20th AFL Team

[RedV3x]

There needs to be a 2nd competition to aim for.

20 teams allows for two "conferences" - the AFL and the VFL, with two grand finals and a super bowl.
Each team would play their conference teams twice for 18 games and play half ayhe other conference for 5 more games.
23 game season with two final fours, two grand finals and one inter-conference grand final.
The inter-conference grand final would mean one Victorian team Vs one Australian team
ensuring a S.O.O finish which could be drawn out to a best of three games.

 

[1990crow]

20 teams allows for two "conferences" - the AFL and the VFL, with two grand finals and a super bowl.
Each team would play their conference teams twice for 18 games and play half ayhe other conference for 5 more games.
23 game season with two final fours, two grand finals and one inter-conference grand final.
The inter-conference grand final would mean one Victorian team Vs one Australian team
ensuring a S.O.O finish which could be drawn out to a best of three games.

Two conferences would destroy the fabric of the game.

E.g. historical rivalries
WC v Essendon
Port v Pies

 

[1990crow]

There needs to be a 2nd competition to aim for.

1 flag for 20 teams is just not enough.

If Soccer can have an exciting tournament and a league we can too

Get rid of preseason games.
Make it a proper tournament like NAB cup used to be, but with bigger incentives to win I.e. money, maybe 4 premiership points?

Start second week of Feb, finish with a ten day break to Round 0.

 

[Bjo187]

20 teams allows for two "conferences" - the AFL and the VFL, with two grand finals and a super bowl.
Each team would play their conference teams twice for 18 games and play half ayhe other conference for 5 more games.
23 game season with two final fours, two grand finals and one inter-conference grand final.
The inter-conference grand final would mean one Victorian team Vs one Australian team
ensuring a S.O.O finish which could be drawn out to a best of three games.

This is the same idea I'm a fan of. You could also have the 5 vfl games against the afl division all be interstate to balance the travel better across the season and give interstate Vic fans a chance to see their teams.

The other one change I'd make to the above is making it more than a top 4, either top 5 or 6 in each division. You want as many teams as possible to still be alive as long into the season as possible. You might do this as a wildcard for the last spot in the finals or give the top 2 the first week of finals off.

* just thinking about it, this also throws up the possibility of the grand final being a best of 3, one home, one away, one nuetral venue.

 

[RedV3x]

Two conferences would destroy the fabric of the game.

E.g. historical rivalries
WC v Essendon
Port v Pies

They will still exist.

 

[RedV3x]

The other one change I'd make

This is just a suggestion to open comment.
Possibly play every team in the opposing conference once for ten games and 13 games in your own conference.
Obviously you could play around with finals format etc.
You could have the losing conference grand finalist get into the super bowl by beating both other conference grand finalists.

 

[Coolangatta]

I think the league will likely remain single tier at 20 teams but if they go beyond that there’ll be some sort of conference system.

 

[RedV3x]

I think the league will likely remain single tier at 20 teams but if they go beyond that there’ll be some sort of conference system.

Fans have two expectations.
1. A realistic chance of earning some silverware before they die.
2. Their team to play every other team at least once.

We're already past the optimum point w.r.t. number of teams.
Increasing the number of teams only exacerbates the problem despite how desirable expansion may be.
Increasing the number of teams and introducing conferences reduces the possibility of teams playing each other
and that would mean a severe adjustment in the minds of most AFL fans.

American NFL fans are used to the NFL conference system but I don't see AFL fans easily adapting.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

20 teams allows for two "conferences" - the AFL and the VFL, with two grand finals and a super bowl.
Each team would play their conference teams twice for 18 games and play half ayhe other conference for 5 more games.
23 game season with two final fours, two grand finals and one inter-conference grand final.
The inter-conference grand final would mean one Victorian team Vs one Australian team
ensuring a S.O.O finish which could be drawn out to a best of three games.

Permanent conferences are a terrible move. Even worse if created as Vic/non-Vic.

Randomly drawn pools, maybe with a concession for non-Vic clubs in the same state to always be in the same pool, could work so long as they change every year. (This could be done now, maintaining a single ladder.) This at least gives some open-ness to fixture irregularities rather than being manipulated for the financial benefit of the big Vic clubs.

At 22 teams or more, promotion/relegation seems ideal. 12 teams in the top flight means the preferred 22 rounds, and once 24 teams are in there's 22 games in the second tier as well. And teams 23 and 24 would not be expected to play against the best teams in year one, they might be competitive against 13th to 22nd.
Contracts, salary caps, unequal distributions, etc would need to be sorted. Mostly in ways which are far from regular in other professional sports with promotion/relegation (the bulk of which are not salary capped). There's nothing that is a show-stopper there though.

 

[RedV3x]

Permanent conferences are a terrible move. Even worse if created as Vic/non-Vic.

In your opinion.

Randomly drawn pools,

Are meaningless. You may as well have random fixtures.

At 22 teams or more, promotion/relegation seems ideal.

To whom ?

 

[Run n Spread]

There's a heat wave in 4 cities and everyone has shit themselves.
Tasmania are quietly going about their business and building their heritage.
And the NT are laughing about the softness of the rest of the country.
2 state/territories ready to go

 

[Canberra Pear]

There's a heat wave in 4 cities and everyone has shit themselves.
Tasmania are quietly going about their business and building their heritage.
And the NT are laughing about the softness of the rest of the country.
2 state/territories ready to go

So your logic is that the NT is so used to unliveable weather conditions that we should base a team there full-time?

 

[BigChippa52]

So your logic is that the NT is so used to unliveable weather conditions that we should base a team there full-time?

the other 19 teams aren't, players have to go in cool rooms during QT when games are played up there, dumb logic the NT isn't ready or viable, Canberra is the best choice and can grow quickly and already has foundations and better foundations for a team than the NT does

 

[Bjo187]

This video on YouTube was spot on to everything we've discussed in here. It's gotta be one of you guys that post regularly in here I reckon. A good video which covers everything in detail and all the options and pros and cons.

 

[Coolangatta]

This video on YouTube was spot on to everything we've discussed in here. It's gotta be one of you guys that post regularly in here I reckon. A good video which covers everything in detail and all the options and pros and cons.

Yeah that’s a great video, seen it before. Wish I could take credit for it but I can’t.

I should just email it to Dillon.

Just a,

“Hi,

Hope you have a great Easter. I’ve found a solution to the 20th team dilemma. Great video, kudos to its creator.

<insert link>

Kind regards,”

Short and sweet does the trick.

 

[Coolangatta]

Sent. Added a tad more but hey, his handler (or maybe even himself) replied to me last time, he just might again.

It’d be a carefully worded reply that doesn’t commit to anything but that’s fine, they just need to see some numbers and the light at the end of the Giants need to be full time Sydney tunnel.

 

[Bjo187]

Lol I thought either yourself or Canberra pear.

They should appear to be keen on the following bids to create competition:
N.T
W.A 3
ACT
NORWOOD
QLD 3 (North Brisbane for mine).

I have been thinking though. I think the timing might work out politically for W.A 3 to be the top contender.

Barr in the ACT will likely only go 1 more term till about 2028 you'd assume. Labor are odds on favourites to win W.A in a few weeks, but that will see basil zemplis take the liberal leadership and by 2028 most people would likely be tired of the same party running things for so long. So i expect basil to be w.a premier in 2028 and barr not leader in ACT, at the same time the bids will be flowing through.

 

[Canberra Pear]

Lol I thought either yourself or Canberra pear.

They should appear to be keen on the following bids to create competition:
N.T
W.A 3
ACT
NORWOOD
QLD 3 (North Brisbane for mine).

I have been thinking though. I think the timing might work out politically for W.A 3 to be the top contender.

Barr in the ACT will likely only go 1 more term till about 2028 you'd assume. Labor are odds on favourites to win W.A in a few weeks, but that will see basil zemplis take the liberal leadership and by 2028 most people would likely be tired of the same party running things for so long. So i expect basil to be w.a premier in 2028 and barr not leader in ACT, at the same time the bids will be flowing through.

That guy has a few videos on AFL expansion. I reckon he's the best on the subject. Very much focused on the facts over feelings.

But it definitely wasn't me. I think he gives WA3 too much credit financially.

His financial measure is GSP per capita, which favours WA because of all the mining. But Canberra has a 40% higher median income, which I think is a better measure as it better reflects how much fans can spend.

He also just split Perth in three, and a bit of a limited Canberra population. So he's using Perth at 763k to 503k. But the reality is that WA3 isn't going to slice of a third of Perth. A poll in r/Perth said 18% would consider switching, which is only 435k. Canberra within in hour is more like 580k.

So two points in the video that favoured WA3, I think actually favour Canberra.

 

[loco3]

How would you brand a Canberra team?

Of all the options I’ve heard, the Griffins and the Rams seem like the most convincing options. I particularly like the Rams as there is shared symbolism with the Raiders use of horns (and possibility of appealing to NRL fans), as well as representative of the agricultural areas in the Riverina and outside Canberra generally.

Dark blue and yellow seem to be what Canberra folk identify with, but I think realistically that will be difficult to get across the line with those being West Coast’s colours.

Light blue doesn’t feature on any afl jumpers - I wonder if this could be the primary colour, with navy and gold as secondary/trim colours. AFL expansion has gone pretty weird with colours and jumpers in the past, maybe this is opportunity for a more restrained guernsey. Light blue could also be a nod to engaging with south NSW

 

[Walshawk]

How would you brand a Canberra team?

Of all the options I’ve heard, the Griffins and the Rams seem like the most convincing options. I particularly like the Rams as there is shared symbolism with the Raiders use of horns (and possibility of appealing to NRL fans), as well as representative of the agricultural areas in the Riverina and outside Canberra generally.

Dark blue and yellow seem to be what Canberra folk identify with, but I think realistically that will be difficult to get across the line with those being West Coast’s colours.

Light blue doesn’t feature on any afl jumpers - I wonder if this could be the primary colour, with navy and gold as secondary/trim colours. AFL expansion has gone pretty weird with colours and jumpers in the past, maybe this is opportunity for a more restrained guernsey. Light blue could also be a nod to engaging with south NSW

Giants should have been sky blue (NSW’s colour), with a dash of orange. Great combo. No clash with Swans or anyone else.

 

[Canberra Pear]

How would you brand a Canberra team?

Of all the options I’ve heard, the Griffins and the Rams seem like the most convincing options. I particularly like the Rams as there is shared symbolism with the Raiders use of horns (and possibility of appealing to NRL fans), as well as representative of the agricultural areas in the Riverina and outside Canberra generally.

I don't think the Rams will get up. They won't start a club with a gendered mascot. Fine if it's an historical club, but they'll be starting the club with a women's team from the start. Can't call them the Ramettes or Ewes.

The Griffins is a popular one with the name already everywhere in Canberra.

Canberra Owls is one I like. The collective noun of a parliament works well. Stands out as different among the bird teams.

Canberra Cockatoos is another floating around. Good alliteration. And the gang-gang cockatoo is the ACT'S official bird.

Dark blue and yellow seem to be what Canberra folk identify with, but I think realistically that will be difficult to get across the line with those being West Coast’s colours.

Light blue doesn’t feature on any afl jumpers - I wonder if this could be the primary colour, with navy and gold as secondary/trim colours. AFL expansion has gone pretty weird with colours and jumpers in the past, maybe this is opportunity for a more restrained guernsey. Light blue could also be a nod to engaging with south NSW

Bloody West Coast.

I always assumed we'd go blue and green. A bit like the Raiders. I reckon the Seattle Sounders colours below, but in a Geelong style guernsey would look cool.



Or blue, yellow and green. Represents the territory colours, plus the bush capital. Similar to Woodville-West Torrens.

 

[Bjo187]

I don't think the Rams will get up. They won't start a club with a gendered mascot. Fine if it's an historical club, but they'll be starting the club with a women's team from the start. Can't call them the Ramettes or Ewes.

The Griffins is a popular one with the name already everywhere in Canberra.

Canberra Owls is one I like. The collective noun of a parliament works well. Stands out as different among the bird teams.

Canberra Cockatoos is another floating around. Good alliteration. And the gang-gang cockatoo is the ACT'S official bird.



Bloody West Coast.

I always assumed we'd go blue and green. A bit like the Raiders. I reckon the Seattle Sounders colours below, but in a Geelong style guernsey would look cool.

View attachment 2227378

Or blue, yellow and green. Represents the territory colours, plus the bush capital. Similar to Woodville-West Torrens.

View attachment 2227382

I actually thought the same about the rams name not being gender nuetral but your suggestion of ramettes (if they're actually a thing) is kinda cool and would make it work imo.

It's a strong brand with a lot of options for a logo and jumper in it, especially with the C shape horn working into C for Canberra.

Your previous suggestion of Griffins I didn't mind, however with that and the owls, there are already too many bird teams and there is an eagle and lion already in the comp.

I personally hate the over Americanism of Australia at the moment, it's nuts, however, I do really like the Washington Commanders name, it would go really well with the Canberra Commanders also being a capital and it's a modern and strong name.

With the colours I kinda wanna see a team in the following colours in the comp, they would be distinct, (no doubt the AFL will stuff the branding regardless, but...):

• Green and black (that nice green though like western United in the A league)
• Green and white (like Celtic soccer or basketball)
• Green red and white (these go great together imo)
• Gold, black and white (New Orleans saints)
• Blue and orange (can't believe the giants didn't use this, or any other Australian sports team for that matter, these colors go great together).

 

[loco3]

You could right about the gendered name, but I do like the branding options that the Rams presents (as mentioned Bjo) and the Ramettes. And(correct me if I’m wrong) but I believe there are recent teams added to sports comps that are gendered. I think the Macarthur a-league team is branded as the bulls? Maybe the afl would disagree, but it is a men’s sports team after all…

Not sure about the owls. I get the reference but it seems lacking a bit of edge/aggression required to be taken seriously. Reminds me to Ottawa Senators in the NHL.

Re colours - agree 100% on that list above. I would love to see green used more, especially how the Celtic soccer team has used it. Although I think the mid-green/mid-blue combination is very difficult to do well as these are not traditionally complimentary colours. And maybe you’d want to distinguish the team from the raiders?

 

[Freomaniac]

Canberra. Full stop.

Agreed....

Again.... 22 games played. 11 home games, 11 away games.

2 of those away games vs the NSW clubs. I don't think the travelling from Canberra to Melbourne will be daunting.

Distance from Adelaide to Melbourne is like 45 to 60 minutes by plane

 

[Badger17]

I like some suggestions more than others, but the only really strong opinion I have on the branding is that it shouldn't reference politics unless it's cleaver about it, and I think that's a sentiment that most Canberrans would share. So no Senators, Commanders, or whatever.

I think not picking a name because it's gendered is stupid, but you could go with the Shearers if Rams is really an issue. Shearers would better represent the agricultural industry in the region anyway.

I like pretty much all the other suggestions I've heard. Griffins and Owls/Parliament would both be good, the fact that neither has been used by other sports yet is astounding. I personally wouldn't care, but I can imagine some issues arising from calling the team the Cockatoos though.

I've heard people suggest the Cowboys after Kevin Neale, who had a huge influence on footy in Canberra back in the day. I'd prefer something more unique instead of sharing a brand with NQ and Dallas though.

ACT Terriers or Canberra Cattle Dogs could make for fun alliterations and mascots. Could build a rivalry out of it with the Bulldogs as well.

Naming the team the Canberra Cosmos after the Honeysuckle Creek tracking station, with a moon/space theme, would be a cool deep cut of Canberra culture. Might cause some issues with soccer folks though.