Coach John Longmire - Part IV

[The King!]

The bolded is a contradictory statement though because if it's the list that won the flag in 2012 then that suggests it's actually the players who bear the most responsibility for wins and losses, not the coach, which is the opposite of what you're trying to argue.

Not really, I am suggesting Roos developed the list.

Though to be fair Longmire was a part of that.

Players and coach deserve the blame and credit together, But I waa responding to the idea he couldnt do a thing in 14 and 22. Yes he could and in games he has shown he can IMO, with some smart coaching, it just has been ineffective quite often in September, two great wins to start the year though, so who knows, I think even the best coach has an expiry date, just my view.

I also fully accept why people want him to keep coaching and think he is wondeful, we are a team with a pretty poor history so he certainly stands out amongst the coaches we have had.


One thing I would never question is his man management, care for his players and the way he represents the club

 

[Bloods86]

That's when we get Hinkley for 1 season after he is sacked from Port and we win a flag against them in the GF cause Port to go back to the SANFL in rage so when Tassie joins it is still 18 clubs

Haha... Hinkley winning a flag...

 

[The King!]

Imo basing success solely on premierships is one of the most ill-informed views of sport.

For all the nay-sayers of Longmire, there's a failure to provide an alternative coach who is on an equal or greater footing.

Longmire is a below average coach in finals and we have a large sample size.

He has a losing record in September, and we lose on average by 6 goals, been some poor exits and he has had some champion players play for him. Just look at our top 10 for games played all time, 8 of them played for him, for the talent he has he should make finals most years at the minimum and he really should have won at least another flag.

Does that make him a poor coach, no not at all, but he isnt a coaching legend or anything like that and he would want to get a flag sometime soon with the current crop of elite talent he has.


How can people against him (not even saying I am) name an alternative though? Want an interview panel set up?


Lets see how he goes this year, bloody good start, I give him great credit for managing the structure with players missing so far and how we dismantled the pies in particular.

 

[Dubai Quacker]

My view - he’s a very good coach, particularly on the people management side of things.

And yet - he’s prone to the odd memorable clanger. Particularly when it comes to selecting incapacitated players in finals.

The GF record tends to taint my memory of all the good aspects of Horse’s tenure.

 

[The King!]

Even as someone being critical I also get the fact that apoor grand final record is something many would kill to even have as a problem

 

[GoTheSwannies]

Even as someone being critical I also get the fact that apoor grand final record is something many would kill to even have as a problem

When I think of the fact that I've sat through 3 straight GF losses, I remind myself that I could be an Essendon supporter.

I was there for 2012 so not all doom and gloom.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

Even as someone being critical I also get the fact that apoor grand final record is something many would kill to even have as a problem

I have no problem with losing to a better side i think most expect the game not to be over in 15mins as well.

Brisbane lost to a better side last year but bloody hell did they give a contest and then some.

 

[GoTheSwannies]

I have no problem with losing to a better side i think most expect the game not to be over in 15mins as well.

Brisbane lost to a better side last year but bloody hell did they give a contest and then some.

Was a great GF, only thing that would have made it better from my perspective was if Brisbane won. But wasn't to be.

 

[Swan4Life]

Said it before....wouldn't trade him for a hundred Clarko's.

You will not find a better individual to mould a group of young men and extract the maximum from them.

 

[Caj]

Said it before....wouldn't trade him for a hundred Clarko's.

You will not find a better individual to mould a group of young men and extract the maximum from them.

I don’t judge Clarkson as harshly as others, but even if you don’t like his personality, the numbers don’t lie, he’s a better coach than Longmire with a far superior record. I don’t think that’s even remotely debatable

 

[Punts]

I don’t judge Clarkson as harshly as others, but even if you don’t like his personality, the numbers don’t lie, he’s a better coach than Longmire with a far superior record. I don’t think that’s even remotely debatable

facts

 

[Callipygian]

So, for Longmire's 'lukewarm' supporters and his detractors, would you prefer Beveridge? Without checking the stats, seems to have a better record in finals. 50% in grand finals. And must have won more than he lost given he won 7 finals in 2016 and 2021 alone but can't have lost that many since he hasn't made finals enough to do so.

 

[Wolfgang West]

facts

Probably is fact but let’s not ignore the fact he is a % a deadset dog of a bloke. If you asked me would I want Clarkson and a couple more flags at the Swans or Longmire, 1 flag, failed attempts and the man’s character it would be a no brainer for me.

 

[Punts]

Probably is fact but let’s not ignore the fact he is a % a deadset dog of a bloke. If you asked me would I want Clarkson and a couple more flags at the Swans or Longmire, 1 flag, failed attempts and the man’s character it would be a no brainer for me.

Never meet him so I can’t comment on that mate

 

[bedford]

Probably is fact but let’s not ignore the fact he is a % a deadset dog of a bloke. If you asked me would I want Clarkson and a couple more flags at the Swans or Longmire, 1 flag, failed attempts and the man’s character it would be a no brainer for me.

One thing he did right was the Aitkin incident as he is a rat

 

[Jimbo OZ]

This must be the most futile thread on this site. There are no swing voters left.

 

[Ed_Gein]

Probably is fact but let’s not ignore the fact he is a % a deadset dog of a bloke. If you asked me would I want Clarkson and a couple more flags at the Swans or Longmire, 1 flag, failed attempts and the man’s character it would be a no brainer for me.

Lol, If in an alternate reality Clarkson coached us to 4 flags I doubt you'd be sitting there saying "Gee, I wish we had Longmire and 1 flag instead"

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

Lyon was the one picked to succeed Roos. Longmire was told and supported to apply for the Saints job. He was hot fave until Lyon entered the race late in the piece and waltzed it in.

I wonder what would have happened had RTB not been impatient and taken over from Roos.

 

[Jewelsbon]

Lyon was the one picked to succeed Roos. Longmire was told and supported to apply for the Saints job. He was hot fave until Lyon entered the race late in the piece and waltzed it in.

I wonder what would have happened had RTB not been impatient and taken over from Roos.

Very good what if Unc.
I can't stand Lyon and have never understood those that rave about him as coach. He appears to me to be like Ming the merciless, rapes and pillages the lists to a modicum of success then walks away leaving nothing but ruins behind him.

 

[Wolfgang West]

Lol, If in an alternate reality Clarkson coached us to 4 flags I doubt you'd be sitting there saying "Gee, I wish we had Longmire and 1 flag instead"

lol all you like. I don’t suffer s**t people nor do I like them aligned with anything that means something to me. This club does. To clarify for you and give you another lol lets say we recruited a scumbag like Tarryn Thomas who some people here actually wanted and he kicked the winning goal In a GF at the expense of say recruiting a bloke like Joel Hamling who turned out to be a typical journeyman who provided service but nothing more. I would take Hamling every day of the week. Like Jack Hiscox likes fast players I don’t like s**t people.

 

[Wolfgang West]

Lyon was the one picked to succeed Roos. Longmire was told and supported to apply for the Saints job. He was hot fave until Lyon entered the race late in the piece and waltzed it in.

I wonder what would have happened had RTB not been impatient and taken over from Roos.

Spot on. Good memory Uncle. Luck was on our side there though.

 

[Olian]

Lyon was the one picked to succeed Roos. Longmire was told and supported to apply for the Saints job. He was hot fave until Lyon entered the race late in the piece and waltzed it in.

I wonder what would have happened had RTB not been impatient and taken over from Roos.

That is a true sliding doors moment.

Lyon has taken two clubs with a poor premiership history to the grand final. A little bit of luck with either club and he’d be a premiership coach.

Longmire probably wouldn’t be so harshly judged on this thread if he’d squared the ledger in grand finals.

 

[MR0808]

That is a true sliding doors moment.

Lyon has taken two clubs with a poor premiership history to the grand final. A little bit of luck with either club and he’d be a premiership coach.

Longmire probably wouldn’t be so harshly judged on this thread if he’d squared the ledger in grand finals.

I think this is it. We didn't just lose, we got smashed in two, and another we had umpiring issues, but ultimately, given the 2016 team vs the bulldogs, we should never have been in that situation

 

[Caj]

Hmmm what a bizarre hypothetical

You certainly are grasping at straws

 

[GoTheSwannies]

I think this is it. We didn't just lose, we got smashed in two, and another we had umpiring issues, but ultimately, given the 2016 team vs the bulldogs, we should never have been in that situation

Outside of the shocking umpiring, I put 2016 down to list management issues and a bit of bad luck with injuries. Signing Buddy after signing Tippett on big money. As well as the trade ban and removal of COLA meant that we had to go with youth after shedding quite a bit of experience. Evidenced by the fact that we had a lot of inexperienced players on GF day.

A lot of people questioned McVeighs inclusion, but when you're taking in players like Heeney (38th career game), Zac Jones (31st game) and bloody Xavier Richards (12) and first year players Mills (22), Papley (20), and Hewett (24), it's obvious the cupboard was bare and we needed to field McVeigh, even if he was severely hampered.

Add to that Buddy's ankle at the start if the game and hanners taken out later in the game and we were really up against it. The umpiring was just the final straw.

The footy gods weren't smiling on us that day, and the AFL had the umpires on the fairytale story, the rest is history.