about Essendon too.

But anything to avoid comparing the Hawks to similar sides rebuilding.

LOL, Adelaide have nothing to do with this thread and whether Geelong are rebuilding or not.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

LOL, Adelaide have nothing to do with this thread and whether Geelong are rebuilding or not.

Yet you listed 5 other clubs who also have nothing to do with this thread...

 

[Elmer_Judd]

Hawthorn has already hit bottom. With a clear run of injuries Geelong will try and continue to contend.

Rather than turning it into ashit slugging match its better to look at how the teams are going about a rebuild.

Geelong are targeting younger players who have spend a few years at other clubs who were high draft picks - Such as Bruhn, Henry and now trying to grab Ash. If they can get a decent free agent or 2 and look to continue to find value with the picks then the drop will be less severe but will also have less early draft talent.

Hawthorn on the other hand tried what Geelong had tried - trying to top up and remain competitive 5 or so years ago. They are now all in with a focus on youth and the draft. I like what Hawthorn is cooking up and feel they will be within the 8 within 3 years

Geelong's current list management strategy (as you put it) is unsustainable long term, the three young recruits you got from other clubs last year (Bowes, Henry and Bruhn) have hardly set the world on fire this season.

As successful and mightily impressive and consistent your footy club has been since 2007 onwards, it might be time for the Catters to start to hitting the National Draft again and start drafting and developing your next future champions instead of keep going to other club's Well (so to speak)

 

[PhatBoy]

Geelong's current list management strategy (as you put it) is unsustainable long term, the three young recruits you got from other clubs last year (Bowes, Henry and Bruhn) have hardly set the world on fire this season.

As successful and mightily impressive and consistent your footy club has been since 2007 onwards, it might be time for the Catters to start to hitting the National Draft again and start drafting and developing your next future champions instead of keep going to other club's Well (so to speak)

Why? What makes it unsustainable? It’s worked for a decade, since we had to start siphoning off premiership players.

 

[Elmer_Judd]

Why? What makes it unsustainable? It’s worked for a decade, since we had to start siphoning off premiership players.

One flag to show for it, and the heart and soul of your last flag (Jelwood) has retired.

At some point Geelong needs to start hitting the draft hard and drafting and developing youth.

 

[STPer18]

Also pretty unreal we brought in two elite junior Falcons in Henry and Bruhn while also taking our first single figure pick to the draft since 2007. All that after winning the premiership in the same year. While cute and appreciated, opposition fan's concerns are better pointed at their own clubs, not the most successful club this century.