QFA Div 2

[FAN THE MAN]

Depends on your definition.

Many of these players that Morningside, Sherwood, Zillmere and now Aspley and Redland might claim often had 1 or 2 years there, often even less.

I reckon Kenmore would match them all if you look at where kids start their footy, along with the likes of Wynnum and probably Sandgate and some sunny coast clubs. Look at curretn Aspley captain and former Gold Coast Sun Jackson Allan. Played at Kenmore, then Sherwood, then had 1 year at Morningside and got drafted. Followed a natural pathway from Div 2 to Div 1 to QAFL, but he's a Kenmore kid if we're fair dinkum.

If your boy got drafted, is he a Morningside product or a PArk Ridge product, or if he has a year at Redland or Aspley next year then gets drafted, he is a NEAFL product?

Guys like Voss and Keays they are genuine Panthers. How many on that list Zillmere have been putting up are actually Zillmere people? Jamie Charman for example, he is a Sandgate product - lets be honest. Dfuzer, Zac Smith, Morrison, Allan aren't really Zillmere people.

They still had their fair share though. Going back through the ages, would have to be Mayne and Western Districts who had the most genuine club people go on with it.

On sheer numbers, Southport - but like the others, many of them only spent 5 minutes there before getting drafted.

 

[LaggingBehind]

Depends on your definition.

Many of these players that Morningside, Sherwood, Zillmere and now Aspley and Redland might claim often had 1 or 2 years there, often even less.

I reckon Kenmore would match them all if you look at where kids start their footy, along with the likes of Wynnum and probably Sandgate and some sunny coast clubs. Look at curretn Aspley captain and former Gold Coast Sun Jackson Allan. Played at Kenmore, then Sherwood, then had 1 year at Morningside and got drafted. Followed a natural pathway from Div 2 to Div 1 to QAFL, but he's a Kenmore kid if we're fair dinkum.

If your boy got drafted, is he a Morningside product or a PArk Ridge product, or if he has a year at Redland or Aspley next year then gets drafted, he is a NEAFL product?

Guys like Voss and Keays they are genuine Panthers. How many on that list Zillmere have been putting up are actually Zillmere people? Jamie Charman for example, he is a Sandgate product - lets be honest. Dfuzer, Zac Smith, Morrison, Allan aren't really Zillmere people.

They still had their fair share though. Going back through the ages, would have to be Mayne and Western Districts who had the most genuine club people go on with it.

On sheer numbers, Southport - but like the others, many of them only spent 5 minutes there before getting drafted.

Fair points Fan and you're showing your age stating Western Districts and Mayne. The local AFL scene sure has changed.

Then another point of the argument is the pre & post Academies eras. Have the number of QLDers drafted increased? Not Academy bashing. They have their place. Just thinking out aloud

 

[Longy_Zillmere]

Depends on your definition.

Many of these players that Morningside, Sherwood, Zillmere and now Aspley and Redland might claim often had 1 or 2 years there, often even less.

I reckon Kenmore would match them all if you look at where kids start their footy, along with the likes of Wynnum and probably Sandgate and some sunny coast clubs. Look at curretn Aspley captain and former Gold Coast Sun Jackson Allan. Played at Kenmore, then Sherwood, then had 1 year at Morningside and got drafted. Followed a natural pathway from Div 2 to Div 1 to QAFL, but he's a Kenmore kid if we're fair dinkum.

If your boy got drafted, is he a Morningside product or a PArk Ridge product, or if he has a year at Redland or Aspley next year then gets drafted, he is a NEAFL product?

Guys like Voss and Keays they are genuine Panthers. How many on that list Zillmere have been putting up are actually Zillmere people? Jamie Charman for example, he is a Sandgate product - lets be honest. Dfuzer, Zac Smith, Morrison, Allan aren't really Zillmere people.

They still had their fair share though. Going back through the ages, would have to be Mayne and Western Districts who had the most genuine club people go on with it.

On sheer numbers, Southport - but like the others, many of them only spent 5 minutes there before getting drafted.

Junior clubs made them good footballers, Zillmere helped them become AFL players.

 

[FAN THE MAN]

I would argue that junior clubs developed them, they had talent they were born with and Zillmere were a stepping stone for them to become AFL footballers.

With the current system in place, kids will rarely ever get drafted from QAFL clubs, they will just be stepping stones. Look at young Colenso and Greene, they'd be kicking themselves. They should have moved 12 months earlier, had a year in the academy system and they'd be much better chance of getting picked up now. Not because they'd be any better, thats just the system we're in. I don't rate the academies at all, but obviously the recruiters do and those 2 in particular are better than 90% of the kids their age playing in the Lions/Suns academies that are a big chance of getting drafted, while neither of them have a hope this year.

 

[Still Me]

I would argue that junior clubs developed them, they had talent they were born with and Zillmere were a stepping stone for them to become AFL footballers.

With the current system in place, kids will rarely ever get drafted from QAFL clubs, they will just be stepping stones. Look at young Colenso and Greene, they'd be kicking themselves. They should have moved 12 months earlier, had a year in the academy system and they'd be much better chance of getting picked up now. Not because they'd be any better, thats just the system we're in. I don't rate the academies at all, but obviously the recruiters do and those 2 in particular are better than 90% of the kids their age playing in the Lions/Suns academies that are a big chance of getting drafted, while neither of them have a hope this year.

I hear what you are saying fan in regards to their junior clubs but I think they all play a part honestly. A good juniors coach is crucial along with getting the same at Community or QAFL Level.

Disagree with your comments regarding my young bloke and RG. I think the year of Div 2 footy defined them playing with the likes of Overington, Passfield, Rutledge boys and our Original Pirates boys Sulks, Chez and Bomber.

Had they gone to QAFL that year they weren’t ready. I think a year at 16 years of age in Div 2 is ideal. Then 17 into QAFL.

If they are good enough they will get drafted when they are ready.

 

[FAN THE MAN]

I'd love to know what great traits to make it as a professional AFL footballer they would learn from Tommy O and the Rutledge lads?

How to dominate 3 levels below where you should be? How to be lazy and uncommitted? Good players and probably reasonable blokes, but they're not teaching them professionalism in preparation, dedication to their craft or anything those boys would have been exposed to the year following.

Both lads would be well and truly on the draft radar if they had moved 12 months prior in my view. Now they have to wait a year and it could be too late.

A year of Div 2 at 16 is fine, provided they get exposed to the academies (sadly thats the system)

 

[Longy_Zillmere]

I would argue that junior clubs developed them, they had talent they were born with and Zillmere were a stepping stone for them to become AFL footballers.

With the current system in place, kids will rarely ever get drafted from QAFL clubs, they will just be stepping stones. Look at young Colenso and Greene, they'd be kicking themselves. They should have moved 12 months earlier, had a year in the academy system and they'd be much better chance of getting picked up now. Not because they'd be any better, thats just the system we're in. I don't rate the academies at all, but obviously the recruiters do and those 2 in particular are better than 90% of the kids their age playing in the Lions/Suns academies that are a big chance of getting drafted, while neither of them have a hope this year.

Ask any of the guys drafted their thoughts on their Zillmere experience and how crucial it was for their pathway.

 

[FAN THE MAN]

of course it was crucial, looks at the production line over a 10 year period.

At one point I know Kenmore, Sherwood, Jindalee and Mt grvatt started sending kids to Zillmere over Morningside for that reason, because it was a good breeding ground especially after the Western Districts/Sherwood merger died and there was no QAFL/State league club on that side of town.

I'm merely saying that many clubs can lay claim to a kids development and the definition would vary greatly on where a kid came from depending on their own bias.

 

[Longy_Zillmere]

of course it was crucial, looks at the production line over a 10 year period.

At one point I know Kenmore, Sherwood, Jindalee and Mt grvatt started sending kids to Zillmere over Morningside for that reason, because it was a good breeding ground especially after the Western Districts/Sherwood merger died and there was no QAFL/State league club on that side of town.

I'm merely saying that many clubs can lay claim to a kids development and the definition would vary greatly on where a kid came from depending on their own bias.

If junior clubs are doing all this excellent development you speak of, why has the draft numbers from QLD been so poor the last few years?

 

[smy1305]

Junior clubs made them good footballers, Zillmere helped them become AFL players.

Ask any of the guys drafted their thoughts on their Zillmere experience and how crucial it was for their pathway.

If junior clubs are doing all this excellent development you speak of, why has the draft numbers from QLD been so poor the last few years?

Not this year. Pretty solid actually with 4 already plus rookies to come. Certainly ahead of tassie over the past 10 years.

 

[LaggingBehind]

Not this year. Pretty solid actually with 4 already plus rookies to come. Certainly ahead of tassie over the past 10 years.

Coleman (37), Cumberland (43) & Martyn (44). Who is the 4th?

 

[smy1305]

Coleman (37), Cumberland (43) & Martyn (44). Who is the 4th?

Budarick was pre drafted I think to Suns.

 

[Thommo 42]

Budarick and another Townsville lad were pre-drafted to Suns, so thats 5.

Longy is right though, numbers are down. I think you'll find that relates to the academy system and the management of these players.

 

[smy1305]

Coleman (37), Cumberland (43) & Martyn (44). Who is the 4th?

Budarick

Budarick and another Townsville lad were pre-drafted to Suns, so thats 5.

Longy is right though, numbers are down. I think you'll find that relates to the academy system and the management of these players.

Plenty of different reasons Thommo but tbh think its a pretty easy target to blame academies. Could just as easily say QAFL clubs aren't playing 16/17yr olds enough in the quest for immediate success?? I don't know but when we are getting good numbers drafted and the accolades start flowing through to clubs for this then it is probably considerate to realise that clubs are part of the problem when numbers aren't great. I know Cumberland was playing senior footy at age 16 and starred in Roos 2018 premiership at 17.

 

[FAN THE MAN]

Because the 16/17 year olds that aren't already at a QAFL or NEAFL club are being held back by their junior clubs who selfishly encourage them to stay, rather than push them up the appropriate pathway.

 

[Monday Xspert]

Budarick and another Townsville lad were pre-drafted to Suns, so thats 5.

Longy is right though, numbers are down. I think you'll find that relates to the academy system and the management of these players.

Maybe with the numbers being down it shows how hard it is to be drafted. A lot of these kids have high expectations put on them.

 

[smy1305]

Maybe with the numbers being down it shows how hard it is to be drafted. A lot of these kids have high expectations put on them.

Agree - it shouldn't be a stroll in the park and in any case I don't think numbers are low - they were just artificially high with the Suns coming in and some relaxation around academy kids being drafted too. 4-5/year is a good assessment of where Qld footy sits imo. Tassie are terrible, NT an occasional one and the 3 main states have swings and roundabout years.

 

[smy1305]

Because the 16/17 year olds that aren't already at a QAFL or NEAFL club are being held back by their junior clubs who selfishly encourage them to stay, rather than push them up the appropriate pathway.

There isn't any 16yr olds at a NEAFL club. I'm not sure it matters wher they play at 16, QAFL or div 2 but they need to be exposed to senior players earlier rather than later if the body shape stacks up. When they are in 18th year you have to be with the Academy as a rule although there is a possibility you can still be picked up without doing so. You need to be playing NEAFL footy though bc they wont look at you otherwise I don't think.

 

[FAN THE MAN]

Didn't Ben Keays play NEAFL at 16?

 

[Lensen]

maybe the focus by clubs and their coaches and administrators who are there voluntarily is rightly on the hundreds of junior and senior players who are playing there and not on focussing their resources trying to get the elite couple of players into the AFL

 

[smy1305]

Didn't Ben Keays play NEAFL at 16?

No he might have as an U17 boy but I thought u were talking as a U16 year.

 

[smy1305]

maybe the focus by clubs and their coaches and administrators who are there voluntarily is rightly on the hundreds of junior and senior players who are playing there and not on focussing their resources trying to get the elite couple of players into the AFL

agree but not sure there is an expenditure attached to naming a kid in the seniors if decent.
it’s a balance agree and some kids expect one way traffic tbh.

 

[Thommo 42]

Can't help but think kids would be better off in a club environment most of the time, and we went back to picking a genuine QLD u18's side

The resources from AFLQ and the clubs and the families involved to be in these academies is exhorbitant for no measurable better return for anyone, especially the kids.

the drop out rate for kids in the academy who don't make it into the AFL or even NEAFL is incredible and its because they don't feel at home at a club as they bounce around all over the joint when they are in that crucial period between 16-18 forming social bonds and being part of a team.

We have blokes at our club who played in about 5 or 6 different teams in the space of 4 months this year, good luck enjoying being part of a team or building culture. Crazy

 

[outandabout]

Can't help but think kids would be better off in a club environment most of the time, and we went back to picking a genuine QLD u18's side

The resources from AFLQ and the clubs and the families involved to be in these academies is exhorbitant for no measurable better return for anyone, especially the kids.

the drop out rate for kids in the academy who don't make it into the AFL or even NEAFL is incredible and its because they don't feel at home at a club as they bounce around all over the joint when they are in that crucial period between 16-18 forming social bonds and being part of a team.

We have blokes at our club who played in about 5 or 6 different teams in the space of 4 months this year, good luck enjoying being part of a team or building culture. Crazy

Spot on.

 

[LaggingBehind]

Can't help but think kids would be better off in a club environment most of the time, and we went back to picking a genuine QLD u18's side

The resources from AFLQ and the clubs and the families involved to be in these academies is exhorbitant for no measurable better return for anyone, especially the kids.

the drop out rate for kids in the academy who don't make it into the AFL or even NEAFL is incredible and its because they don't feel at home at a club as they bounce around all over the joint when they are in that crucial period between 16-18 forming social bonds and being part of a team.

We have blokes at our club who played in about 5 or 6 different teams in the space of 4 months this year, good luck enjoying being part of a team or building culture. Crazy

The Academies have a place in the QLD AFL environment because we have a disadvantage to southern states. However some review of communication to club & players need attention. The premise that a player is an Academy player first and club player second....or third needs attention and if they take 60 kids out of any age group they may need to be a little more honest about the chances of being drafted. The question is would Coleman, Cumberland, Buderick and Martyn have been drafted anyway whether we had Academies or not. As Thommo says wouldn't all 4 have made the state side anyway?