Mid East Israel declare war after Hamas attack II

[Gethelred]

Part I:

Mid East - Israel declare war after Hamas attack.

Breaking the law. 'International humanitarian law prohibits a siege of Gaza, UN human rights commissioner says From CNN's Eve Brennan Ravina Shamdasani speaks at the Palais des Nations in Geneva, Switzerland, on September 7, 2018. Ravina Shamdasani speaks at the Palais des Nations in...

www.bigfooty.com

Thread Rules:

Alright.

I recognise that this is a fraught topic for any number of you posting here. Some of you will have family in Israel or Palestine. Some of you will have connections to either side of the conflict. What you need to understand is that this site has rules governing posting standards and the appropriate way to talk to other posters, and you will abide by them.

How this interacts with this thread is that the following will result in your post being deleted, with a recurrence of the same behaviour resulting in (depending on severity) a threadban for a week and a day off:

• direct labelling of someone as anti-semitic or a terrorist sympathiser for posting that is merely critical of Israel's response over time. I appreciate that Israel has the right to defend themselves from violence, but that does not mean that Israel has carte blanche to attack disproportionately towards people under their care.
• deliberate goading or flippant responses, designed to get people reacting to your posting emotionally.
• abuse.
• attempts to turn this into a Left vs Right shitfight.
• If I see the word 'Nazi' in here, you had better be able to justify it in the post you're making and the comparison had better be apt. Godwin's law is in full effect for the purposes of this thread; if you refer to Nazis, you've lost whatever argument you're involved in.
• Any defense of Hamas' actions on the basis of justification. There's no justification for genocide, regardless of whether or not they have the power to do so.

Please recognise that this is a difficult time for all involved, and some level of sensitivity is absolutely required to permit discussion to flow. From time to time, mods will reach out to specific posters and do some welfare checks; we may even give posters who get a bit too involved some days off to give people some time to cool down. This is not a reflection on you as a poster, merely that this is an intense subject.

I get that this is a fairly intense topic about which opinion can diverge rather significantly. If you feel you cannot be respectful in your disagreement with another poster, it is frequently better to refuse to engage than it is to take up the call.

From this point, any poster who finds themselves directly insulting another poster will find themselves receiving a threadban and an infraction, with each subsequent reoccurance resulting in steadily more points added to your account.

If you accumulate enough points in a 12 month period you will lose privileges:

5 points - 1 week off.
10 points - 2 weeks off
15 points - 3 weeks off
20 points - Account banned.

It has also become apparent that this needs to be said: just because someone moderates a part of this forum that isn't on Int Pol or the SRP does not hold them to a different standard of posting than anyone else. All of us were posters first, and we are allowed to hold opinions on this and share them on this forum.

Treat each other with the respect each of you deserve.

Thanks all.

Play nicely, all.

 

[Boston tiger]

Perhaps look at the pattern if this one incident doesn't convince you.

Patterns. Do we have to go back to the Old Testament for this one?

 

[Ghost Patrol]

Patterns. Do we have to go back to the Old Testament for this one?

Well it is full of lies, death and destruction. Just like Israel's government.

Happy for you to make such comparisons.

 

[Chief]

Patterns. Do we have to go back to the Old Testament for this one?

Just the massive number of calls for genocide in Israeli media and politics.

 

[barreness]

Yep. An individual on live TV during a rant basically said continue with the bombing and shelling until these people start demanding that their leaders give back the hostages. Don’t be enjoying yourselves while you still have Israeli hostages basically.

I don’t know if that’s a “ call to genocide “. I’d imagine genocide would mean the other side has no means to stop the genocide. Hamas can stop the killing right now and so can Israel. Both have a choice.

Surely we can move on from the release the hostages stuff, could have done a hostage swap at any point, unless they're chilling in the tent camps then they're under the rubble.

Nice how Israeli propaganda is happy to use Hamas-run Gaza health ministry figures now that the civilian death toll hasn't moved in about three months, strange that they've continued the strikes the entire time, almost like there's no infrastructure left to count the dead

 

[barreness]

The IAEA is saying Iran is weeks away from having enough enriched Uranium to build a bomb, but the existence of a bomb would be speculative.

Iran's nuclear activities 'raises eyebrows' at IAEA – DW – 04/23/2024

Iran's enrichment of uranium and a lack of access to international monitors is fueling suspicions about its nuclear activities. The International Atomic Energy Agency said its committed to promoting dialogue with Tehran.

www.dw.com

Putting the amount of enriched Uranium together with a desperate Russia being partnered with Iran on multiple fronts, I think a nuclear Iran will happen sooner than many think.

Proven they have the delivery vehicle, the actual bomb isn't that complicated once you have the uranium.

underground test in the some distant Iranian mountain and they've got nuclear deterrence, weeks rather than months you'd think

 

[sr36]

The IAEA is saying Iran is weeks away from having enough enriched Uranium to build a bomb, but the existence of a bomb would be speculative.

Iran's nuclear activities 'raises eyebrows' at IAEA – DW – 04/23/2024

Iran's enrichment of uranium and a lack of access to international monitors is fueling suspicions about its nuclear activities. The International Atomic Energy Agency said its committed to promoting dialogue with Tehran.

www.dw.com

Putting the amount of enriched Uranium together with a desperate Russia being partnered with Iran on multiple fronts, I think a nuclear Iran will happen sooner than many think.

It's 1950s technology. Surely once they have enough enriched uranium they will have a bomb?

 

[Number37]

Yep. An individual on live TV during a rant basically said continue with the bombing and shelling until these people start demanding that their leaders give back the hostages. Don’t be enjoying yourselves while you still have Israeli hostages basically.

I don’t know if that’s a “ call to genocide “. I’d imagine genocide would mean the other side has no means to stop the genocide. Hamas can stop the killing right now and so can Israel. Both have a choice.

They don't have Israeli hostages.
That's just you making out ALL Palestinians conducted an attack on Zionism on October 7.
It's the Zionist way.
They lie about everything because that's the only way they know.
Without lies, they've got nothing.

 

[madmug]

did

but Hypersonic tech of Sino's and Russians has found its way to Tehran , and drone tech threshold can be achieved by Yemeni Houthi , MissileDefense has always been more bluff and bluster , ask someone at Rand and MiT , Persians have a distributed command&control deep underground , this stuff is back to cold war stalemate of mutual destruction

MAD requires both sides have Nukes. I think only one side has them.

 

[blackcat]

MAD requires both sides have Nukes. I think only one side has them.

indeed , but Tehran decentralized command control protected from above ground nukes , they get off 10k missiles and wipe Israel off map (i don't want that)

 

[madmug]

indeed , but Tehran decentralized command control protected from above ground nukes , they get off 10k missiles and wipe Israel off map (i don't want that)

10k conventional missiles of which most would be intercepted is not going to wipe anything off the map. Damage yes, but not irrevocable damage.

 

[blackcat]

10k conventional missiles of which most would be intercepted is not going to wipe anything off the map. Damage yes, but not irrevocable damage.

the interception was shown to be a farce a week back , latest numbers stand at 3billion ($USd) for the missiles they shot at drones and incoming ICBM/jdam/hsonic

Bibi will flirt w disaster if Israel attempts strike* on Iran/lebanon even w America's backing and Persia closes Hormuz Straits and YemeniHouthi challenge RedSea supply routes , the entire world will feel reverberation , and frankly there is not the money to keep supply expensive inefficacious starwars MissileInterceptsystem to Raytheon's dismay

#Eisenhower #MICCIMATTraymcgovern

 

[Saint]

Proven they have the delivery vehicle, the actual bomb isn't that complicated once you have the uranium.

underground test in the some distant Iranian mountain and they've got nuclear deterrence, weeks rather than months you'd think

I think the smart play (and one they might adopt) is that Russia smuggles in "here's one we made earlier", they blow it up underground so everyone knows it went off and thinks Iran developed it and has more and Israel's aggression has to be taken down a few notches.

I'm more worried about Israel dropping a nuke on Iran, than Iran dropping one on Israel.

 

[Saint]

Did you watch all of it ?
They stipulated it was his opinion. He acknowledged it was an emotional rant and his blood was boiling . He framed it around the release of hostages.

SO there really is no depth to which some people will excuse?

What about the context of 17,000 dead children? Ranting like that because of hostages (mostly soldiers), but ignoring the deaths of 17,000 children who are the result of that kind of blood boiling.

His opinion is that they should commit genocide. That doesn't make it ok to air it, to ever have him on TV again, and for him not to stand trial at the Hague.

Here's a similar rant from a Rwandan Radio station during their genocide:


I suppose we should consider the context? Feel free to trawl through it and find some well-made points amongst the incitement to genocide.

Rwanda radio transcripts - Concordia University

Transcripts of radio broadcasts leading up to the Rwandan Genocide

www.concordia.ca

 

[Boston tiger]

SO there really is no depth to which some people will excuse?

What about the context of 17,000 dead children? Ranting like that because of hostages (mostly soldiers), but ignoring the deaths of 17,000 children who are the result of that kind of blood boiling.

His opinion is that they should commit genocide. That doesn't make it ok to air it, to ever have him on TV again, and for him not to stand trial at the Hague.

Here's a similar rant from a Rwandan Radio station during their genocide:
View attachment 1971140

I suppose we should consider the context? Feel free to trawl through it and find some well-made points amongst the incitement to genocide.

Rwanda radio transcripts - Concordia University

Transcripts of radio broadcasts leading up to the Rwandan Genocide

www.concordia.ca

It should be shown to all Hamas and Hamas civilians.
If a flamboyant Israeli tv personality is that emotional about the hostages then it will reinforce the message which is fight and die or surrender and live. Because Israel are not mucking around. The way I read it is they have had 75 years of this and it’s finished. Simple as that. Surrender and live. It’s how wars end . The more Hamas and civilians realise this the more lives will be saved.

In your efforts to openly express your rage against humanity , might be making you feel better and cope with the lunacy of war … it is not helping at all. Stop indirectly supporting Hamas …it’s making it worse.

We have people as we speak been arrested because they think terrorism is a viable option.

 

[Saint]

It should be shown to all Hamas and Hamas civilians.
If a flamboyant Israeli tv personality is that emotional about the hostages then it will reinforce the message which is fight and die or surrender and live. Because Israel are not mucking around. The way I read it is they have had 75 years of this and it’s finished. Simple as that. Surrender and live. It’s how wars end . The more Hamas and civilians realise this the more lives will be saved.

In your efforts to openly express your rage against humanity , might be making you feel better and cope with the lunacy of war … it is not helping at all. Stop indirectly supporting Hamas …it’s making it worse.

We have people as we speak been arrested because they think terrorism is a viable option.

The blanket ban on being critical of Israel is not helping solve anything. Calling criticism of Israel "indirectly supporting Hamas" or "anti-semitism" undermines any legitimate defence of Israel's behaviour.

After October 7th, I agreed with Israel that Hamas needed to be removed. The way Israel went about it makes me agree with Hamas that the Israeli Govt wants to kill them all and is completely against the existence of a Palestinian state ever. It is a pretty basic and easy position to hold that both of them have the intent to create an ethno-state across all of Palestine and Israel combined and don't tolerate the other basically existing.

If you showed that footage to Palestinians, it would reinforce what they already think, that Israeli leaders and society sees them all as terrorists and won't rest until they're all dead or gone. That they're not seen as innocent.

They wouldn't see this as a reaction to Hamas' attack, they'd see it as the shroud of genocidal intent being dropped.

 

[Chief]

Hamas civilians

What is a Hamas civilian?

 

[Ghost Patrol]

It should be shown to all Hamas and Hamas civilians.
If a flamboyant Israeli tv personality is that emotional about the hostages then it will reinforce the message which is fight and die or surrender and live. Because Israel are not mucking around. The way I read it is they have had 75 years of this and it’s finished. Simple as that. Surrender and live. It’s how wars end . The more Hamas and civilians realise this the more lives will be saved.

In your efforts to openly express your rage against humanity , might be making you feel better and cope with the lunacy of war … it is not helping at all. Stop indirectly supporting Hamas …it’s making it worse.

We have people as we speak been arrested because they think terrorism is a viable option.

We also have a zionist in Sydney that planted a bomb recently, but for some weird reason didn’t get charged with terrorism.

Why do you think that is?

 

[Ghost Patrol]

Meanwhile, back at Columbia University

 

[sr36]

What is a Hamas civilian?

There are actually a lot of Hamas civilians - it was a local government with a military wing.

 

[Chief]

There are actually a lot of Hamas civilians - it was a local government with a military wing.

OK Hamas government.

 

[faible]

they have had 75 years of this

You do realise they’re called the Occupied Palestinian Territories yes?

Funny how you keep ignoring the genocide Israel is doing and try to pretend they’re the good guys.

I’m sure you’d have been pro-Hitler with that logic - he’s had enough and he’s serious now guys.

 

[Number37]

It should be shown to all Hamas and Hamas civilians.
If a flamboyant Israeli tv personality is that emotional about the hostages then it will reinforce the message which is fight and die or surrender and live. Because Israel are not mucking around. The way I read it is they have had 75 years of this and it’s finished. Simple as that. Surrender and live. It’s how wars end . The more Hamas and civilians realise this the more lives will be saved.

In your efforts to openly express your rage against humanity , might be making you feel better and cope with the lunacy of war … it is not helping at all. Stop indirectly supporting Hamas …it’s making it worse.

We have people as we speak been arrested because they think terrorism is a viable option.

More Zionist lies.
This isn't about Hamas or hostages.
This is about Zionists stealing land.

 

[Not Important]

what an outstanding loving, caring human being.

 

[Not Important]

if there’s one good thing that comes from israel’s unconscionable terrorism it’s the exposure of their well-organised treacherous, unelected, propaganda disinformation machine. next step- dismantle/disempower it.



the word ‘peace’ isn’t in the Israeli government’s lexicon.

 

[Not Important]

in a sense doing what israel failed to do is a reason for joy. however, the fact is the administration is rotten to the core and we are likely to get another no-conscience criminal to replace him the answer is to isolate them militarily, economically, and commercially.