Training 2024 Pre-Season discussion

[thejester]

Wow, I didn't realise his VFL numbers were so strong. He's a very Geelong-type player, tall, strong running and versatile. Hope he succeeds.

They moved him off the wing and into the stoppages. I’m hoping that versatility translates into the seniors - think we clearly suffered last year from having no one who we could reliably throw into stoppages if the starting 4-5 couldn’t get it done.

 

[The 747]

Unless they play him as an Inside mid I don't hold out hope. He might be able to run but he's far too slow to play on the outside. I hope I'm wrong because he was a star at the Falcons. I expect Stevens to play a lot of games before Knevitt.

Not sure he is as slow as he sometimes looks - for mine it is more that he doesn't yet play with the required level of intensity. Has promise though.

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

Not sure where you're getting this from? As he blitzed testing, has never looked slow on the field since he was drafted - and now looks considerably leaner and stronger. I remember his National combine results, and he was Top 5 endurance wise and Top 10 in the 20m sprint - which is a very good combo for someone his height. This is from Rookie me:

"Mitch Knevitt is anticipated to go somewhere in that second round, with a number of clubs viewing him as a Top 25 prospect. He could go as high as late first round, or slide later in the second round, but his end to the year, and his unsurprising testing results at the recent AFL Vic Country Draft Combine where he finished in the top few for both the 20m sprint and 2km time trial, means he will likely be closer to the former than the latter. One way or another, he is one to watch in the coming years with his potential."

I do agree that Inside Mid is his best position, but he definitely has the scope to play wing or half forward if the team needs it. From what I've seen in a snapshot of his AFL career this far, slow is not a ln attribute I would apply to Knevitt, IMO.

This is the write up from ESPN to further confirm this notion:

"Securing a 2.976 second 20m sprint and a 6:18 in the 2km time trial, the second and third best times in the respective tests at the Vic Country combine, 194cm Mitch Knevitt wowed onlookers. Among other tall midfielders, Knevitt's 20m sprint compares favourably to Scott Pendlebury's 3.01, Marcus Bontempelli's 3.2 and Patrick Cripps' 3.23. On matchday, Knevitt covers the ground well, manages to get from contest to contest, looks agile in traffic and provides good spread. What's more incredible with Knevitt is he's not just a tall athlete, but a genuinely good midfielder. Knevitt plays his best football through the midfield as a ball winner and inside distributor, displaying the strength to stand up through tackles and release by hands. A strong contested mark who can also push forward and provide a forward of centre marking threat, Knevitt has the scope to be successful at AFL level, as there will be few who can both run with him and compete in marking contests. With his strong last two months to the season and incredible combine results, Knevitt is likely to receive first round consideration."

Also, for comparison, his 2.976 sprint time is faster than DeMattia, 0.013 slower than Gothard and 0.060 slower than Windsor - who are considered some of the quickest draftees in the 2023 draft. Gives you an idea of just how quick off the mark Knevitt can be.

"20m sprint​

Aiden O’Driscoll (Perth/Northam Saints) - 2.871 seconds
Will Graham (Gold Coast Suns Academy/Palm Beach Currumbin) - 2.915
Caleb Windsor (Eastern Ranges/South Belgrave) - 2.916
Lance Collard (Subiaco/North Beach) - 2.923
Kane McAuliffe (North Adelaide/Central Augusta) - 2.930
Zane Zakostelsky (Claremont/North Beach) - 2.954
Phoenix Gothard (Murray Bushrangers/Albury) - 2.963
Taylor Goad (South Adelaide/Willunga) - 2.965
Eion McElholm (Ireland) - 2.993
Harry DeMattia (Dandenong Stingrays/Edithvale-Aspendale) - 2.996"

*******************

Translation - he ain't slow.

Mitchell Knevitt Draft Profile

central.rookieme.com

AFL Draft Combine wrap - the standouts, surprises and how to interpret it all

This year, several draft combines were held around the country. Who stood out and performed the best? ESPN's Draft expert Chris Doerre runs his eye over all the action.

www.espn.com.au

2023 AFL Draft Combine testing results

See the top 10 results from the physical testing conducted at the 2023 AFL Draft Combine

www.google.com

I couldn't care less about 20 metre sprint numbers. He's slow.

 

[gogeelongcats]

I couldn't care less about 20 metre sprint numbers. He's slow.

He just needs game time to put it all together.
As another example, Mulin is much quicker than he has shown on the field so far to date.

The tools ARE there as numbers do not lie.

Play the man he is ready.

 

[CHAWKTS]

Interested to see where Dempsey is played this next season. He’s quite versatile being able to play wing, and both at half back or half forward. I wonder whether he could be earmarked to replace Duncan over the next couple of seasons in that quarterback role?

Have been thinking the same. Especially with #7 arrival in the forward line as a 26yo that might put Dempsey back a spot? Not sure.

I think Ollie needs a little more development before taking on that type of role but do see that he could mature into that role. I was hoping they might try on the wing but with Knevitte and Holmes (who I reckon should go back to wing) not to mention the older guys, I don’t see that open up for Dempsey either.

It might well be that they move Miers up field. He is untested as a midfielder and might have limitations but if he does get plenty of the ball upfield he has proven to be a damaging score involvement player. And given he is just not kicking goals I would have thought going up the field was better? That would leave Close and Dempsey and Mannagh as our high half forward options?

Dempsey is a little hard for me in terms of prediction for 2024. He could have a break out year but equally I could see him just consolidate in VFL and learn - without panicking in terms of long term upside…not sure

 

[CHAWKTS]

High half forward seems to be the role most suited to him. Don't think he has the elite disposal required to be an orchestrator.

I agree that is the case so far…but wonder whether we might be surprised in a couple of years. As his confidence builds composure.

It does look like he has that “miers like” smarts in terms of looking for right option and being “clever”. What I am unclear of is whether he builds “length” into his disposals to be damaging

 

[Shadow89]

I couldn't care less about 20 metre sprint numbers. He's slow.

He really isn't. I've watched plenty of VFL games and his AFL games, along with his underage tape, and he's never come across as slow.

You're literally saying 'I don't care about empirical data, I care about my own perception.' C'mon mate you're better than that.

I know we're at an impasse on this and I usually always highly value your opinion, so I'm going to just call this a wash and move on.

 

[bombersboy]

My bad - I misinterpreted 'until next year'.

That's much better. Hope to see him make an impression in 2024.

If it is true, not being able to do a full pre season and missing the running will set him back big time. May well write off the year even if he plays a few games.

 

[bombersboy]

This was from a couple of weeks ago.

If 19 is Phoenix Foster he looks to be much heavier but seems to have little muscle definition

 

[Heckler]

Midfield is really the only area we fell down badly last year largely due to injury. We missed Selwood badly (worse than I thought we would) and lost games he wouldn’t have let us lose as he carried the team on his back. I think the kids in the mid will be ready and Holmes back on the wing where he belongs.

Soon as the opposition scored 3 unanswered goals
Selwood sensed the danger and lifted the team.
He did this even if Cats were leading at the time.
Without Selwood, players left the charge too late.
A Late charge allowed opponents to hang onto to win

 

[Biscut]

I couldn't care less about 20 metre sprint numbers. He's slow.

You couldn’t care less about a measurement of speed over a given distance to determine if someone is quick or slow? That’s a bit strange……………

 

[Mattlock]

Have been thinking the same. Especially with #7 arrival in the forward line as a 26yo that might put Dempsey back a spot? Not sure.

I think Ollie needs a little more development before taking on that type of role but do see that he could mature into that role. I was hoping they might try on the wing but with Knevitte and Holmes (who I reckon should go back to wing) not to mention the older guys, I don’t see that open up for Dempsey either.

It might well be that they move Miers up field. He is untested as a midfielder and might have limitations but if he does get plenty of the ball upfield he has proven to be a damaging score involvement player. And given he is just not kicking goals I would have thought going up the field was better? That would leave Close and Dempsey and Mannagh as our high half forward options?

Dempsey is a little hard for me in terms of prediction for 2024. He could have a break out year but equally I could see him just consolidate in VFL and learn - without panicking in terms of long term upside…not sure

Could be play down back?

 

[bellpark]

There is a growing concern for me on the number of our key youngsters showing bad luck/ durability issues. At the moment Conway and Clarke have apparently serious foot issues. Henry as well. Hopefully it's part of the normal list issues, but injury seems to be holding Conway back and hopefully not Clarke too - they have been picked to play in the seniors soon, not 3-4 years later.

 

[FredLeDeux]

There is a growing concern for me on the number of our key youngsters showing bad luck/ durability issues. At the moment Conway and Clarke have apparently serious foot issues. Henry as well. Hopefully it's part of the normal list issues, but injury seems to be holding Conway back and hopefully not Clarke too - they have been picked to play in the seniors soon, not 3-4 years later.

Is this the first sighting of a Clarke for the season?

 

[cats_09]

Is this the first sighting of a Clarke for the season?

I'd like to say yes, but I'm somewhat doubtful

 

[CHAWKTS]

Could be play down back?

I think he could but not sure he will. I reckon they like the fact he is a two way runner. Fast and natural endurance. I think he does 14-15km every game in the VFL from high half forward.

Eventually (if he makes it) I could see him on wing or even in the midfield (or that Duncan versatile role if he really develops) but in short term it seems like they are going to persist with him forward (and maybe move Miers up the ground?). With #7 joining though it could squeeze Dempsey back a bit though?

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

You couldn’t care less about a measurement of speed over a given distance to determine if someone is quick or slow? That’s a bit strange……………

He's slow. Trust me. I watched every Falcons game.

 

[strauchnyy]

He really isn't. I've watched plenty of VFL games and his AFL games, along with his underage tape, and he's never come across as slow.

You're literally saying 'I don't care about empirical data, I care about my own perception.' C'mon mate you're better than that.

I know we're at an impasse on this and I usually always highly value your opinion, so I'm going to just call this a wash and move on.

He can be quick at combine conditions but he plays slow and reactionary. He can’t breakaway from players and instead has a habit of walking into tackles, freeing the arms with his height to hb away. Not ideal for a midfielder. His combine results mean zero when he plays with cement feet

 

[Lingsface]

Who is winning the time trials?
who is looking sharp?

 

[Shadow89]

Looks like we've already started shitting on your youngsters this pre-season. Oh joy.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

If 19 is Phoenix Foster he looks to be much heavier but seems to have little muscle definition

I think that's just a bad photo for being heavier but yeah still needs a bit more time in the gym. 2nd year kp

 

[Matthew Jelley]

If we are to make it in 24 I reckon at least 3 of Knevitt, Dempsey, Clark, Mullin, Mannagh, Stevens, Neale, Conway need to find a way to be regular contributors in the best 22
Not all playing every week but making regular contributions

 

[gogeelongcats]

If we are to make it in 24 I reckon at least 3 of Knevitt, Dempsey, Clark, Mullin, Mannagh, Stevens, Neale, Conway need to find a way to be regular contributors in the best 22
Not all playing every week but making regular contributions

I get the feeling MANNAGH is a lock
CLARK also if he is fit which appears to be a concern

 

[CHAWKTS]

Who is winning the time trials?
who is looking sharp?

From my track watcher they really only do the shuttle test now as its “time trial” stuff. Everything else is integrated into footy drills (ie. they mix the cardio in). They also weave in some handicap sprints

In the shuttle Knevitte beat Dempsey by a split second (the funny story was that they go in threes and nobody else - it was the 1-4 years) wanted to run with them (last year it went Bowes then Dempsey then Knevitte) so Scratcher volunteered. He tried to keep up early and then completely crashed out (much to the amusement of those watching). Those two were well in front of the year 1-4s. They both best last year by almost 9 seconds. And only 3 seconds of the historical record (Blitz) moving into second and third all time.

The rest of the squad (minus Blitz who usually wins) went at it last week. Bowes and Miers clear winners but Bowes was a good 4-5 seconds behind Dempsey this year.

So it is the same leaders as last year but the order changing a bit.

In terms of others, a lot of best times which is a good sign. Jyhe had a good showing.

Most people are back on the track which is good news.

In terms of looking sharpe that comes over next few weeks as they do more match sim before christmas. But really in focus in the new year

 

[CHAWKTS]

If we are to make it in 24 I reckon at least 3 of Knevitt, Dempsey, Clark, Mullin, Mannagh, Stevens, Neale, Conway need to find a way to be regular contributors in the best 22
Not all playing every week but making regular contributions

I agree. I think there are genuine spots up for grabs and nobody really a lock to fill them.

Mullin for me has the best chance to be regular I think only because I think he will overtake Bews and he really is that only “like for like”? I think other than Bews…2E, Bowes and maybe even Duncan (unless he is back to full fitness) and Rohan are most vulnerable to losing regular spots - and I agree that if we are going to move forward in 24 they have to lose spots to new ones having break outs.

Mannagh will be talked about but we really wont know until he gets to play in the practice games. He was great in the VFL but no better than Dempsey (votes per game, VFL team of the year etc) and Knevitte at the end of season so I don’t think we should overstate him being a lock. But his age gives him a shot. Dempsey, Knevitt and Clark should all get a chance this year to shine I think. Who knows which one takes the chance..