Coach So you want Voss gone? Who will replace him and why would they want to coach Carlton?

[jpfalvo]

Well said.

I've also been saying for years now that I hate that we concede the ball to the wing easily because we're getting numbers behind the ball. It doesn't work. The way the game is played these days you have to pressure the ball carrier and not allow easy field position.

Doesn't matter how many times you get the wrong coach.. once you realise he's the wrong guy you have to move him on rather than stubbornly keep them for the sake of stability. We don't want to end up in a situation like Port with Hinkley where he held on so long when he kept failing in the same way over and over and has a history of showing he can't get the job done in finals.

Our coach said it in the press conference tonight.. 'I wish I had the answer to that' followed up with 'I'll have to check the numbers and stats'. Does that instill faith that Voss has this situation under control? It can't keep being about needing to be better around the contest (which he said again tonight) and taking our chances. You need to find ways to win even if you're kicking poorly. The good teams and good coaches find a way.

Hinkley keeps coming up, even as a potential replacement.

Voss spent 10years at Port, and under Hinkley for a while.

We need fresh modern ideas

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[jpfalvo]

You can get away with a head coach that is not the best tactically if you put a good team around him. I just don't think our assistants have shown enough tactical nous.

And yet after years and years in the system,
And also previously being sacked...

You would think Voss would demand better, demand change to fill his deficiencies

Personally i see a combination of hubris and complacency. Particularly with Sayers and Cook era preaching stability over performance

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[DangerousD]

Give me Kouta. Couldn't care less about credentials. Get some up and coming assistants. Make it carlton.

Couldn’t care less about credentials should never be uttered when choosing a coach.

Kouta has never been involved in coaching

If you can’t remember, our current coach was one of the biggest on field animals there has been, it doesn’t count for much

 

[DangerousD]

Hinkley keeps coming up, even as a potential replacement.

Voss spent 10years at Port, and under Hinkley for a while.

We need fresh modern ideas

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A new coach brings fresh ideas, you just need to decide if they’re a good coach.

Hinkley to me isn’t that.

If you mentioned Longmire then that’s different, him with a fresh assistant group would be fantastic.

 

[DangerousD]

I think you guys are kind of missing the point. The problem is not Voss, the problem is the club as a whole. We have no idea how to pick a coach. We sack him, we will end up picking the wrong coach again. We do not understand the modern game as a club at all, we don't know what to look for in a coach.

After the pies won the flag, the was a very good article on why Collingwood picked MacRae. It was down to MacRae and Voss and when it was time to explain intended game plan they felt Voss was at a bit of a loss, where as they knew MacRae understood what needed to be done.

He took a team that was predicted to struggle for years, implement a modern game plan, won a flag, struggled last year and now seems up and running again with a very old team. That's game plan.

The club ran a really good process when they picked Bolton, some of the qualities that made him good also were his undoing and the club failed to support him.

The next two selection processes were an absolute joke and showed a crap organisation who were petrified of making another mistake.

 

[Gointocarlton]

A new coach brings fresh ideas, you just need to decide if they’re a good coach.

Hinkley to me isn’t that.

If you mentioned Longmire then that’s different, him with a fresh assistant group would be fantastic.

I reckon both those guys will end up in Tassie in some capacity.

 

[DangerousD]

Yep. Voss needs to go, along with Haynes, Doc, Williams, McGovern, Acres, Newman.

I’d also test the market with McKay, Walsh, Saad, and Hollands.

TDK is 100% out the door, and who could blame him.

A hard reset is required.

If Voss is the issue, why would we need such a clean out?

 

[DangerousD]

Interesting so many comments are on Voss gameplan being outdated. On the selection committee that chose him we had no player or coach who had been involved in the game in the last 20 years.

Wonder if theres a link there and a gap in the process?

The selection committee that chose him also said, we want someone who’s coached before.

So straight away they got rid of about 60% of the available candidates

Joke

 

[DangerousD]

I reckon both those guys will end up in Tassie in some capacity.

Hmmm not sure, a coach driven by success I doubt would go, it’s a few years to wait only to be crap is 3 years.

I’m also worried they won’t happen

 

[DangerousD]

So he can be the next saviour that gets scapegoated by the club and fans if it doesn't work out? I'm sure he's licking his lips

He’s a good coach, that could be the reason

 

[DangerousD]

Yea i'm not as keen on Simpson and horse did say he isn't closing the door on coaching its just that he needed a break. If the right offer comes along just maybe might entice him.

Coaches shouldn’t spend that long at clubs in AFL, the Swans needed a fresh face and so did their players.

He was still at the top of his game when he walked away

 

[DangerousD]

Our club will be paralysed by fear this year with Voss, too scared of how things would look if they sacked another coach.

 

[myblueroan]

I think horse is done.

Adam Simpson !!!

The last thing we need is bland.
Very boring and would be another outdated style of footy. We need innovation.
He is not the answer as H.C.
Perhaps in a different role.

 

[myblueroan]

Hinkley keeps coming up, even as a potential replacement.

Voss spent 10years at Port, and under Hinkley for a while.

We need fresh modern ideas

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Absolutley!
No.
And for the same reason, no to Adam Simpson.
Or...just give us more of Q1 and less of Q 3 and 4.

 

[JJBagger]

Our club will be paralysed by fear this year with Voss, too scared of how things would look if they sacked another coach.

Suddenly they will develop a conscience about sacking a coach? Had no issues with it for the last couple of decades

 

[myblueroan]

A

Our club will be paralysed by fear this year with Voss, too scared of how things would look if they sacked another coach.

Agree.
But we can't go on like this surely?

Weekend footy joy has become a very rare event.

However, due to disasters like Walsh -serious talent gone backwards...( same happened with Gibbsy and Walsh) we have a failure to thrive issue at the club.
Development
Worst line coaches in league?
Player durability - aka recruitment

So much wrong for so long...Cook is there - Wright is there.
Has anyone seen hope? A way forward?
Will chucking Voss be the answer?
It's a lot worse than just Voss.
An ongoing diasaster of a club.
It really is. But it is our club.

Supporting Carlton has to be more than 90 % pain and misery. Surely?


Chicken Little thread? Move it if it's too bleak.

 

[myblueroan]

Let's get the Carazzo Triplets to coach!

And Andy Walker's Hat for forwards coach.

 

[BlueVision]

What does raise a major flag for me with Voss is that we lack composure. Voss touched on it post game.

This core group has been together for a number of years with Voss & to lack composure with this list profile is a complete failure from our coaching staff.

 

[AlphaBlue]

What does raise a major flag for me with Voss is that we lack composure. Voss touched on it post game.

This core group has been together for a number of years with Voss & to lack composure with this list profile is a complete failure from our coaching staff.

I agree. Lack of composure is fine if you are a rebuilding team with young players. A team pushing for going far in finals on the other hand should absolutely have composure at this point in time.

 

[jj1978]

And yet after years and years in the system,
And also previously being sacked...

You would think Voss would demand better, demand change to fill his deficiencies

Personally i see a combination of hubris and complacency. Particularly with Sayers and Cook era preaching stability over performance

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And lack of performance brings instability. Sayers was a prick flopping used car salesman.

Fact is club will be too scared to sack Voss to avoid ridicule of another failed selection.

 

[COBALT BLUE]

I fear a lot of people are misreading rh question title here, still.

It's not 'who do you WANT to replace him'. It is 'who WILL and why would they want to coach Carlton?'.

Last time we went this path the field was dry. Ross Lyon dropped out. Voss was pretty much the only interested party.

And why would anyone want to coach this team, right now. The fan base is horrible. iMO the atmosphere at games has been bad - very low engagement and actual supporting - even 7 goals up Vs Richmond is was polite clapping and low engagement. Booing umpires and former players (Liam Jones and even Kennedy last night? sheesh...). When Young was lining up for goal on the boundary you could see 'supporters' behind him covering their eyes, bagging him, etc on the big screen (he kicked it). 'Supporter' hanging over the player race trashing players. Off field is even worse. TalkBack radio is always bad but Carlton are becoming a meme for it after losses. Our social media is flooded with the absolute worst. The response to McKay stepping aside this was was ghastly. Who wants to coach that? Two losses and the crowd size last night was very ordinary. Compare with Collingwood right now. When they are winning, the crowd atmosphere right up to the 'Collingwood' chant is fantastic When they are losing they get right behind the team at the slightest change and you can feel the air ignite. Let's face it - we are the ferals at this point, and everyone knows it.

The team and list is also totally unappealing. Bad mix of overpaid players the wrong side of 28 and underqualified role players. No first or second round pick in the offseason. No cap space. A whole bunch of players requiring 'restoration' for a bunch of reasons (McKay, Hollands, Newman, Smith, Docherty, etc). Who wants to start with that?

And the offfield group also isn't great. We had a President who was a corporate crook have to step down for sexual harassment. Our new President lives in Sydney. Cook is leaving. We have churned through high performance managers and still have horrible injury and fitness woes. There are serious questions to be asked about our recruiting team after a howler of an offseason (not just the individual decisions made, but the sheer incoherence of trading away both future first and second draft picks AND trading out a heao of depth, leaving us very vulnerable to injury/form collapse). That isn't appealing either

Voss still has the best winning record of any Carlton coach this century. He could lose 4 more in a row and still hold that title. He is going to be sacked while still in that position? The guy who is second in the list got sacked after going 11-11 in an injury riddled year after 3 straight finals appearances. We didn't win 11 games in a season for 10 years after that masterstroke... Voss's predecessor had two years after getting the job - both COVID disrupted (unable to even train the team in hist first year), with Charlie Curnow injured for 42 of the 44 matches in that time frame, and was sacked despite it all. Voss has had 3 years, a winning record each year, two finals series, our only preliminary final this century... Now everyone wants him gone too.

Be careful what you wish for, basically. Scapegoating Voss will give us, at best, a new coach who is well aware of who we are, what our off field state is, ans who will have to take steps to guarantee some longevity. Most likely that means yet another deep and serious rebuild. How else to you start your career knowing the gulf between expectation and reality is so huge, that the second you fall behind 'expectations' you'll have ferals calling for your head and screaming obscenities at the players you are trying to lead? Better to clean the decks, drop expectations as low as possible a la Richmond this year... Can't fail if everyone expects a wooden spoon...

Agreed,no quick fixes
Our list has accumulated after almost total collapse......played bad vfl grade a while...was much worse than this
I still see an issue with our group not working hard ironically we had a crack last night against a very even team.
I dont think a new coach or levelling club setups will change much....for two reasons
Wont get better replacements
Plus the actual playing group won't execute the job properly.....carlton have been a soft team now for a long time

Voss looks stale..he trains his group hard but doesn't get rewards...its a rare gift...he doesn't have it....plus really our list isn't that good..its not deep...our reserve team is weak....

I think we need to knuckle down....and reinvent successes of 2023 etc.....was pretty good
If you level everything will just be even more disastrous
Clubs like Lions were also a mess for a long time but they always fought hard...today Carlton doesn't do that something has gone amiss nothing will fix it.....thats why

Fans need to be aware there will never be a quick fix if its not right

 

[2blue4u]

Our club will be paralysed by fear this year with Voss, too scared of how things would look if they sacked another coach.

Agreed. I am in the camp of sack anybody or everybody. We don't have time to be messing around. I'm tired of it. If we have to sack another coach to become a good team then do it. I don't care about image to outsiders. They all go quiet anyway when things start working out and their opnion changes daily.

 

[King Cripps]

Is Luke Beveridge contracted to the Dogs next year?
If I had a choice between Hinkley, Longmire, Simpson or Beveridge it would be Bevo for me

 

[btdg]

Agreed. I am in the camp of sack anybody or everybody. We don't have time to be messing around. I'm tired of it. If we have to sack another coach to become a good team then do it. I don't care about image to outsiders. They all go quiet anyway when things start working out and their opnion changes daily.

It's not about image, it is about reality.

Sack everyone and then do what? Let Cripps player coach? Just not bother with assistants?

'if we have to sack another coach to become a good team' sounds eerily familiar to 'The beatings will continue until morale improves'.

Maybe Voss isn't the Messiah. I am actually ok with that. We don't need a messiah. Voss still has the best record of any Carlton coach this century, and one thing I know for certain is that if there is a really smart, insightful, thoughtful coach out there they will be watching us very closely to see how we handle this situation. If I were the coaching messiah, I'd be watching everything Carlton supporters are doing right now and putting a big red line through the club. Why try to live up to the impossible expectations of what is right now the worst fan base in Australian sport, instead of waiting for Chris Scott to finish up at Geelong, or Beverage at the Bulldogs or any one of the 5-6 more appealing coaching jobs that will come up in the next few years. Across the past two decades coaching Carlton has been career suicide, as Teague found out and Voss is probably learning, as Malthouse and Pagan and Brittain and even Barker found out before. We should be on our knees grateful to Voss for having the balls to take on all of this and giving us even a few moments of joy.

If we want a better coach than Voss, we need to become a club that better coaches want to join. If we want our assistants and development and high performance coaches to do better we have to become a club that supports and helps people to do better, not turns on them in a blink of an eye and demands their sacking because the team lost a couple of early season games.

 

[Numero 31]

If Voss is the issue, why would we need such a clean out?

We have multiple issues, coaching, recruitment and with some players on the list that need to be delisted and traded. We are a mediocre side with a sprinkling of a few stars, a below par coaching group which plays an outdated and a physically taxing style of football for 2025. A real inability for in game changes is our hallmark.

Also, how Brad Lloyd is still around boggles my mind.

Having said all that, the core of this list is quality and put in the right hands with some savvy recruiting and being a flag contender is actually quite realistic.

Do I have confidence this will be done ... no ... but ... we do have Graham Wright as new incoming CEO and Priestley as a new President. Triggers need to be pulled otherwise we we will go further backwards. A mini rebuild is required.