AFL Player #37: Nic Martin

[TheGrizz]

Contract Status: Out of contract 2024
2024 My Boy Draft: Pick 1, Beerfish

 

[faible]

Agree that pies will be the best test of our defensive set up but you can only go by who you play and dogs/crows may not be the best at transition but they arent slouches either.
Our backline structure was woeful against swans/hawks and for a half against Saints before the forward pressure game started to gel in 2nd half. THe port game is hard to read because we couldn't really get our pressure game going as port beat us at centre clearances and completely stifled our transition from backline, im hoping that was a good learning experience.
I was worried we would continue to get opened up on transition till ridley returned with how aggressive our forward press is and how much we turnover the ball but it does seem like the last two weeks Redman and Mckay are way more organised in the sweeper type roles and Martin/McGrath and co are starting to clean up their disposal too. Hope it continues on Thursday!

I reckon the emergence of Jones being a really strong marking option that can follow up with ground level pressure has made a big difference to how our pressure up the ground has looked.

Way less opportunities for easy, fast exits from our F50 has meant McKay being able to push up higher and intercept mark. His size has seen him win some contested marks and even 2v1 contests.

Ridley would absolutely love playing in a side with good forward pressure letting him set up and just read the ball to intercept mark then drive it back in.

 

[fairbump_playon]

Since saad and mckenna left this is the best we've looked coming out of the backline...and its still a work in progress. I would put that down to martin and mcgrath. Im excited to see how it goes with ridley in mix too.

Im really happy with redman switching to a more defensive role too, he looks exciting coming out of backline but i feel like he is one of the guys whos game really gets impacted by high forward pressure teams.

Even david king was giving our backline structure props aftet the last 2 weeks, feels like the switch of redman to a secondary sweeper role to assist mckay allows us to be more aggressive with forward pressure with martin and mcgrath being the primary distributors.

Martin is a factor but the lack of Ridley and Reid is also a big factor pushing Redman to a slightly different role. How it all looks with everyone available will be interesting for Redman as he is the one who most easily swings btw tall & small / lockdown & rebound.

 

[mcgrath_truther]

i think that ridley will end up taking the kickouts when he returns from injury, he's like a precision drill and won't miss a target exiting 50 imo

 

[Kong]

This may be an unpopular opinion, but I still don't like the change to HB. What will it take to move him back onto the wing? His kciking hasn't been good enough to warrant the change.

I prefer 2023 Martin far more than 2024 Martin. Maybe when Ridley comes back?

Different circumstances, but it reminds me of when they moved McGrath from defence to the midfield.

In both instances they've taken a very good player and turned them into a cosi cosi one.

 

[fairbump_playon]

I reckon the emergence of Jones being a really strong marking option that can follow up with ground level pressure has made a big difference to how our pressure up the ground has looked.

Way less opportunities for easy, fast exits from our F50 has meant McKay being able to push up higher and intercept mark. His size has seen him win some contested marks and even 2v1 contests.

Ridley would absolutely love playing in a side with good forward pressure letting him set up and just read the ball to intercept mark then drive it back in.

Ridley would indeed be licking his lips.

Separately I'm quite concerned with the return of Wright as I suspect he has been a major contributor to how easily teams transition against us. Jones shows the power of having a tall forward who is agile and a fierce competitor. Looks like Caddy will be wired that way too.

Separate to the possible downsides with Wright, the benefits themselves offer a mixed blessing. When it goes well he draws the best defender, creating opportunities for others, clunks a few contested marks, kicks straight. When it goes badly we target him too much, we don't lower our eyes to other targets, and Wright drops a bunch he gets two hands to.

We hear that Wright is a pro - would be hopeful he has been busy zig-zagging between some cones.

 

[Nicholas61]

and Martin/McGrath and co are starting to clean up their disposal too.

An important point in all this - Andy's disposal has been sublime at times this year and really opened things up resulting in critical goals at the end of the chain. Can't remember him kicking bullets with this quality before. If he keeps this going will give us flexibility in how we use Marto.

 

[brain taylor]

i think he played better footy individually on the wing but something is definitely clicking in terms of the overall structure of the team and i wouldn’t wanna mess with that while we’re winning.

 

[JayJ20]

Different circumstances, but it reminds me of when they moved McGrath from defence to the midfield.

In both instances they've taken a very good player and turned them into a cosi cosi one.

That's actually a really good example.

 

[ant555]

Exactly. He was on track to be one of the best wingman in the game. He's nowhere near the best HB. I have high hopes for Martin so I think he should go back to what he was doing last year.

He can at any stage. We are winning now so it is not an issue. At least when he does get back there he will have a better understanding of the defensive side of things. Does it really matter right now ?
It is not like his role has changed a lot by being the attacking half back. He is just back one slot further.

 

[Call Me Cake]

McGrath looks miles a better player now than he used to be.

Can't say the same about Martin.

I feel as though Martin has the capabilities of being a real threat when it comes to scoring assists and would be damaging in how he used to play. Especially now that Durham has been moved more into a midfield role, so the wing dilemma we thought we'd have with Duursma coming in isn't really a factor anymore.

Part of it could be "we didn't come this far just to quit now" when it comes to experiment, to do away with it now is a form of admitting defeat. So I expect it to be persisted with. I just think Martin is not a defender and we've done this on the back of wanting to do a Daicos type thing whereas it's pretty obvious you need a whole team to click for that to even be a factor, and it feels outdated by now.

Think he still has holes defensively and something that saves him in that regard is how little games he's played in context. So he's pliable to be developed in that, but at the same time if it is the wrong move there's a chance we might be stunting what he could've been had he had been allowed to progress the way he was initially (and what actually put him on the map as a worthy player to begin with).

 

[fairbump_playon]

Contrary but I think it’s starting to work well. He’s getting better week by week. With Ridley out, Redman has had to defend more. We need run and spark and we are getting that from Martin.

I reckon he’s being punished here for duffing a hero kick or two a game. Aside from those it’s generally pretty handy output IMO. On the verge of something special.

 

[Rick Ross]

FWIW Martin is averaging more inside 50s now than he was in the last two seasons (3.5 vs 2.7 last year). He's also averaging more metres gained (590 vs 334) and is leading the AFL there.

This is despite still having a lot of turnovers so there's even more upside in his game if he can iron those out.

A lot of teams have a really damaging player off half-back that can open the game up, and have used them to good effect.

Brisbane had Daniel Rich for years then had Coleman take a PF apart off half-back and very nearly do it again in the GF. They've now moved Zorko back there to do it.
Collingwood have moved Daicos back to half-back after struggling for drive out of the back half.
Geelong have Tom Stewart, Freo has Luke Ryan, Kangaroos use Sheezel, Swans use Blakey so on and so on.

Essendon has spent years struggling to escape the high-press once we're in the back half and desperately needed some line breaking users - especially with Ridley out.

Martin may not be playing the best role for him personally right now, but it's probably the one the team needs him, in at least until we've got Ridley back.

More inside 50’s

FWIW Martin is averaging more inside 50s now than he was in the last two seasons (3.5 vs 2.7 last year). He's also averaging more metres gained (590 vs 334) and is leading the AFL there.

This is despite still having a lot of turnovers so there's even more upside in his game if he can iron those out.

A lot of teams have a really damaging player off half-back that can open the game up, and have used them to good effect.

Brisbane had Daniel Rich for years then had Coleman take a PF apart off half-back and very nearly do it again in the GF. They've now moved Zorko back there to do it.
Collingwood have moved Daicos back to half-back after struggling for drive out of the back half.
Geelong have Tom Stewart, Freo has Luke Ryan, Kangaroos use Sheezel, Swans use Blakey so on and so on.

Essendon has spent years struggling to escape the high-press once we're in the back half and desperately needed some line breaking users - especially with Ridley out.

Martin may not be playing the best role for him personally right now, but it's probably the one the team needs him, in at least until we've got Ridley back.

Does anyone know :

• If you play on from a kick-in does it count as meters gained?
• Do backwards kicks count as negative?

 

[DERO]

^ Paging eth-dog

 

[blitzer]

I reckon the move to half back was a good one. Great for the team and I think he continues to improve week by week. He's hardly battling back there. He's probably top 5 in our B&F right now. Its only 6 weeks in, in a new position.

Could he be better on the wing? Maybe but I just think how screwed we'd be for distributors with Ridley injured the entire year and Redman down on form without him. We've got various players to try on the wings. Even without him - we've got Duursma, Durham, Cox, Tsatas - plus just about every other midfielder that can roll through there as required.

 

[eth-dog]

More inside 50’s

Does anyone know :

• If you play on from a kick-in does it count as meters gained?
• Do backwards kicks count as negative?

Yes, to both

 

[justlookingaround]

Martin winning ball in the back half is going to be super important for us going forward imo. First couple weeks he looked a bit lost but I feel like he’s definitely showing his potential there now.

Plus it’s not like we will never see him deliver it inside 50 again - he pushes up every time we get territory advantage.

Best part about Scott’s coaching so far for mine is his smarts to work out players best roles. Martin is kind of a utility in the sense that we could get a fair bit out of him in multiple different roles.

 

[Call Me Cake]

Disagree, I think he's being wasted down back unfortunately.

He had the potential to be a star of the competition and you don't play your stars in a position that anyone can learn to play.

This is why Sheezel should be played elsewhere.

Think we're using him in that position because we've yet to fill it. I feel in time he should eventually go back to being the star damaging player we knew and loved.

And I think that's where he enjoys his footy more. I've never seen him as sad and dummy-spitting as he looks now when things aren't working, but I can tell he's a battler who's playing his role and is trying to repay the faith he was given when he was picked up. But I'd rather players enjoy what they do for what they were obviously on the verge of being a star at, not being pigeon-holed into something they don't like just because it was the flavour of the month.

 

[ant555]

Who gives a heck. We have won more games than anyone has predicted . It is not like it is losing us games. Playing him on the wing would not have got us out of the s**t in the Sydney and Port games.

 

[joey_jo_jo]

bloke who kicks the sealer against the crows and sets up the gresham goal that broke the dogs, with an aggressive kick into the corridor from half back, is apparently not having a positive impact on the team

 

[Old Campaigner]

bloke who kicks the sealer against the crows and sets up the gresham goal that broke the dogs, with an aggressive kick into the corridor from half back, is apparently not having a positive impact on the team

It’s the sort of cutting analysis we all crave

 

[Call Me Cake]

Who gives a *. We have won more games than anyone has predicted . It is not like it is losing us games. Playing him on the wing would not have got us out of the s**t in the Sydney and Port games.

A single player is never going to have an effect on an outright win or loss. To even think that is a simple minded approach to the game. Just as I would not attribute the Sydney or Port thrashing on Martin, I also wouldn't exactly attribute the wins to him either. And if we're going to go down that route, then a case could be made that some of the close wins would have been a little easier if he was played in the positions he thrives at.

The main point of it isn't about recent wins or losses though, it's a little removed from that. Stepping back and looking at the bigger picture, it's more about what's right for the future structure of the team, particularly when aiming to be strong in finals/contending for flags.

 

[DERO]

A single player is never going to have an effect on an outright win or loss. To even think that is a simple minded approach to the game. Just as I would not attribute the Sydney or Port thrashing on Martin, I also wouldn't exactly attribute the wins to him either. And if we're going to go down that route, then a case could be made that some of the close wins would have been a little easier if he was played in the positions he thrives at.

The main point of it isn't about recent wins or losses though, it's a little removed from that. Stepping back and looking at the bigger picture, it's more about what's right for the future structure of the team, particularly when aiming to be strong in finals/contending for flags.

He is more than likely playing there because Ridley is out injured and we needed Martin to go back to help set us up.

Not what anyone wants but more about what we need.

 

[supportyourteam]

A single player is never going to have an effect on an outright win or loss. To even think that is a simple minded approach to the game. Just as I would not attribute the Sydney or Port thrashing on Martin, I also wouldn't exactly attribute the wins to him either. And if we're going to go down that route, then a case could be made that some of the close wins would have been a little easier if he was played in the positions he thrives at.

The main point of it isn't about recent wins or losses though, it's a little removed from that. Stepping back and looking at the bigger picture, it's more about what's right for the future structure of the team, particularly when aiming to be strong in finals/contending for flags.

The last quarter could be classified as a thrashing against Sydney. At the time thought Draper coming was a factor and then Papley Papleyed. Putting the Port and Sydney losses in the same basket is unjust to both games.

 

[ant555]

A single player is never going to have an effect on an outright win or loss. To even think that is a simple minded approach to the game. Just as I would not attribute the Sydney or Port thrashing on Martin, I also wouldn't exactly attribute the wins to him either. And if we're going to go down that route, then a case could be made that some of the close wins would have been a little easier if he was played in the positions he thrives at.

The main point of it isn't about recent wins or losses though, it's a little removed from that. Stepping back and looking at the bigger picture, it's more about what's right for the future structure of the team, particularly when aiming to be strong in finals/contending for flags.

Bigger picture.

Player learns how to defend better by playing half back and returns to the wing a more rounded player. Is now able to play a role in three areas of the ground rather than being pigeon holed into one spot.

Be careful the picture does not fall on your head.

You may be looking at a big picture but it is in a very small box.

 

[Call Me Cake]

Bigger picture.

Player learns how to defend better by playing half back and returns to the wing a more rounded player. Is now able to play a role in three areas of the ground rather than being pigeon holed into one spot.

Be careful the picture does not fall on your head.

You may be looking at a big picture but it is in a very small box.

Not every player has to know every position, and sometimes taking them away from a position they're poised to be a star at can interrupt that, and you don't need to play in defence to learn a defensive aspect to your game.

I'd rather not have a jack of all trades but a master of none. You do you though.