Analysis Umpires

[Blueballs38]

Thought the umpiring in the first was filth biased but was relatively consistent after that.

Charlie’s frees where all there in a big way, would have had no problem if the shoe was on the other foot.

 

[Bletch]

Can we name the last "well umpired game"? Asking for a friend and a close relative.

The umps are human (perhaps surprising to some), and like most of us, they make mistakes. Regularly. So do players. It's often said that this is the most difficult sport to adjudicate - the ball moves quickly, and it's a 360deg game. There are many line-ball decisions to make. So, fwiw, my thoughts:

• There are "well umpired games" every week.
• And there are games that aren't so well umpired.
• Some umpires are better than others - make fewer errors; have better control of a game.
• Some "poorer" umpires get better as they gain more experience. Go figure.
• It's probable there have been instances of umpires with conscious bias against particular players, and possibly clubs.
  • Instances of this would be way fewer than most supporters expect.
  • Supporters have no way of determining this, and conjecture about such bias is almost certainly baseless.
  • The effect of any such bias will have been lessened with the introduction of multiple umpires.
  • Suggestions that the AFL, or some other external factor is complicit in conscious bias is nonsense.
• Unconscious bias is a thing. And I imagine there is considerable effort/training on this topic for AFL-level umpires.
  • The biggest factor in unconscious bias is partisan crowds.
• Umpiring can be a factor in determining the outcome of a match. Clearly a free kick paid (or not) 10m out of goal with 10sec on the clock is going to have a bearing on the outcome.
  • Way too much focus is placed on decisions later in matches for this reason.
  • Supporters will remember these late decisions, rather than looking at the umpiring as a whole over the course of a match.
  • Player decisions and actions are a far greater factor in determining the outcome of matches.
  • An umpire has never "won" a match for a side.
• In general the umps do a great job in trying circumstances. They deserve more credit than they get.

 

[teagueyubeauty]

Thought the umpiring in the first was filth biased but was relatively consistent after that.

Charlie’s frees where all there in a big way, would have had no problem if the shoe was on the other foot.

Only one that was soft which I would have been rope able about on the other side of the coin is the one where his arm was slightly impeded. That was soft as

The rest, all there and deserved


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Gointocarlton]

Only one that was soft which I would have been rope able about on the other side of the coin is the one where his arm was slightly impeded. That was soft as

The rest, all there and deserved


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

I thought they were all there with Charlie, the only dodgy one was the push in the back in the marking contest to Jack "Louganis" Martin. I scored it a 9.95.

 

[sbwan]

Only one that was soft which I would have been rope able about on the other side of the coin is the one where his arm was slightly impeded. That was soft as

The rest, all there and deserved


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

That one was very much there. I thought the 'hold' in the goalsquare was pretty iffy. But also deserved one for over the shoulder in the second quarter I think it was, that he didn't get.

 

[Sector 7G]

That one was very much there. I thought the 'hold' in the goalsquare was pretty iffy. But also deserved one for over the shoulder in the second quarter I think it was, that he didn't get.

The thing is Howe wasn’t able to take the mark because he was too busy pushing Martin and didn’t have time to get his arms up in time.

Howe was stiff because Cameron got away with a similar one on Pitt.

 

[Blue Doormat]

Two things irked me about last night’s umpiring and they weren’t umpiring errors, so much as rules that a) make no sense and/or b) are being taken advantage of beautifully by the pies at the moment. Umpiring is a tough gig, ambiguous rules make it tougher.

The first is the ruck block rule. Makes no sense and takes away from any skill involved in rucking and either advantages or disadvantages a ruckman depending on the capability of an umpire to bounce the ball straight up. Last night, one for and one against but both frustrating and bewildering.

Second, the Pies took great advantage of the outside 5 rule. They meander their way backwards out of the “5” often not reaching the 5 due to their slow movement backwards. They also move backwards making sure their path is akin to the sideways movement on the mark that used to be allowed. That they get away with it, I say good on them. But it is counter to the intention of the stand rule I think.

 

[lily of laguna]

The thing is Howe wasn’t able to take the mark because he was too busy pushing Martin and didn’t have time to get his arms up in time.

Howe was still because Cameron got away with a similar one on Pitt.

Martin was moved forward from 2 hands in the back.
How much force was used? We will never know,and yes I think jack made it look more obvious, but a push with hands in the back has been a free kick since thy was a boy!

Dumb from Howe, clever from jack……….. goal to the blues!!


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[BeijingBlue]

The umps are human (perhaps surprising to some), and like most of us, they make mistakes. Regularly. So do players. It's often said that this is the most difficult sport to adjudicate - the ball moves quickly, and it's a 360deg game. There are many line-ball decisions to make. So, fwiw, my thoughts:

• There are "well umpired games" every week.
• And there are games that aren't so well umpired.
• Some umpires are better than others - make fewer errors; have better control of a game.
• Some "poorer" umpires get better as they gain more experience. Go figure.
• It's probable there have been instances of umpires with conscious bias against particular players, and possibly clubs.
  • Instances of this would be way fewer than most supporters expect.
  • Supporters have no way of determining this, and conjecture about such bias is almost certainly baseless.
  • The effect of any such bias will have been lessened with the introduction of multiple umpires.
  • Suggestions that the AFL, or some other external factor is complicit in conscious bias is nonsense.
• Unconscious bias is a thing. And I imagine there is considerable effort/training on this topic for AFL-level umpires.
  • The biggest factor in unconscious bias is partisan crowds.
• Umpiring can be a factor in determining the outcome of a match. Clearly a free kick paid (or not) 10m out of goal with 10sec on the clock is going to have a bearing on the outcome.
  • Way too much focus is placed on decisions later in matches for this reason.
  • Supporters will remember these late decisions, rather than looking at the umpiring as a whole over the course of a match.
  • Player decisions and actions are a far greater factor in determining the outcome of matches.
  • An umpire has never "won" a match for a side.
• In general the umps do a great job in trying circumstances. They deserve more credit than they get.

A great summation, thankyou. Those who have umpired the game, understand the challenges. 99% of the time, the better side wins with the umpiring not a factor.

 

[agro]

Thought the umpire with the 1950’s style GI Joe crew cut, umpiring the Division 2 WRFL game yesterday Brooklyn -v- North Footscray made Nathan Williamson look both fair and competent.

 

[Revenant1965]

IMO, a good story, and one of the good ones.

Tonight, ace umpire Brett Rosebury will make AFL history

Brett Rosebury is set to enshrine his name in history by supervising most matches at the AFL when he enters the arena at Docklands to see Richmond take on the Western Bulldogs.

www.abc.net.au

 

[Gointocarlton]

IMO, a good story, and one of the good ones.

Tonight, ace umpire Brett Rosebury will make AFL history

Brett Rosebury is set to enshrine his name in history by supervising most matches at the AFL when he enters the arena at Docklands to see Richmond take on the Western Bulldogs.

www.abc.net.au

A phenomenal effort, a very good umpire is Brett. Good to see him in the rooms on Friday night mingling with players, I think he said he has umpired both Libbas, hard to fathom that. Well done.

 

[HarryFlashman]

Will be interesting how the umpires officiate our game today. Has been a very inconsistent weekend so far.
Dissent has seemingly disappeared & I hope it doesn’t rear it’s head today - going to be a high pressure game and emotions will be running hot, the leeway they have been giving seems a lot more in the spirit of the game.
There’s been a number of front contacts that have been ignored, really hope they are on this & on the arm chops & scragging players. Huge amount of scragging went uncalled last night & it shits me when players are held without it - that really hurts our style of play

 

[GoBlues!]

Thought the umpires did a great job yesterday.

A few wayward kicks bounced out of bounds, and was waiting for a deliberate oob to be paid but none were iirc. Good to see.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Thought that was one of the worst umpired games for the season for the simple reason that Charlie was being manhandled and scragged quite literally all day long and they swallowed their whistles. Wilkie got away with murder probably because Collingwoods nuffies put in complaints to the Umps about Charlie being looked after last week. Need to find a middle ground if jumper grabbing and high contact isn't going to get paid to him.

 

[Stamos]

Thought that was one of the worst umpired games for the season for the simple reason that Charlie was being manhandled and scragged quite literally all day long and they swallowed their whistles. Wilkie got away with murder probably because Collingwoods nuffies put in complaints to the Umps about Charlie being looked after last week. Need to find a middle ground if jumper grabbing and high contact isn't going to get paid to him.

There's been much worse umpired games (the first half last week for example), I think they did a reasonable job overall, except for everything around Charlie. He got molested, and ended up with 1 free kick for the game, and 4 against!

 

[DangerousD]

The umps are human (perhaps surprising to some), and like most of us, they make mistakes. Regularly. So do players. It's often said that this is the most difficult sport to adjudicate - the ball moves quickly, and it's a 360deg game. There are many line-ball decisions to make. So, fwiw, my thoughts:

• There are "well umpired games" every week.
• And there are games that aren't so well umpired.
• Some umpires are better than others - make fewer errors; have better control of a game.
• Some "poorer" umpires get better as they gain more experience. Go figure.
• It's probable there have been instances of umpires with conscious bias against particular players, and possibly clubs.
  • Instances of this would be way fewer than most supporters expect.
  • Supporters have no way of determining this, and conjecture about such bias is almost certainly baseless.
  • The effect of any such bias will have been lessened with the introduction of multiple umpires.
  • Suggestions that the AFL, or some other external factor is complicit in conscious bias is nonsense.
• Unconscious bias is a thing. And I imagine there is considerable effort/training on this topic for AFL-level umpires.
  • The biggest factor in unconscious bias is partisan crowds.
• Umpiring can be a factor in determining the outcome of a match. Clearly a free kick paid (or not) 10m out of goal with 10sec on the clock is going to have a bearing on the outcome.
  • Way too much focus is placed on decisions later in matches for this reason.
  • Supporters will remember these late decisions, rather than looking at the umpiring as a whole over the course of a match.
  • Player decisions and actions are a far greater factor in determining the outcome of matches.
  • An umpire has never "won" a match for a side.
• In general the umps do a great job in trying circumstances. They deserve more credit than they get.

With all that being said, it’s 2023, the AFL is worth Billions of $$$$, why wouldn’t they be transitioning umpiring to a full time profession?

 

[DangerousD]

If the AFL were ever crazy enough to implement a captains challenge like NRL or cricket our game would implode.

Players would nearly be able to challenge every single contest and find an infringement.

Regardless of my frustration with umpiring in games, I know it’s hard and find the personal commentary regarding specific umpires as being real poor.

 

[Stamos]

Regardless of my frustration with umpiring in games, I know it’s hard and find the personal commentary regarding specific umpires as being real poor.

Interestingly, on the radio this morning they said Port put a call into the Umpiring Department on Sunday morning in regards to a single umpire who paid Geelong 15 free kicks! (for some context, Carlton got a total of 14 yesterday)

 

[CaptainCharisma]

Thought that was one of the worst umpired games for the season for the simple reason that Charlie was being manhandled and scragged quite literally all day long and they swallowed their whistles. Wilkie got away with murder probably because Collingwoods nuffies put in complaints to the Umps about Charlie being looked after last week. Need to find a middle ground if jumper grabbing and high contact isn't going to get paid to him.

I thought overall the umpiring was the same standard as usual apart from Charlie getting scragged.
The umpires are humans and I am sure they were all reading the "Charlie gets looked after" narrative from the week before.

Hopefully it evens out next week. Don't need him to get everything, but there were some blatant ones missed yesterday.

 

[agro]

There was enough DNA evidence on Charlie to put away those St Kilda defenders in a Turkish Prison for life.

Which out of area umpiring specialist Ray Chamberlain evidently missed

 

[Juddernaut08]

Yep it was a stupid overreaction yesterday.

 

[agro]

Umpires have no significant impact on the outcome of games

 

[DangerousD]

Yep it was a stupid overreaction yesterday.

This type of situation isn’t specific to AFL or AFL umpires though, I remember living in the UK and senior coaches would go after refs midweek and this type of reaction would happen in game.

 

[Stamos]

Bump