Review Round 14, 2024 - Brisbane Lions vs. St. Kilda

Who were your five best players against St. Kilda?


  • Total voters
    129
  • Poll closed .

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Bailey, Ah Chee & Cameron grossly out of form.

Need to find a way to get them into the game
I thought Bailey had an ankle operation about 6 weeks ago. Maybe he has come back too early. Might take a little more time. It was only a few weeks ago Ah Chee kicked four goals, agree about Charlie his set shot kicking has been a concern for most of the year. There are a couple out of bound shots (for the year), that probably are not even recorded but indicated he has struggled this year with accuracy
 
I thought Bailey had an ankle operation about 6 weeks ago. Maybe he has come back too early. Might take a little more time. It was only a few weeks ago Ah Chee kicked four goals, agree about Charlie his set shot kicking has been a concern for most of the year. There are a couple out of bound shots (for the year), that probably are not even recorded but indicated he has struggled this year with accuracy
Ah Chee is the biggest enigma,he plays a good game about every 5 or 6 weeks and in between he is barely sighted. And he often only plays a decent quarter and disappears again. He has great talent and at his best is a match winner, but needs to become more consistent to really become a regular player. Otherwise he will always be only the 22nd or 23rd player selected each week rather than a constant pick.
 

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Ah Chee is the biggest enigma,he plays a good game about every 5 or 6 weeks and in between he is barely sighted. And he often only plays a decent quarter and disappears again. He has great talent and at his best is a match winner, but needs to become more consistent to really become a regular player. Otherwise he will always be only the 22nd or 23rd player selected each week rather than a constant pick.

I don't think it's a coincidence that our three half forwards go in and out of games to be honest. It is a trademark of the position they are playing.
 
Coaches votes

9
Joe Daniher (BL)
7
Hugh McCluggage (BL)
5
Dayne Zorko (BL)
5
Jack Higgins (STK)
4
Jarrod Berry (BL)

Interesting votes combo by my calculations
Berry 3-1
Higgins 3-2
Zorko 4-1
Hugh 5-2
Joe 5-4

So a consensus best five players but different scoring wise
 
The Good

Wilmot - just belongs

Morris - so much poise

Zorko - seriously is his season any worse than kiddy’s last year?

Joe - sticky mits, mostly an accurate foot. Thought he was really desperate in the ruck late too. Seems to go in harder in that role now.

Rayner’s last quarter - seemed to get 3 centre clearances in a row? Or was i going mad?

Berry in the midfield - he is getting better every week. Disposal under pressure seems to be improving with more time in there. Awesome little handball in the last was quite deft. I just don’t think we can reduce his minutes at all atm, he’s crucial

Lessons - at least after all those lapses we won’t be complacent next week

The Bad

Mids over committing - we just kept letting them get out the back. Over confidence?

Mids getting belted early - umps were letting windwhatever get away with a lot, but we didn’t adjust well at all. Spent all week preparing for it apparently. I reckon next time we assume a massive clamp is on neale we start him at half forward for 10 minutes

Backline panicking / being loose - how did they have so much space? Needed to adjust as it wasn’t 5m they were getting, it was 20m

The Ugly

Fits and spurts. All year. So frustrating. What is going on with the group? We lose concentration and confidence within minutes

Umps on dangerous tackles - wow

Channel 7 comms generally - but especially the ‘oh what a technical 50m against windhager’. The bloke jumped in sideways on the mark at least 5m too far. Totally blatant 50m
If ever a game needed to be broken up into "good", "bad" and "ugly" it was this one!

By the way I have finally figured out how to re-watch these games where we win but in a very frustrating manner. 4th quarter first, then 2nd quarter, then 3rd quarter then the 1st. Greatly enhanced user experience.

To be honest I really only rewatched because I saw Froggy was named in SEN's team of the week, which seemed a bit, well, generous, and I thought I must have been watching a different game. After the replay I stand by my original conviction 😂 Maybe the fact there were only 6 games gave the selectors a shallower pool to pick from.

Team defence pretty average obviously. Minimal pressure from the forwards, poor transition efforts by the midfield and very ordinary one on one efforts by our defenders.

I'm always a big one for questioning our fitness, but watching the replay it really did look like it was as much complacency and mentally taking the foot off as anything. Combining this perspective with my recollection of the game live at the ground, it's becoming a pretty standard sort of pattern tho... First we stop moving for each other, standing around like Brown's cows instead. So we're forced long down the line to contests. Then we lose those and nobody can be bothered going back the other way with our opponents, so we get opened up on the rebound.

THEN things start getting a bit desperate, so blokes start panicking a bit and thinking "I'm gonna be the one to turn the game around here", get sucked into the ball in the contest which leaves all their numbers on the outside. Happened against Carlton and happened again on Friday night.

A better mental attitude is "I'm gonna be the one to keep things simple, absolutely nail my role right here, and THEN, if it's practical, I'm going to get over and support my team mate".

Fortunately we've actually been able to improve our forward method since the early rounds, so we were still able to score while we were under the pump, and in the end that was the difference. That will likely prove more difficult though against top 8 teams.

You would like to think we will really go to town on our defence this week, but it's pretty concerning that we're only 2 games into what is going to have to be a fairly solid 12 week stretch, and already it appears like our motivation is flagging. Getting involved in shootouts is often an early sign of this. When that happens it can mean you're only one game away from being completely opened up while not being able to score yourself.

Liked seeing Rayner's 3 consecutive centre clearances in the last quarter. Only to butcher it every time! 🤦

Payne some very soft efforts opposed to King. And I think my thoughts on McKenna are shared by enough here to need little elaboration. 7 disposals in 3 quarters is inadequate for a player as poor defensively as he is.

Liked the performances of Zorko, Hugh, Wilmot, Bez, Dunks, Joe, Lach, Eric, Kai, Loges and Oscar. We will need more to come with them in the coming weeks.

For those of us in the right demographic, you might remember this rather similar game.
 
It just adds up a certain number of points for a disposal, mark, etc. No accounting for effectiveness or effort.
I think they do subtract points for clangers and free kicks against etc.

The Champion Data player rating points generally provide a more accurate assessment of a player's impact on a game.
 
At the game I noticed it on one occasion. Might have been late in the third.
I noticed this too. We had Ah Chee as a spare in and around Max King and co. I had a look down the other end at the same time and couldn't see a spare for St Kilda, so I reckon they had their spare around the ball. This might go some way to explaining why they were so dominant at winning clearances.
 
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What was up with Country Roads tonight? Seemed to be a verse and chorus shorter than usual. Hope they haven’t changed it for good
They played the end bit rather than the middle bit. Maybe they don't like us all singing while the game has already started again.
 

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If ever a game needed to be broken up into "good", "bad" and "ugly" it was this one!

By the way I have finally figured out how to re-watch these games where we win but in a very frustrating manner. 4th quarter first, then 2nd quarter, then 3rd quarter then the 1st. Greatly enhanced user experience.

To be honest I really only rewatched because I saw Froggy was named in SEN's team of the week, which seemed a bit, well, generous, and I thought I must have been watching a different game. After the replay I stand by my original conviction 😂 Maybe the fact there were only 6 games gave the selectors a shallower pool to pick from.

Team defence pretty average obviously. Minimal pressure from the forwards, poor transition efforts by the midfield and very ordinary one on one efforts by our defenders.

I'm always a big one for questioning our fitness, but watching the replay it really did look like it was as much complacency and mentally taking the foot off as anything. Combining this perspective with my recollection of the game live at the ground, it's becoming a pretty standard sort of pattern tho... First we stop moving for each other, standing around like Brown's cows instead. So we're forced long down the line to contests. Then we lose those and nobody can be bothered going back the other way with our opponents, so we get opened up on the rebound.

THEN things start getting a bit desperate, so blokes start panicking a bit and thinking "I'm gonna be the one to turn the game around here", get sucked into the ball in the contest which leaves all their numbers on the outside. Happened against Carlton and happened again on Friday night.


A better mental attitude is "I'm gonna be the one to keep things simple, absolutely nail my role right here, and THEN, if it'sI practical, I'm going to get over and support my team mate".

Fortunately we've actually been able to improve our forward method since the early rounds, so we were still able to score while we were under the pump, and in the end that was the difference. That will likely prove more difficult though against top 8 teams.

You would like to think we will really go to town on our defence this week, but it's pretty concerning that we're only 2 games into what is going to have to be a fairly solid 12 week stretch, and already it appears like our motivation is flagging. Getting involved in shootouts is often an early sign of this. When that happens it can mean you're only one game away from being completely opened up while not being able to score yourself.

Liked seeing Rayner's 3 consecutive centre clearances in the last quarter. Only to butcher it every time! 🤦

Payne some very soft efforts opposed to King. And I think my thoughts on McKenna are shared by enough here to need little elaboration. 7 disposals in 3 quarters is inadequate for a player as poor defensively as he is.

Liked the performances of Zorko, Hugh, Wilmot, Bez, Dunks, Joe, Lach, Eric, Kai, Loges and Oscar. We will need more to come with them in the coming weeks.

For those of us in the right demographic, you might remember this rather similar game.
The bolded for me is a better explanation than my fits and spurts albeit the same thing.

Sadly i think it took that 50m penalty and goal to shake us from our slumber, and we managed to kick goals after that because it was a depleted st kilda on the road.

In the cold light of day, being 37 up against saints without some key players and them on the road, then them getting with 7 points, is a very poor performance.

It doesn't mean we will lose this week, but it does mean that despite a great game against the dogs we are not in great form. A better opponent or an away match and we would have lost.

Anyway i do HOPE we win, just hating the expectation building in the media because somehow it always seeps through to my subconscious!
 
This is completely at odds with my perception of Darcy as a bloke who gets it, runs off with it, then bangs it long as far as he can, somewhat indiscriminately.

With that in mind however, it's important to note that an effective kick according to Champion Data includes "A kick of more than 40 metres to a 50/50 contest or better for the team."
 
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The bolded for me is a better explanation than my fits and spurts albeit the same thing.

Sadly i think it took that 50m penalty and goal to shake us from our slumber, and we managed to kick goals after that because it was a depleted st kilda on the road.

In the cold light of day, being 37 up against saints without some key players and them on the road, then them getting with 7 points, is a very poor performance.

It doesn't mean we will lose this week, but it does mean that despite a great game against the dogs we are not in great form. A better opponent or an away match and we would have lost.

Anyway i do HOPE we win, just hating the expectation building in the media because somehow it always seeps through to my subconscious!
Yep the fading in and out of games in 2024 is a huge concern, v the Bulldogs is the only 4 quarter performance against a decent side all season.

Will need it again against the Power away to win and be officially on a roll and the lid unscrewing.
 
Payne was poor tonight and since the ankle injury last year plays so so little aggression.

For a guy his size he gets bumped far too easily and just lacks effort at times

If ever a game needed to be broken up into "good", "bad" and "ugly" it was this one!

By the way I have finally figured out how to re-watch these games where we win but in a very frustrating manner. 4th quarter first, then 2nd quarter, then 3rd quarter then the 1st. Greatly enhanced user experience.

To be honest I really only rewatched because I saw Froggy was named in SEN's team of the week, which seemed a bit, well, generous, and I thought I must have been watching a different game. After the replay I stand by my original conviction 😂 Maybe the fact there were only 6 games gave the selectors a shallower pool to pick from.

Team defence pretty average obviously. Minimal pressure from the forwards, poor transition efforts by the midfield and very ordinary one on one efforts by our defenders.

I'm always a big one for questioning our fitness, but watching the replay it really did look like it was as much complacency and mentally taking the foot off as anything. Combining this perspective with my recollection of the game live at the ground, it's becoming a pretty standard sort of pattern tho... First we stop moving for each other, standing around like Brown's cows instead. So we're forced long down the line to contests. Then we lose those and nobody can be bothered going back the other way with our opponents, so we get opened up on the rebound.

THEN things start getting a bit desperate, so blokes start panicking a bit and thinking "I'm gonna be the one to turn the game around here", get sucked into the ball in the contest which leaves all their numbers on the outside. Happened against Carlton and happened again on Friday night.

A better mental attitude is "I'm gonna be the one to keep things simple, absolutely nail my role right here, and THEN, if it's practical, I'm going to get over and support my team mate".

Fortunately we've actually been able to improve our forward method since the early rounds, so we were still able to score while we were under the pump, and in the end that was the difference. That will likely prove more difficult though against top 8 teams.

You would like to think we will really go to town on our defence this week, but it's pretty concerning that we're only 2 games into what is going to have to be a fairly solid 12 week stretch, and already it appears like our motivation is flagging. Getting involved in shootouts is often an early sign of this. When that happens it can mean you're only one game away from being completely opened up while not being able to score yourself.

Liked seeing Rayner's 3 consecutive centre clearances in the last quarter. Only to butcher it every time! 🤦

Payne some very soft efforts opposed to King. And I think my thoughts on McKenna are shared by enough here to need little elaboration. 7 disposals in 3 quarters is inadequate for a player as poor defensively as he is.

Liked the performances of Zorko, Hugh, Wilmot, Bez, Dunks, Joe, Lach, Eric, Kai, Loges and Oscar. We will need more to come with them in the coming weeks.

For those of us in the right demographic, you might remember this rather similar game.
Kings first goal, Payne was in the goal square marking a saints player (i think Cordy), Harris just could not run with King. Agree, Kings second goal was Paynes fault, just too slow to react when pushed by King and looked a bit soft.

A Key forward spearhead kicking two goals on Payne, in a high scoring game, I take that every day of the week. Reckon Jones who was marking Hippy a couple of weeks ago, would take 2 goals instead of the 6.

Higgins with 5, and to a lesser extent Owens and Butler had some influence on the score board.

My best in no particular order; Morris although gave away a penalty in the defensive 50, kicked a vital goal to halt the saints momentum in the 4th Q. I liked Berry's game, Hugh had some very pivotal moments, Cam showed some glimpses and Joe was Joe.

Overall a reasonably solid effort, but nothing that will strike fear into the better teams we are about to face.
 
Yep the fading in and out of games in 2024 is a huge concern, v the Bulldogs is the only 4 quarter performance against a decent side all season.

Will need it again against the Power away to win and be officially on a roll and the lid unscrewing.
yep, we certainly are not at the level of last year.

Although Port were pretty average against GWS, IMO they would have to be solid favourites at Adelaide. Andrew's 200th game and no Dixon, he will need to offer some support to Payne who seems to have his hands full with Marshall. Although I don't think we make the 8, a win on Saturday will have me reconsidering. Perhaps Swans due for a loss in a few weeks when we play them at the GABBA, and Dees seem to be 'off', so a win on Saturday is vital if Lions any chance of finals.
 

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Review Round 14, 2024 - Brisbane Lions vs. St. Kilda

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