QAFL 2020

Remove this Banner Ad

LaggingBehind said:
I didn't read anywhere that SMY said they were easy to win.
However I agree with him that a club can mask its future prospects as being better than it actually is by holding its best players back in U16s and Colts to inflate those teams ladder positions when others support the notion that you're old enough if you're good enough.
The only reason an under-age coach holds a player back from promotion is purely for his own purposes
Click to expand...
Well how do coaches measure performance?

premierships and development but coaching performance is Mostly premierships.
 
Dusty Pup said:
Well how do coaches measure performance?

premierships and development but coaching performance is Mostly premierships.
Click to expand...
It is one part only. So if a coach starts with 3 good players but creates a further 3 or 4 do you think he is a lesser coach because that coach inherits 10 good players?
Am I a good coach because Usain Bolt signs with me and his time gets worse versus a coach who takes an average runner and takes a whole second off.
If winning is the main part of coaching then the recruiters are the great coaches
 
Last edited:

Log in to remove this ad.

Dusty Pup said:
Well how do coaches measure performance?

premierships and development but coaching performance is Mostly premierships.
Click to expand...
Not at junior level champ. Your job as coach is to prepare the players for the next age bracket. Premierships are a bonus are generally a bye product of good coaching. Its not a results based business at junior level but unfortunately as mentioned it is for some, and please tell me SMY that no one is having reunions for junior flags!
 
switchingplay said:
Not at junior level champ. Your job as coach is to prepare the players for the next age bracket. Premierships are a bonus are generally a bye product of good coaching. Its not a results based business at junior level but unfortunately as mentioned it is for some, and please tell me SMY that no one is having reunions for junior flags!
Click to expand...

An under 16’s coach could land 6 Suns Academy kids whom are class above the rest, their performed comes nothing from his coaching yet he gets the credit when they win every game and he doesn’t develop the other kids Cos he’s caught up in the glory the Academy kids bring.
The team wins the Granny and he is a good coach?
The runners up team has no Academy kids yet all the players improve during the season due that coach having good development skills yet he will be seen as the second best coach .

If they took finals away from junior comps then it would soon eliminate Glory coaches and the same applies with Reserves footy, too many reserve coaches are coaching for premierships and undermine the Senior coach and development .
 
switchingplay said:
Not at junior level champ. Your job as coach is to prepare the players for the next age bracket. Premierships are a bonus are generally a bye product of good coaching. Its not a results based business at junior level but unfortunately as mentioned it is for some, and please tell me SMY that no one is having reunions for junior flags!
Click to expand...

Yeah know of teams that do. Or have. Bit sad.
 
Dusty Pup said:
Well how do coaches measure performance?

premierships and development but coaching performance is Mostly premierships.
Click to expand...

At junior level engagement is a good indicator too. How many kids back up the following year and how many arrive. Plenty of measurable indicators but premierships isn’t one. You don’t have major control over the abilities of the group you start with.
 
smy1305 said:
At junior level engagement is a good indicator too. How many kids back up the following year and how many arrive. Plenty of measurable indicators but premierships isn’t one. You don’t have major control over the abilities of the group you start with.
Click to expand...
You wrapped ot perfectly in your last line SMY. Junior coaches have little control over the group they inherit. Any Junior coach who judges themselves predominately on premierships is in it for themselves
 
LaggingBehind said:
I can speak for Thommo here but Sherwoods attempt to create the hub and spoke was well designed through Western Magpies yet despised and worked against by some of the neighbouring clubs some of the time. Hence they're now back at their heritage name.
I wonder if the junior clubs were not called the senior club name if it would make any difference? I.e. along the lines of what Western Magpies had.....although I suppose I answered my own question above
Click to expand...

Yeah I don't think the Western Magpies ever really created an identity separate from Sherwood for other clubs in the Western Suburbs for various reasons. Relationships between clubs in the area seem improved in recent times from where they were quite a few years ago and I think there is generally better communication and cooperation between them. Sherwood and Kenmore have an agreement for colts this year for example which might be quite good for both clubs if it works as intended. I don't think working toward a very formal 'hub and spoke' model will ever be that productive as clubs have legitimate ambitions to develop players, build their club and have some success but the hub and spoke thing might be the natural outcome of having good relationships between clubs.
 
The name Western Magpies was forced on the club back in 1999 when Sherwood re-entered the competition as a standalone club after the failed merger with Wests (1991-1996). I think the name Northern Eagles was also forced on Zillmere at some point.

It made 'some' sense, as Western Districts no longer exists, but while Sherwood had been in the QAFL since 1983 - we had been made to move our home ground to Yeronga at one point and generally just bounced around all over the place due to the mismanagement of footy in QLD at the time.

However it couldn't work unless we were in the QAFL, and strangely in 2004 just as the club were starting to re-establish themselves at QAFL level, win games, attract sponsors, develop good local juniors etc - we were punted out of the QAFL (alongside Mayne) despite having finished 6th or 7th out of 12 for the 2 seasons prior. The HUB is no good unless the HUB is actually in the premier competition. As a result, all the local talent in the Western Suburbs (including heaps of our own Sherwood juniors, but also plenty of Kenmore and Jindalee talent) went off to play at Morningside and Mt Gravatt to play QAFL footy.

At the end of the day though, the club identity is important - particularly for the old boys who put the place on the map and they didn't identify with anything other than Sherwood. Umpires still called us Sherwood, we still sung the Sherwood song, 80% of our players were Sherwood juniors when we re-entered the QAFL and no other club had to be the Eastern Panthers or the Northern Gorilla's, so when I proposed returning to the traditional name to Dean Warren - he said he had no issue with it. We had tried with Mick Conlan 4 years earlier and he replied "if you want to stay in the QAFL, you need to stay as the Western Magpies" - this of course made no sense whatsoever, but you get used to that after a while!

Hub and spoke works, but only if the HUB actually has something to offer (like a higher level of footy, good coaching, talent pathway etc)
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

21George said:
Yeah I don't think the Western Magpies ever really created an identity separate from Sherwood for other clubs in the Western Suburbs for various reasons. Relationships between clubs in the area seem improved in recent times from where they were quite a few years ago
Click to expand...

If it red and looks like a bucket, its generally a red bucket. Hard to (and not sure why you'd want to) create a different identity playing at the same ground, wearing the same colours etc and 80% of the senior players are from the junior club.

Another issue for relationships around the time was that Sherwood were once a dominant junior club, winning flags for fun in every age group and there are stories of some blokes around my age and older who never lost a game from u8s to Colts. I don't see how this is good for anyone, so its good that its not like that anymore.

Last Div 1 junior flag we won was the 17s going undefeated in 2015 off the top of my head, so we don't dominate local junior footy like we used to, so that alone makes other clubs less 'anti-sherwood' more than just about anything else!
 
Thommo 42 said:
If it red and looks like a bucket, its generally a red bucket. Hard to (and not sure why you'd want to) create a different identity playing at the same ground, wearing the same colours etc and 80% of the senior players are from the junior club.

Another issue for relationships around the time was that Sherwood were once a dominant junior club, winning flags for fun in every age group and there are stories of some blokes around my age and older who never lost a game from u8s to Colts. I don't see how this is good for anyone, so its good that its not like that anymore.

Last Div 1 junior flag we won was the 17s going undefeated in 2015 off the top of my head, so we don't dominate local junior footy like we used to, so that alone makes other clubs less 'anti-sherwood' more than just about anything else!
Click to expand...

A fantastic book was written (wish I could remember the title now Thommo) about a guys experience in Qld footy. He played at Sherwood JAFC in the 60's. Unbelievably at the time was the largest junior football club in Australia!! In bloody Qld!!! I will try to hunt it down as it was a great read for any football nut, not just Qld people.
 
As I understand it, we were the biggest junior club in the country from about 1962 until 1980 or thereabouts.

The numbers they had were extraordinary.

They won 8 senior SQAFA flags in a row from 1975 to 1982, and that was with most of the best juniors leaving to play QAFL or VFL. Remarkable nursery at the time.

Gary Shaw tells the story that he never played in a loss in his life until he made his senior debut next door at Western Districts when he was 17. He felt like it was a death in the family, had no idea what it felt like until then!

There is a great club history book around that documents the amazing days of the 60s and 70s when it was a huge footy club, but also the centre of the social scene on a Saturday night in the Western suburbs, whether interested in footy or not.
 
Thommo 42 said:
As I understand it, we were the biggest junior club in the country from about 1962 until 1980 or thereabouts.

The numbers they had were extraordinary.

They won 8 senior SQAFA flags in a row from 1975 to 1982, and that was with most of the best juniors leaving to play QAFL or VFL. Remarkable nursery at the time.

Gary Shaw tells the story that he never played in a loss in his life until he made his senior debut next door at Western Districts when he was 17. He felt like it was a death in the family, had no idea what it felt like until then!

There is a great club history book around that documents the amazing days of the 60s and 70s when it was a huge footy club, but also the centre of the social scene on a Saturday night in the Western suburbs, whether interested in footy or not.
Click to expand...
So what happened ?
 
smy1305 said:
Need to read more Longy... :) If it was a Sandgate story you would be all over it... :)
Click to expand...
Great history.... you’ll never be a Palmy or a Broady of the QAFL though.

you get 2 B grade AFL players on your list that take all the money and fail with performance.

great culture.
 
Dusty Pup said:
Great history.... you’ll never be a Palmy or a Broady of the QAFL though.

you get 2 B grade AFL players on your list that take all the money and fail with performance.

great culture.
Click to expand...
Coming from a guy who thinks great culture leads with holding back gun young players so he can win an under-age premiership.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

G
QAFL 2024 season
27 28 29 30 31
Replies
756
Views
50K
smy1305
S
Thommo 42
QAFL 2023 Season
142 143 144 145 146
Replies
4K
Views
302K
LaggingBehind
L
R
One blokes QAFL footy season experience, documented. (2022)
2
Replies
45
Views
7K
Engimal v3
Engimal v3

Remove this Banner Ad

Back
Top