Coach John Longmire - Part IV

[Callipygian]

I have completely lost faith in his ability to make a midfield work.

It's been too many years and too many personnel changes all for the same results.

Everything else, great.

If you were right (and I don't feel the same way), then he wouldn't be on his own. He's had plenty of assistant coaches including those are dedicated to that specific task working with him, including the putative coach-in-waiting, Dean Cox (could you put Jarrad in the same basket?), and also including the likes of Don Pyke and Stuey Dew.

 

[The King!]

If you were right (and I don't feel the same way), then he wouldn't be on his own. He's had plenty of assistant coaches including those are dedicated to that specific task working with him, including the putative coach-in-waiting, Dean Cox (could you put Jarrad in the same basket?), and also including the likes of Don Pyke and Stuey Dew.

He's the head coach and it's his gameplan, or are we now giving credit to the other coaches for the areas that work?

But I think they all are responsible and at the top sits Horse be it good bad or indifferent .

That's why I am also not keen on just passing the torch to Cox.

I think Horse seems to work quite well with his assistants but interesting none of his assistants really go on to do anything else like Clarkson, Thompson and other long term coaches assistants do.
Dew was a fail at the Suns for instance

 

[bedford]

He's the head coach and it's his gameplan, or are we now giving credit to the other coaches for the areas that work?

But I think they all are responsible and at the top sits Horse be it good bad or indifferent .

That's why I am also not keen on just passing the torch to Cox

We seem to only employ older coaches as back up , never anyone out of the game , only Macca and he's never seen another club.

 

[Arrr]

We seem to only employ older coaches as back up , never anyone out of the game , only Macca and he's never seen another club.

I think it's been stated before but apparently it's quite difficult to attract assistant coaching talent to Sydney for financial reasons.
Way less media, appearance based opportunities, more expensive housing, less job availability.
I think that's why we often end up with ex swans players involved in the coaching ranks. We even have ex giants staff with us now.

 

[The King!]

We seem to only employ older coaches as back up , never anyone out of the game , only Macca and he's never seen another club.

As long as we get the best we can, and Horse wants them there then it's all good .

It would be fascinating to see who does what and how it all works in the swans coaching team

 

[bedford]

I think it's been stated before but apparently it's quite difficult to attract assistant coaching talent to Sydney for financial reasons.
Way less media, appearance based opportunities, more expensive housing, less job availability.
I think that's why we often end up with ex swans players involved in the coaching ranks. We even have ex giants staff with us now.

They don't have to be superstars eg. blokes like Andrew McWalter who is fantastic

 

[Arrr]

They don't have to be superstars eg. blokes like Andrew McWalter who is fantastic

Well that's a tricky one because if you need to overpay to get them up here maybe you do want to get a really highly rated. If we just need good coaches to fill the coaching and backroom staffing roles then maybe we should just shop locally. Ideally you want to be getting staff in from a bigger range of backgrounds and various styles if coaching philosophies to get different perspectives. Unfortunately that's one area that out of Victoria clubs will always be at a disadvantage with.

 

[bedford]

Well that's a tricky one because if you need to overpay to get them up here maybe you do want to get a really highly rated. If we just need good coaches to fill the coaching and backroom staffing roles then maybe we should just shop locally. Ideally you want to be getting staff in from a bigger range of backgrounds and various styles if coaching philosophies to get different perspectives. Unfortunately that's one area that out of Victoria clubs will always be at a disadvantage with.

Wasn't that posted earlier !

 

[Callipygian]

A small point: if it's necessary to pay more to get quality coaching staff, maybe we should do it? Unlike with players, it's only a soft cap, meaning you can spend more than the cap only you get taxed substantially.

 

[Caj]

I have completely lost faith in his ability to make a midfield work.

It's been too many years and too many personnel changes all for the same results.

Everything else, great.

Am I allowed to say I told you so?

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

Necessity is the mother of invention. Missing Mills and Parker required a different approach. We are running more players through and are less predictable than the staid clearance averse midfield we served up last year

 

[Callipygian]

I note that the Pies went into their shell in the second half and started trying to protect their lead and nearly lost to the Hawks. McRae's got a premiership but if we did that people would be baying for Horse's blood and saying he'll never win another flag.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

I note that the Pies went into their shell in the second half and started trying to protect their lead and nearly lost to the Hawks. McRae's got a premiership but if we did that people would be baying for Horse's blood and saying he'll never win another flag.

I think the difference is the Pies look buggered and its not done per instruction from McRae.

They just cant sustain 4 quarters anymore with the age profile of that team.

 

[zyzzbruh]

I think the difference is the Pies look buggered and its not done per instruction from McRae.

They just cant sustain 4 quarters anymore with the age profile of that team.

They won a premiership 6 games ago. Geelong also did it with a team of geriatrics so I'm not buying that.

I think Nick's comment - you're never as good as what you are and you're also never as bad, rings true. Subtle changes from mentality, energy, momentum, personnel etc can make a huge difference on results.

Ultimately we have a team that can beat anyone, and could also lose to anyone. Holding onto hope that we can get our mix right at the right end of the season. Our biggest asset is fast paced attack from defence with efficient disposal - it goes to water when the oppo out pressures us. Need to find consistency in our pressure game to keep that advantage, because when we're on top in that area the best teams can't handle us. Add finding another gear in our midfield contested game and we'd be unstoppable. Super frustrating that we can't seem to get a hold of it. A midfield of Rowy, Parker, mills, heeney, Adams, Chad, papley, Errol seems more than capable. Can't put my finger on it.

 

[Kirkswan]

Lol! this board and it's first world problems...

We're 5:1, about to be 6:1 and there are comments like 'can't coach a midfield' and 'won't win a GF'! Just rubbish!

We're top 3 for goals scored off turnovers (a stat that is in line with 9 of the last 10 premiers), lost one game that we should have won, and generally win by 4-6 goals in the second half, demonstrating that the majority of teams are not good enough to go with us.

And still we have a go at the coach and his team... Hysterical!!!

 

[tombomb]

Lol! this board and it's first world problems...

We're 5:1, about to be 6:1 and there are comments like 'can't coach a midfield' and 'won't win a GF'! Just rubbish!

We're top 3 for goals scored off turnovers (a stat that is in line with 9 of the last 10 premiers), lost one game that we should have won, and generally win by 4-6 goals in the second half, demonstrating that the majority of teams are not good enough to go with us.

And still we have a go at the coach and his team... Hysterical!!!

Boring is the word that comes to mind rather than hysterical.

If something goes right, its because of Cox or Pyke or some other assistant coach.

If something goes wrong, it's Longmire's fault.

Boring.

 

[Callipygian]

Great work by the coaches, including Horse! That win was built on good coaching and years of good development. Clearly a lot of thought went into how we would stop the 'orange tsunami' and how we would counter their attempts to stop our ball transition. And it worked. Beautifully.

Kudos to the players too for playing hard and tough and executing well.

 

[The King!]

September hits he has gone to s**t, regular season is great, but he will be judged on what he does in the finals. We have a team where it is hard to fit players in, they have experience, older now, the profile is perfect. There are no more excuses, he has to deliver worse case a competitive finals series, really a flag.

One reason I doubted he could do it was the stubborness in the middle, in terms of who goes to centre bounces etc.
However the fact two weeks in a row he didnt even pick Parker yet is actually a great sign, maybe not for Parker but if he is leaving Heeney in there , making the midfield his, Gulden, Warners and moving away from the guys who failed in September as the main people thats massive,


But end of the day we can all flex during the year, but we know Horse can finish top of the ladder during the year, its the finals where he fails.

 

[momentbymoment]

Compare that to Longmire when Adams told him he wasn't sure that he wanted to leave Victoria.
Fully understood by Horse, no pressure and then when Adams did move he referred to Longmire as many has done before him as a people person who builds relationships.

At the end of the day a club is its people. Build relationships, built a good work environment and a bit of success along the way makes a happy player and a happy club. As Adams says from Pridham down everyone is in it together and committed.

It’s a really interesting point.
It's possible that Longmire lacks a killer instinct which may affect our grand final results, but has the personality that builds a successful club, which is why we find ourselves playing in finals so often.

Just a thought …

 

[Ticky009]

It’s a really interesting point.
It's possible that Longmire lacks a killer instinct which may affect our grand final results, but has the personality that builds a successful club, which is why we find ourselves playing in finals so often.

Just a thought …

Longmire not lacking a killer instinct... Have you not seen him in the box completely flip out and go nuts when we let a late goal in when we're 50 points up?

You don't get to be a coach this long to a high performing team and NOT have a killing instinct. Very strange comment.

 

[MR0808]

Longmire not lacking a killer instinct... Have you not seen him in the box completely flip out and go nuts when we let a late goal in when we're 50 points up?

You don't get to be a coach this long to a high performing team and NOT have a killing instinct. Very strange comment.

Killer instinct may be the wrong word, but there's something not right about his GF preparation, and I won't pretend to know how to fix it, but whatever we've done the last few, may need to try something different if/when we make it this year

 

[Arrr]

One thing the season shows this far is that it's clear we had a very successful off season on three fronts.
Firstly the trade acquisitions have all fitted in perfectly with 3 being firmly entrenched in our starting 23. Hamling looks like he's fit in really well even if it's in a position we weren't expecting in the twos.
Secondly our fitness levels seem to be much improved on last season we're working back defensively as a group and moving forward in waves. There is very rarely not an easy option available.
Thirdly our systems seem to be second nature to players. Everyone who has come into the side has known their role inside and out (not all have performed but that's not on the coaches). There seems to be a really good balance on players rolling from half back up to the wing, from the wing to inside contest, from inside to half forward. Everyone looks like they know where they should be and what their role is. Roughly a third of players are only playing one position (Logan, Hayward, Wicks Armaty, Grundy, McCartin, Rampe, Melican, Cunningham).
Nice to see that everyone seems to be enjoying that shared role style of game.

 

[momentbymoment]

Longmire not lacking a killer instinct... Have you not seen him in the box completely flip out and go nuts when we let a late goal in when we're 50 points up?

You don't get to be a coach this long to a high performing team and NOT have a killing instinct. Very strange comment.

Maybe I need to explain myself more.
A ‘killer instinct’ is a ruthless determination to win. It (in my opinion) can be seen in Hawthorns ‘unsociable football’, Brad Scott’s ‘edge’ and Essendon’s flirtation with needles. I don’t see it as a positive thing. I’m glad the Swans don’t play dirty and are not ruthless about the game.

I see John as a passionate coach and a leader of men. The type of coach I want in my club.

 

[Caj]

I’m far from a believer but there’s absolutely no reason for Horse bashing when we’re 8-1 and absolutely humming

 

[Gun Island]

I’m far from a believer but there’s absolutely no reason for Horse bashing when we’re 8-1 and absolutely humming

I have been a critic, but at the moment every thing is going beautifully.


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