Current Claremont Murders Discussion & Edwards trial updates pt2

How would you find Bradley Robert Edwards?

  • Not guilty on all

  • Guilty on all

  • Ciara Glennon - Guilty

  • Ciara Glennon & Jane Rimmer - Guilty

  • I need more information!

  • This is sooo sub-judice, I'm dobbing you in shellyg


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It's hard to believe nobody knew Bradley was the prowler.
You'd think that there was a good possibility, that at least one of the Police and/or ex-Police that BRE socialised/played with in his 2007-2009 years playing amateur masters footy for the Central Crocs, and setting up and running their website, would have in one way or another been aware to some degree, of BRE's shady past.
 
All the more reason to go to the Supreme Court rather than District Court. Plus they will miss the ruckus outside the District Court. Everyone who is anyone will be inside before 9am if not by 8am.

The evening TV event? Yawn.
It will be a circus in Hay street as you say Jezza, I believe all the workman that are doing all the roadworks and mayhem outside there have been asked to take the day off too because of it.
The Supreme Court it is I’m thinking.
 
And how did he get to work around so many children and teenagers at WA Little Athletics for so many years without someone saying something to get him banned from doing this?
I’m amazed that he didn’t have to have a working with children clearance like everyone has to here in WA.
Little Athletics has some answering to do allowing it.
 

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Brief: Parking this here for easy access :car::car::car::car::car: 5 more sleeps:

TIMELINE OF THE BRADLEY ROBERT EDWARDS CASE:

February 15, 1988:
Edwards attacks an 18-year-old woman at night whilst she is asleep in her Huntingdale home while wearing a woman's nightie then flees after a struggle, leaving behind a stolen, semen-stained silk kimono.

May 7, 1990:
During his day time Telstra shift , Edwards attacks a Hollywood Hospital social worker from behind, covering her mouth and dragging her towards toilets, but she breaks free. He earns a conviction and is ordered to complete a sex offender program. (nb: only a common assault charge)

February 12, 1995:
Edwards abducts a 17-year-old girl in the dark from a dark Claremont park, binding and gagging her, and pulling a hood over her head, then drags her through Karrakatta Cemetery where he rapes her twice.

1995-1997:
A male driver, either in a Telstra vehicle or identifying himself as a Telstra worker, gives lifts to women in Claremont or neighbouring Cottesloe.
January 27, 1996:
Sarah Spiers, 18, disappears after leaving Club Bay View in Claremont and calling a taxi from a nearby phone booth. Her body has not been found.
June 9, 1996:
Jane Rimmer, 23, is last seen outside Claremont's Continental Hotel. (seen laughing to MM on CCTV)
August 3, 1996:
Her body is found in bushland at Wellard in Perth's south.
March 15, 1997:
Ciara Glennon, 27, is last seen in Claremont after visiting the Continental Hotel.
April 3, 1997:
Her body is found in bushland at Eglinton in Perth's north.

2014-2015:
Forensics find common fibres from KK (+ Ms Rimmer + Ms Glennon) identifying these fibres as most likely coming from a VS Commodore wagon (reported by Bret in The Post in Oct 2015) Forensics also find matching Telstra navy uniform fibres.

November 2016:
The stained kimono is finally tested, with DNA matching swabs taken from the Karrakatta victim and cellular material found under Ms Glennon's fingernails.
December 16, 2016:
After investigators look more deeply into other offences in Huntingdale, where Edwards grew up, fingerprints taken from an attempted break-in in 1988 match prints in the national database taken from him after the Hollywood Hospital attack. (cops finally have his name from his prints)
December 20, 2016:
Detectives test a Sprite bottle Edwards discards at a cinema.
December 22, 2016:
Police raid Edwards' Kewdale home. He is interviewed over 14 hours then charged with murdering Ms Rimmer and Ms Glennon, and the Karrakatta and Huntingdale crimes.

February 22, 2018:
Edwards is charged with murdering Ms Spiers, whose body has never been found.

February 18, 2019:
Edwards is found alone in a prison shower block with an ear injury and a pencil nearby. Police later reveal it was likely self-inflicted (dick)
October 21, 2019:
Edwards pleads guilty to the Karrakatta and Huntingdale crimes, but maintains he did not commit the murders. The surprise admissions slash the length of the trial.
November 25, 2019:
The trial, originally scheduled to start in July, begins.

May 6, 2020:
State closes its case. Defence case is over within minutes, with Edwards electing not to take the stand and his lawyers calling no witnesses.
June 25, 2020:
Trial concludes.
September 24, 2020:
Supreme Court Justice Stephen Hall to deliver his long-awaited verdict.

BRE CHARGES:

Count 1 - pleaded Guilty
On 15 February 1988, at Huntingdale, the accused broke and entered the dwelling-house of EWH with intent to commit an offence therein and the offence was committed at night.
Count 2 - pleaded Guilty
On the same date and at the same place as count 1, the accused unlawfully deprived ALH of her personal liberty
Count 3 - pleaded Guilty
On 12 February 1995, at Claremont and elsewhere, the accused unlawfully detained KJG.
Count 4 - pleaded Guilty
On the same date as in count 3, at Karrakatta, the accused sexually penetrated KJG without her consent, by penetrating her vagina with his penis, and did bodily harm to KJG, and did an act which was likely to seriously and substantially degrade or humiliate KJG.
Count 5 - pleaded Guilty
On the same date and at the same place as count 4, the accused sexually penetrated KJG without her consent, by penetrating her anus with his penis, and did bodily harm to KJG, and did an act which was likely to seriously and substantially degrade or humiliate KJG
Count 6 - found (tba Guilty/Not Guilty) - SS
On or about 27 January 1996, at Claremont and elsewhere, the accused wilfully murdered Sarah Jane Spiers
Count 7 - found (tba Guilty/Not Guilty) - JR
On or about 9 June 1996, at Claremont and elsewhere, the accused wilfully murdered Jane Louise Rimmer.
Count 8 - found (tba Guilty/Not Guilty) - CG
On or about 15 March 1997, at Claremont and elsewhere, the accused wilfully murdered Ciara Eilish Glennon
 
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There's likely a host of other charges that may have been exposed through the investigation post arrest but they will probably fall away or be beyond statutes and only the most serious prosecuted, to conviction hopefully.
I was surprised the prosecution, if they had other possible charges, didn’t try to introduce them as propensity evidence. A long shot yes, but they tried with the pornography. That’s what made me wonder if they just haven’t figured others out yet.
 
Brief: Parking this here for easy access :car::car::car::car::car: 5 more sleeps:

TIMELINE OF THE BRADLEY ROBERT EDWARDS CASE:

February 15, 1988:
Edwards attacks an 18-year-old woman at night whilst she is asleep in her Huntingdale home while wearing a woman's nightie then flees after a struggle, leaving behind a stolen, semen-stained silk kimono.

May 7, 1990:
During his day time Telstra shift , Edwards attacks a Hollywood Hospital social worker from behind, covering her mouth and dragging her towards toilets, but she breaks free. He earns a conviction and is ordered to complete a sex offender program. (nb: only a common assault charge)

February 12, 1995:
Edwards abducts a 17-year-old girl in the dark from a dark Claremont park, binding and gagging her, and pulling a hood over her head, then drags her through Karrakatta Cemetery where he rapes her twice.

1995-1997:
A male driver, either in a Telstra vehicle or identifying himself as a Telstra worker, gives lifts to women in Claremont or neighbouring Cottesloe.
January 27, 1996:
Sarah Spiers, 18, disappears after leaving Club Bay View in Claremont and calling a taxi from a nearby phone booth. Her body has not been found.
June 9, 1996:
Jane Rimmer, 23, is last seen outside Claremont's Continental Hotel. (seen laughing to MM on CCTV)
August 3, 1996:
Her body is found in bushland at Wellard in Perth's south.
March 15, 1997:
Ciara Glennon, 27, is last seen in Claremont after visiting the Continental Hotel.
April 3, 1997:
Her body is found in bushland at Eglinton in Perth's north.

November 2016:
The stained kimono is finally tested, with DNA matching swabs taken from the Karrakatta victim and cellular material found under Ms Glennon's fingernails.
December 16, 2016:
After investigators look more deeply into other offences in Huntingdale, where Edwards grew up, fingerprints taken from an attempted break-in in 1988 match prints in the national database taken from him after the Hollywood Hospital attack. (cops finally have his name from his prints)
December 20, 2016:
Detectives test a Sprite bottle Edwards discards at a cinema.
December 22, 2016:
Police raid Edwards' Kewdale home. He is interviewed over 14 hours then charged with murdering Ms Rimmer and Ms Glennon, and the Karrakatta and Huntingdale crimes.

February 22, 2018:
Edwards is charged with murdering Ms Spiers, whose body has never been found.

February 18, 2019:
Edwards is found alone in a prison shower block with an ear injury and a pencil nearby. Police later reveal it was likely self-inflicted (dick)
October 21, 2019:
Edwards pleads guilty to the Karrakatta and Huntingdale crimes, but maintains he did not commit the murders. The surprise admissions slash the length of the trial.
November 25, 2019:
The trial, originally scheduled to start in July, begins.

May 6, 2020:
State closes its case. Defence case is over within minutes, with Edwards electing not to take the stand and his lawyers calling no witnesses.
June 25, 2020:
Trial concludes.
September 24, 2020:
Supreme Court Justice Stephen Hall to deliver his long-awaited verdict.

Charge One - plead Guilty
Charge Two - plead Guilty
Charged Three - plead Guilty
Charge Four - plead Guilty
Charge Five - plead Guilty
Charge Six - found (tba)
Charge Seven - found (tba)
Charge Eight - found (tba)
Neat summary :)
I would probably add to it the finding of common fibres, then identifying these as most likely coming from a VS Commodore wagon (sometime around 2014 if I recall)...
 
Channel 9 already pre-empting the dropping of 'serial' from his title in that promo video, which all media organisations will do after he's convicted of only Ciara's murder and found not guilty of the other two due to a lack of compelling evidence.

Calling it now. Hope I'm wrong though and he's found guilty on both CG and JR. Wonder if they'll still refer to him as the CSK if he is. Experts are divided on whether two or three kills are the minimum to be given the title of serial killer.
 
Channel 9 already pre-empting the dropping of 'serial' from his title in that promo video, which all media organisations will do after he's convicted of only Ciara's murder and found not guilty of the other two due to a lack of compelling evidence.

Calling it now. Hope I'm wrong though and he's found guilty on both CG and JR. Wonder if they'll still refer to him as the CSK if he is. Experts are divided on whether two or three kills are the minimum to be given the title of serial killer.

And if he's found not guilty of all 3 murders, where will that leave the West/Tim Clarke and their "Enigma of the Night" book?

I daresay the West/Tim will at least need to change the title, or never publish the book at all, even though the Huntingdale and Rowe Park/Karrakatta attacks he has already pleaded guilty to, were at night, and given that there were no charges laid against BRE for any of the other at night Telstra Living Witness incidents presented during pre-trial or trial.
 
Brief: Parking this here for easy access :car::car::car::car::car: 5 more sleeps:

TIMELINE OF THE BRADLEY ROBERT EDWARDS CASE:

February 15, 1988:
Edwards attacks an 18-year-old woman at night whilst she is asleep in her Huntingdale home while wearing a woman's nightie then flees after a struggle, leaving behind a stolen, semen-stained silk kimono.

May 7, 1990:
During his day time Telstra shift , Edwards attacks a Hollywood Hospital social worker from behind, covering her mouth and dragging her towards toilets, but she breaks free. He earns a conviction and is ordered to complete a sex offender program. (nb: only a common assault charge)

February 12, 1995:
Edwards abducts a 17-year-old girl in the dark from a dark Claremont park, binding and gagging her, and pulling a hood over her head, then drags her through Karrakatta Cemetery where he rapes her twice.

1995-1997:
A male driver, either in a Telstra vehicle or identifying himself as a Telstra worker, gives lifts to women in Claremont or neighbouring Cottesloe.
January 27, 1996:
Sarah Spiers, 18, disappears after leaving Club Bay View in Claremont and calling a taxi from a nearby phone booth. Her body has not been found.
June 9, 1996:
Jane Rimmer, 23, is last seen outside Claremont's Continental Hotel. (seen laughing to MM on CCTV)
August 3, 1996:
Her body is found in bushland at Wellard in Perth's south.
March 15, 1997:
Ciara Glennon, 27, is last seen in Claremont after visiting the Continental Hotel.
April 3, 1997:
Her body is found in bushland at Eglinton in Perth's north.

November 2016:
The stained kimono is finally tested, with DNA matching swabs taken from the Karrakatta victim and cellular material found under Ms Glennon's fingernails.
December 16, 2016:
After investigators look more deeply into other offences in Huntingdale, where Edwards grew up, fingerprints taken from an attempted break-in in 1988 match prints in the national database taken from him after the Hollywood Hospital attack. (cops finally have his name from his prints)
December 20, 2016:
Detectives test a Sprite bottle Edwards discards at a cinema.
December 22, 2016:
Police raid Edwards' Kewdale home. He is interviewed over 14 hours then charged with murdering Ms Rimmer and Ms Glennon, and the Karrakatta and Huntingdale crimes.

February 22, 2018:
Edwards is charged with murdering Ms Spiers, whose body has never been found.

February 18, 2019:
Edwards is found alone in a prison shower block with an ear injury and a pencil nearby. Police later reveal it was likely self-inflicted (dick)
October 21, 2019:
Edwards pleads guilty to the Karrakatta and Huntingdale crimes, but maintains he did not commit the murders. The surprise admissions slash the length of the trial.
November 25, 2019:
The trial, originally scheduled to start in July, begins.

May 6, 2020:
State closes its case. Defence case is over within minutes, with Edwards electing not to take the stand and his lawyers calling no witnesses.
June 25, 2020:
Trial concludes.
September 24, 2020:
Supreme Court Justice Stephen Hall to deliver his long-awaited verdict.

Charge One - plead Guilty
Charge Two - plead Guilty
Charged Three - plead Guilty
Charge Four - plead Guilty
Charge Five - plead Guilty
Charge Six - found (tba)
Charge Seven - found (tba)
Charge Eight - found (tba)
Thanks Eaglette, great summary which covers aprox 10 years.
 
I’m amazed that he didn’t have to have a working with children clearance like everyone has to here in WA.
Little Athletics has some answering to do allowing it.
Assault in 1990 - 10 year limitation on offences - 2000 was just a police clearance - there were no specific areas that were managed ie catch all clearance

One of the things to remember is this was 1990 - if we go back 30 years from 1990 rapes and sexual assaults of children were dealt with in a manner that would shock us today ie 7 months to 18 months maximum for some offences with others dismissed or dealt with Suspended Sentences or Good Behaviour Bonds

This would also be why the question on the policeman who played at the Crocs can be explained. He had a stable job, relationship and was in the community. Why would the policeman suspect anything? Or know anything?

Not only are there rules - as there was then - of using police computers to check on anybody - what reason would he to do so?

We are looking at BRE through these very narrow lenses . The questions are fine but we need to recognise a change in times
 
He had a stable job, relationship and was in the community.
Why would the policeman suspect anything? Or know anything?

Weren't all Perth Telstra workers with his profile and with access to a range of Telstra vehicles in 1995-1997, still in the circle of potential suspects in 2007-2009?

on Claude Minisini’s recommendation, WA Police brought in David Caldwell. The South Carolina detective and profiler
Mr Caldwell told the press he believed the killer would be “probably very bright, very much in control of himself ... probably a very pleasant, normal-appearing person”.
A more-detailed profile, worked up and then released publicly, pinpointed other probable elements of the killer’s life — the fact that he probably lived alone, the temporary departure of a partner or other family members, and an occupation allowing him freedom of movement at night.
“I dare say that when this guy is arrested, I guarantee that people are going to be absolutely astounded,” Mr Caldwell told reporters. “They’re gonna say, ‘I worked with this guy. He’s my next-door neighbour. Surely it can’t be?’”

A policeman who was once part of the huge team hunting the Claremont serial killer played social football with the man now accused of committing the horrific crimes.
In a new twist to the long-running case that has gripped the State, The Weekend West can reveal that in 2007, Bradley Robert Edwards and the officer played together in the Central Crocs Masters football team.
The officer, now an inspector and who The Weekend West has decided not to name, was among the detectives who interviewed revellers at Club Bayview in 1996 after the disappearance of Sarah Spiers that January.
He spent time in the special crime squad, which was set up to investigate historical unsolved murders, including the Claremont case.
It is understood the police officer has been a long-time member of the Central Crocs. The club formed in 2007 as part of the AFL Masters WA for over-35s.

I'd have hoped that someone who had worked in the WA special crime squad, would 24/7 always be on the lookout for any potential suspects in the CSK case.
Even if he was no longer working on the case.
Particularly, a Telstra worker who was camera shy, that fitted the Caldwell profile.

Hopefully after the trial/conviction/appeal process is over, we'll get to hear some more about BRE's time with the Central Crocs, and whether there was anything suspect or strange about BRE, observed by his team mates or officials, during his 2007-2009 involvement with the club.

And am mindful that we need to be fair in NOT automatically assuming that BRE smelled sus or guilty of crimes as serious/horrific of what he pleaded guilty to recently, or crimes he is been awaiting the Judges verdict this coming Thursday, to all of those that he worked, rested or played with during all those decades.
 
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Weren't all Perth Telstra workers with his profile and with access to a range of Telstra vehicles in 1995-1997, still in the circle of potential suspects in 2007-2009?

I'd have hoped that someone who had worked in the WA special crime squad, would 24/7 always be on the lookout for any potential suspects in the CSK case.
Even if he was no longer working on the case.
Particularly, a Telstra worker who was camera shy, that fitted the Caldwell profile.
Not sure - they had LW and also the other ''Telstra Suspect'' they had semi-cleared if I recall

His ''image and status'' may have stopped anyone looking closely

I imagine most people think of serial killers as having some defect on display that makes you go hmmm weird dude wouldnt want to get on the wrong side of him. I'm not sure that was BREs portrayal
 

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Having BRE on the front cover of Tim Clarke’s book is ballsy, it tells me it is only going to be all about the arrest and trial, unless Tim Clarke is 100% sure he’s going to found guilty. Thoughts?
 
I’m amazed that he didn’t have to have a working with children clearance like everyone has to here in WA.
Little Athletics has some answering to do allowing it.
Correct me if I am wrong, but ( going on the belief that the only charge BRE had on record, if it was on record as a criminal charge, at the time was the HH assault ) i would have thought BRE would no problem getting a WWCC check. As the offence was not child related?....' They consider a person's criminal record to see if they have any previous charges or convictions that indicate they may be a risk of harm to a child. '
 
Weren't all Perth Telstra workers with his profile and with access to a range of Telstra vehicles in 1995-1997, still in the circle of potential suspects in 2007-2009?
From memory, in court it was stated that the police did canvas with Telstra details of anyone driving particular sorts of cars fairly early on, but BRE’s name was left off the list even though he fitted the criteria. I also vaguely recall reading that this happened twice. I’d love an investigative journalist to delve more into that. Was his the only name left off? How did it happen?
 
Having BRE on the front cover of Tim Clarke’s book is ballsy, it tells me it is only going to be all about the arrest and trial, unless Tim Clarke is 100% sure he’s going to found guilty. Thoughts?
Definitely ballsy! Huge risk as this could all go pear shaped if BRE if found not guilty on on Thursday!! The whole book may have to be pulled and rewritten.
 
From memory, in court it was stated that the police did canvas with Telstra details of anyone driving particular sorts of cars fairly early on, but BRE’s name was left off the list even though he fitted the criteria. I also vaguely recall reading that this happened twice. I’d love an investigative journalist to delve more into that. Was his the only name left off? How did it happen?
Although it may seem unbelievable that this happened, I think it comes down to the fact that Telstra's car fleet system simply did not work!
 
Definitely ballsy! Huge risk as this could all go pear shaped if BRE if found not guilty on on Thursday!! The whole book may have to be pulled and rewritten.

It looks like it is not even scheduled to be published for over 2 months (Late November 2020),
by which time sentencing will have likely been completed and any appeals already announced.

Which is obviously so that they can either pull, and rewrite the book.
And most importantly, complete it, or modify even the sections that were published as extracts of it yesterday and today in the West Australian Newspaper and it's Sunday version, (Sunday Times), Noting that Tim has revealed (in the West Podcast on Thursday) that it was the Editor of the West, who asked him to write the book, implying that it was not his idea to write this book, and leaving open the possibility that he is reluctantly writing it.

I wonder who is the copyright owner of the book, Tim Clarke or his employer (Seven Media/The West), and whether Seven Media/The West has a contract with Tim that gives them right of veto about anything in the book that they want included or excluded?

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Not sure - they had LW and also the other ''Telstra Suspect'' they had semi-cleared if I recall

From memory, in court it was stated that the police did canvas with Telstra details of anyone driving particular sorts of cars fairly early on, but BRE’s name was left off the list even though he fitted the criteria. I also vaguely recall reading that this happened twice. I’d love an investigative journalist to delve more into that. Was his the only name left off? How did it happen?
And whether the other ALLEGED investigated Telstra worker ALLEGED IT expert suspect, was also left off that list (if he was even working for Telstra with access to one of their fleet vehicles during 1995-1997).

I'm probably never going to be convinced that there ever actually was at least one other heavily investigated Telstra worker IT expert suspect known to be offering lifts to women around the Western Suburbs, until they name who it was and the suspect credibly and irrefutably confirms it was them. (Which I don't expect or require them to do). With all bets off in what/who I might believe regarding this, if the other alleged and alleged heavily investigated Telstra worker IT expert CSK suspect, ever had any strong connections to WA Police.
 
And whether the other ALLEGED investigated Telstra worker ALLEGED IT expert suspect, was also left off that list (if he was even working for Telstra with access to one of their fleet vehicles during 1995-1997).

I'm probably never going to be convinced that there ever actually was at least one other heavily investigated Telstra worker IT expert suspect known to be offering lifts to women around the Western Suburbs, until they name who it was and the suspect credibly and irrefutably confirms it was them. (Which I don't expect or require them to do). With all bets off in what/who I might believe regarding this, if the other alleged and alleged heavily investigated Telstra worker IT expert CSK suspect, ever had any strong connections to WA Police.

W.A Police had very strong links with Telecom and the Telstra - as did all government departments.

They would have had near full time PBX and data communications support probably with semi-permanently allocated technicians - and a long legged blonde perfumed Telstra rep oozing charm and dishing out free lunches and jollies and kit to Police ICT staff by the truckload.
 
And whether the other ALLEGED investigated Telstra worker ALLEGED IT expert suspect, was also left off that list (if he was even working for Telstra with access to one of their fleet vehicles during 1995-1997).

I'm probably never going to be convinced that there ever actually was at least one other heavily investigated Telstra worker IT expert suspect known to be offering lifts to women around the Western Suburbs, until they name who it was and the suspect credibly and irrefutably confirms it was them. (Which I don't expect or require them to do). With all bets off in what/who I might believe regarding this, if the other alleged and alleged heavily investigated Telstra worker IT expert CSK suspect, ever had any strong connections to WA Police.
Agree, it would be just too much of a coincidence that two Telstra IT workers were roaming the streets of Perth.....unless they were connected? But obviously that would have been looked into?
 
It looks like it is not even scheduled to be published for over 2 months (Late November 2020),
by which time sentencing will have likely been completed and any appeals already announced.

Which is obviously so that they can either pull, and rewrite the book.
And most importantly, complete it, or modify even the sections that were published as extracts of it yesterday and today in the West Australian Newspaper and it's Sunday version, (Sunday Times), Noting that Tim has revealed (in the West Podcast on Thursday) that it was the Editor of the West, who asked him to write the book, implying that it was not his idea to write this book, and leaving open the possibility that he is reluctantly writing it.

I wonder who is the copyright owner of the book, Tim Clarke or his employer (Seven Media/The West), and whether Seven Media/The West has a contract with Tim that gives them right of veto about anything in the book that they want included or excluded?

Thanks BFew, I did not realise the late release date, that certainly gives them plenty of time to rewrite/correct the book. Though if he is found not guilty of the 3 murders it will be one hell of a rewrite!!
 
gives them plenty of time to rewrite/correct the book. Though if he is found not guilty of the 3 murders it will be one hell of a rewrite!!
They can easily rename it to Enigma of What the DFark: The Claremont Killer(s) is still out there
 
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