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If that is the case then many clubs are going to be royally screwed for years.
List Mgmt. Next club to face a rebuild.
- Thread starter Obeanie1
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If that is the case then many clubs are going to be royally screwed for years.
Checksider
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The system is broken. And that’s just the way AFL House likes it.
Clubs that say "we don't rebuild" just haven't got there yet. It's a matter of time for all of them.
I'm sure West Coast weren't a rebuild club. Neither were the Hawks. Imagine the Tigers didn't think they needed one 2 years ago etc.
I'm sure West Coast weren't a rebuild club. Neither were the Hawks. Imagine the Tigers didn't think they needed one 2 years ago etc.
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Wait, so you have a terrible list after years of having a mediocre - terrible list, but that’s not a poor club? What is?
If you're trying to say that Geelong is never going to spend significant time in the bottom 6 of the league at any point in future, I don't know what to tell you.
I actually think it is a ridiculous claim to make. Luck alone could floor a club.
Well if you were saying anything other than Geelong will or won't do a "proper" rebuild at some point, you weren't even responding to the point I was making so I'll forgive myself for giving you the benefit of the doubt.
ChairmanZia
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The aging clubs around the middle of the table still scrambling to get into the 8.
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Collingwood need to, but won’t.
ChairmanZia
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Not won't, they can't due to the risk to it's image.
They rather scrap it out around the 8 topping things up each year then to do a total rebuild.
They need to ban themselves from trading future picks.
The Old Dark Navy's
Moderator
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- #115
Carlton need to nail the draft big time in the next couple of years and with later picks to boot. We blew the 2016 and 2017 drafts aside from De Koning, and have been a bit meh over the last two drafts. We are topping up for a flag tilt every year and our cap is full.
If we don't get a flag soon, we will have to sink to the middle rungs of the ladder at least.
If we don't get a flag soon, we will have to sink to the middle rungs of the ladder at least.
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Stewart - 31
Duncan - 33
Danger - 34
Blicavs - 33
Tuhoy - 34
Kolo - 28
Rohan - 33
Hawkins - 35
Cameron - 31
For me it's Geelong. Couple of decent young role players coming through and Holmes looks an A grader. The notion you can continually top up is incorrect in my opinion as the salary cap prevents it as well as the fact that you will struggle to attract FA's as you slide.
The cats topped up beautifully with the best key position player in the game to pair with Hawkins, but they're both coming towards the end. I think the cliff is coming for the cats.
Dees and Pies are the obvious other ones, however I think if the Dees got Petracca back and changed coach they might have a spike.
Duncan - 33
Danger - 34
Blicavs - 33
Tuhoy - 34
Kolo - 28
Rohan - 33
Hawkins - 35
Cameron - 31
For me it's Geelong. Couple of decent young role players coming through and Holmes looks an A grader. The notion you can continually top up is incorrect in my opinion as the salary cap prevents it as well as the fact that you will struggle to attract FA's as you slide.
The cats topped up beautifully with the best key position player in the game to pair with Hawkins, but they're both coming towards the end. I think the cliff is coming for the cats.
Dees and Pies are the obvious other ones, however I think if the Dees got Petracca back and changed coach they might have a spike.
We are the 4th oldest list this weekend. If we don't regenerate after this season and next , we could be looking at a world of pain.
Time to trade off players like pittonet to get some early picks in the draft
pie chucker
Senior List
All teams need at least a mini rebuild after going all out for a flag and they have to hit the draft at some point. Collingwood haven't drafted well for close to a decade so we don't have top end youth outside of Daicos. We have a list profile for the now but it really hasn't worked out this year and I don't think it's just down to injuries. The second last goal in last years GF was scored via three great players: DeGoey (pick 6), Daics (pick 4), Pendles (pick 5). Even the coach acknowledged that it was on the back of the draft.
In winning the 2023 flag we relied heavily on about 10 players over 30 who rarely get better at this age. If they were to maintain their form in 2024 we'd be ok. But they're either injured or have declined. Sidebottom is a great example. Will play a great quarter or a game every now and then. He used to be Mr Consistent.
Whilst it sucks for the now, it was worthwhile putting all our eggs in one basket and making it count when it was our time.
I'm trying to not be too pessimistic, but I think the Pies are in for a World of hurt over the next few years. Trading in a few players won't help us.
Having said that, I did think the same after 2021. So who knows.
In winning the 2023 flag we relied heavily on about 10 players over 30 who rarely get better at this age. If they were to maintain their form in 2024 we'd be ok. But they're either injured or have declined. Sidebottom is a great example. Will play a great quarter or a game every now and then. He used to be Mr Consistent.
Whilst it sucks for the now, it was worthwhile putting all our eggs in one basket and making it count when it was our time.
I'm trying to not be too pessimistic, but I think the Pies are in for a World of hurt over the next few years. Trading in a few players won't help us.
Having said that, I did think the same after 2021. So who knows.
pie chucker
Senior List
Your best players are just coming into their prime so Blues are ok. I reckon your window is about 3-4 years and you should win one in that time.
True but the reality is more mature lists win flags. The time is now
Rebuilds take too long because of the academies and father sons.
It seems every year, the best players are already tied to clubs before the draft even starts, and a result the best players aren’t going to the worst clubs.
Say what you want about growing the game or F/S tradition, but it’s creating equalization issues.
On top of that, the AFL creating priority picks and free agent compensation out of thin air, is creating issues for the lower teams unless they’re the beneficiaries of the AFL handout.
If we want to create an even playing field we need to change a few things:-
- No FA compensation and earlier eligibility. The benefit of losing a player is cap space so the team can go get another player. More player movement to refresh the list.
- Mid Season trading. Top teams will pay a premium if they are in the mix for the flag and lower clubs can’t move to rebuild quicker.
- No F/S in first two rounds. If clubs want the romance of picking a son of a legend, awesome, go get the pick needed. Allow live trading after a club has picked the player if you must.
- And this is the big one, clubs can trade players without their consent while under contract. Clubs can get top trade value at market rate instead of players saying I will only go to 1 team, which means clubs take under. It is always the same 4 clubs benefitting from this, and the players take below market rate to get to these teams knowing they’ll make it back in career opportunities or cough cheap property deals.
It seems every year, the best players are already tied to clubs before the draft even starts, and a result the best players aren’t going to the worst clubs.
Say what you want about growing the game or F/S tradition, but it’s creating equalization issues.
On top of that, the AFL creating priority picks and free agent compensation out of thin air, is creating issues for the lower teams unless they’re the beneficiaries of the AFL handout.
If we want to create an even playing field we need to change a few things:-
- No FA compensation and earlier eligibility. The benefit of losing a player is cap space so the team can go get another player. More player movement to refresh the list.
- Mid Season trading. Top teams will pay a premium if they are in the mix for the flag and lower clubs can’t move to rebuild quicker.
- No F/S in first two rounds. If clubs want the romance of picking a son of a legend, awesome, go get the pick needed. Allow live trading after a club has picked the player if you must.
- And this is the big one, clubs can trade players without their consent while under contract. Clubs can get top trade value at market rate instead of players saying I will only go to 1 team, which means clubs take under. It is always the same 4 clubs benefitting from this, and the players take below market rate to get to these teams knowing they’ll make it back in career opportunities or cough cheap property deals.
00Stinger
100 - 7
Essendon
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I think Carlton have this year and next to win the flag before a drop off similar to Collingwood's this year with so many players around and over that 30 mark.
Geelong and Melbourne may not require full rebuilds but really need to get some decent youth into their sides over the next couple of drafts
Geelong and Melbourne may not require full rebuilds but really need to get some decent youth into their sides over the next couple of drafts
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Cuddles Macrae has some hard choices to make this off season.
Does he play Mr Sentimental and let his older guys continue to play as they meander in a side that will try to contend for a spot in the out depths of the 8?
Or does he decide to make the hard calls to cut deep and rebuild toward their next flag?
If the latter, guys like Pendles, Sidebottom, Markov, Cox, Howe, Elliott should be in the mix for some hard conversations at end of year. Tough because some of them are strong contributors and there aren’t players coming up replacing them from the twos.
Crisp, Cameron, Degoey, McStay are all the wrong side of the age spectrum and if good picks were offered to the club they should be seriously looked at.
Macrae wont blow up the list, and it wouldn’t be the right thing to get rid of all the above, but doing the opposite will set them back a decade as well.
Does he play Mr Sentimental and let his older guys continue to play as they meander in a side that will try to contend for a spot in the out depths of the 8?
Or does he decide to make the hard calls to cut deep and rebuild toward their next flag?
If the latter, guys like Pendles, Sidebottom, Markov, Cox, Howe, Elliott should be in the mix for some hard conversations at end of year. Tough because some of them are strong contributors and there aren’t players coming up replacing them from the twos.
Crisp, Cameron, Degoey, McStay are all the wrong side of the age spectrum and if good picks were offered to the club they should be seriously looked at.
Macrae wont blow up the list, and it wouldn’t be the right thing to get rid of all the above, but doing the opposite will set them back a decade as well.
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