Autopsy 2024 Rd 7 Blues Go Down To Classy Cats In A Belter

[Arr0w]

I suppose you could force him to watch a Ross Lyon game on repeat.

I'd rather be dropped

 

[TheReal99prelim]

I don't think we do learn though.

We still have terrible forward entries week after week.

Yet some how our coach thinks it's all down to defensive issues...

Terrible or not, the ball is in the danger zone...rather than players sooking (metaphorically speaking) about not getting perfect, pin-point entries, halve the $%^&* contest!!!
Try and spoil the intercept mark if you don't think you can mark, harass, block, chase, tackle with psychotic intent (what better way to win a fk for HTB, create another stoppage, soccer the ball closer to goal etc etce etc
The longer the ball is inside our 50, the more opportunities are created...and the more breathing space our defenders have

 

[TheReal99prelim]

But our woeful forward system means we waste countless forward entries on easily defended plays.

Compare Geelong who were far cleaner and organised in their forward line to our long balls to at most times outnumbered forwards.

It's quite clear our small forwards are either terrible at that position and don't work hard enough or are not being coached to be better at the craft.

Multiple times our plan was or had to be kick it long to Charlie who has two or three opponents on him.

Multiple times our goals were from scrappy broken down plays rather than well structured forward entries.

Utterly dysfunctional a lot of the time when the ball heads towards our forwards.

We choose to waste countless forward entries

 

[goreds]

"but missing 20m out directly in front, when you have 1 job, is unacceptable and needs to be made an example of to set a benchmark…"

How else do you make an example of a player without dropping them

That was the ‘icing on the cake’ for me.

The ‘1 job’ line is the key!

Small forward job description: Kick goals, be under the talls feet, kick goals, keep the ball inside 50, kick goals, be a menace in the forward 50, kick a goal.
*see Tom Papley

 

[Sinjin Smith]

Not quite sure where to start with this one.

Sinjin Snr came over to watch with myself and Sinjin Jnr with pizza, so was great to have the three generations watching. None of us were actually that disappointed with the game as we saw so many positives, which in effect leads to some down feelings of we really could have won it.

Losses where I see the boys really giving it a crack against a very skilled outfit who are unbeaten I can take. I actually felt more positive after that game compared to the Richmond and Freo victories.

Geelong were just so damn good with their skills on transition and their accuracy by foot I don't think any team would have beaten them.

However I loved Vossy's post game presser. He was filthy, it shows he understands us, the supporters expectations this year. That nearly good is not good enough. You get the feeling it will be a "bring your mouthguard to training" type of week. I hope the boys temper their hunger, train hard but don't get excited or expend emotional energy too early to the point they are sapped on gameday against the filth.

 

[Benaly28]

Big call…

Not in our best side right now if all fit, not even an emergency…

Young’s not even in our best 30!


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[Blue since 72]

I don't think we do learn though.

We still have terrible forward entries week after week.

Yet some how our coach thinks it's all down to defensive issues...

Finally watched Voss's post match presser and he was seething below the surface and probably should be as it was a win that got away from the team.

Re defensive issues, Voss is also covering forward pressure in that statement which just wasn't there allowing quick turnover and fast movement back the other way to an open forward line which made Geelong look really good.

Add in our skill errors/decision making on turnover and it looked a lot tougher when we went forward.

Voss is setting this team up for finals footy pressure where nice clean entries to a leading key are highly unlikely but with so many of our first picked players out the role playing depth is really being tested.

While everyone would like the type of entry Geelong did (which really highlighted our poor defensive pressure in our forward half) our style relies on our half forwards, mids and forward pockets really locking it down in the f50 which just didn't happen. Couple that with some really shocking disposal by foot in particular and here we are.

Really missing Doc, Fog's pressure, Jack Martin's everything, Cerra's foot skills, Cunner's cleanness, Saad's dash and delivery by foot, McGovern's pace and delivery by foot and Mot's pressure and forward nous.

Given the reality of having stars, great role players, lesser role players and young developers making up the list vs who is available to play, there will be a tipping point where "next man" up just doesn't get the job done every time.

 

[Banga19]

Would have been great to pinch it. Our areas to improve are unmistakable. Love that we get another chance against them in June. Get some players back, go to work on our deficiencies and get the team peaking in the back half. Just need to bank wins vs good sides in the coming weeks.

 

[Juddernaut08]

Not quite sure where to start with this one.

Sinjin Snr came over to watch with myself and Sinjin Jnr with pizza, so was great to have the three generations watching. None of us were actually that disappointed with the game as we saw so many positives, which in effect leads to some down feelings of we really could have won it.

Losses where I see the boys really giving it a crack against a very skilled outfit who are unbeaten I can take. I actually felt more positive after that game compared to the Richmond and Freo victories.

Geelong were just so damn good with their skills on transition and their accuracy by foot I don't think any team would have beaten them.

However I loved Vossy's post game presser. He was filthy, it shows he understands us, the supporters expectations this year. That nearly good is not good enough. You get the feeling it will be a "bring your mouthguard to training" type of week. I hope the boys temper their hunger, train hard but don't get excited or expend emotional energy too early to the point they are sapped on gameday against the filth.

Sorry for nitpicking, but wouldn't Sinjin Jr be you?

Your dad is Sinjin Snr.

You are Sinjin Jr.

Your son should be Sinjin III.

 

[Sinjin Smith]

Sorry for nitpicking, but wouldn't Sinjin Jr be you?

Your dad is Sinjin Snr.

You are Sinjin Jr.

Your son should be Sinjin III.

That is logical, however I'm just Sinjin

 

[Arr0w]

That was the ‘icing on the cake’ for me.

The ‘1 job’ line is the key!

Small forward job description: Kick goals, be under the talls feet, kick goals, keep the ball inside 50, kick goals, be a menace in the forward 50, kick a goal.
*see Tom Papley

I completely agree, I'd have those and other metrics that are critical

This will sound strange, but I don't judge a small forward by the goals he kicks, it's all the other metrics that are more vital for team success

Create a turnover, hold the ball in for repeat stoppage, impact a rebound 50

All acts that create more options for team goals

 

[Juddernaut08]

That is logical, however I'm just Sinjin

haha fair!

 

[Coops93]

I've had these thoughts a bit about Charlie lately but haven't shared them. It's a difficult one to criticise is Charlie as he does kick so many goals and impact the game, but I've decided that if our ambition really is the Grand Final, we need to hold players to that standard. So while it may seem harsh just be reminded that I'm talking about a Grand Final standard.

I've noticed this for a little while with Charlie and I think it's what caught him out in the finals series. His positioning is very ambitious. He often positions himself too far from the kicker, say 60-65m, which often means that when he has to come up to the footy when it's sent in long. This means he doesn't impact the contest as he's just too late by a metre or two meaning he can't even effect a spoil on the defender floating for the intercept in front. So often he's not actually providing a good target or hitting packs with the timing to actually effect them. It got worse in the finals as I recall watching him at the Gabba several times calling for the footy over the top despite being over 60m away from the kicker so it is something I've been watching for a little while with him.

He really needs to sort that out as it's great to kick 3 goals in 10 minutes to turn a game, but the moments in between that aren't helping the team.

Another thing is - what the hell has happened to his long range kicking? He was basically automatic from anywhere inside 60 if he decided to turn and go. Now he can barely get the distance from 50 doing it, let alone hit the target. Did I hear right on the night that the commentators said he's 0-10 from kicks beyond 40m this season? That's a dramatically poor return for an easy natural long kick.

 

[goreds]

I completely agree, I'd have those and other metrics that are critical

This will sound strange, but I don't judge a small forward by the goals he kicks, it's all the other metrics that are more vital for team success

Create a turnover, hold the ball in for repeat stoppage, impact a rebound 50

All acts that create more options for team goals

Absolutely totally agree…

But and it’s a big but!

Your 1 wood as a small forward or goal sneak is to make the most of 10 possessions on the scoreboard. Kick the goal…

His numbers are not great across the board, so he’s on notice for mine and 1st dropped…

 

[Sector 7G]

I think part of the problem was this was the slowest Carlton team we have selected all year.

Saad cleans up so much in D50 with his pace.
McG provides drive out of defense. While I don't think Young did much wrong the Cats aren't going to worry about him getting the ball.
Both can come of their man and apply pressure that Young and Cowan can't

Cerra provides the precision kicking inside 50. Too often the kicks to CC didn't get to him and were straight to the man in the hole. Those 3 outs all have penetration in kicking.
Hated seeing Crippa, Kennedy and Hewitt in at the centre bounces on occasions. Just too slow if we lose the clearance.

Carrol was a bad selection for the HF being one paced. Should only play as a mid.

Ollie was really disappointing. Hoped he had turned the corner after a good showing last week. He is giving less than what we would accept from LOB.
Confident that next time we will kick better at goal (not miss 4 easy set shots),get a better run from the umpires (not have 4 goals against us from bad decisions) and have closer to best 22.

I think we have more areas to improve to focus on out of the game than the Cats

 

[JustaBattler]

You don't make a statement by dropping a player for missing a very gettable shot.

You send a player back to the VFL, if they aren't adhering to other facets of their role and or team ethos

You do if there are alternative selections on the table ...

 

[gunslingr]

Another thing is - what the hell has happened to his long range kicking? He was basically automatic from anywhere inside 60 if he decided to turn and go. Now he can barely get the distance from 50 doing it, let alone hit the target. Did I hear right on the night that the commentators said he's 0-10 from kicks beyond 40m this season? That's a dramatically poor return for an easy natural long kick.

I think he's been second-guessing himself too much in those situations this season and has been more hesitant when outside the 50. Reckon he's most consistent when he just marks, wheels around, and kicks.

Reckon he might've also lost a metre or two of distance, which possibly plays into any hesitation if indeed the case - anyone remember which ankle he sorta injured a few weeks back?

 

[Arr0w]

You do if there are alternative selections on the table ...

If the alternative ticks more boxes in terms of output, absolutely

 

[Coops93]

Ollie was really disappointing. Hoped he had turned the corner after a good showing last week. He is giving less than what we would accept from LOB.

Almost agree with your point except the LOB comparison.

Ollie has been limited in his attacking game and probably provides a bit less there than Lochie did, however, he's a much, much better quantity when it comes to defensive patterns, putting his body on the line and supporting the D50. So even though his attacking game isn't there defensively he normally provides plenty.

 

[Sector 7G]

Almost agree with your point except the LOB comparison.

Ollie has been limited in his attacking game and probably provides a bit less there than Lochie did, however, he's a much, much better quantity when it comes to defensive patterns, putting his body on the line and supporting the D50. So even though his attacking game isn't there defensively he normally provides plenty.

LOB averaged 17.7 possession in 2022 when he was given a 2 yr contract. Ollie is averaging 11 this year in a better side and his best is 16. He delivered much more than Ollie has this year.

 

[Soapy V]

Told we had 20 more inside 50's on Saturday

It's been my frustration for last 12 months. We play well but just don't kick enough goals for all the good work we do

Poor connection, poor ball use, poor kicking for goal and injuries to key players need to be addressed. IMO it's the number issue holding us back

 

[Coops93]

LOB averaged 17.7 possession in 2022 when he was given a 2 yr contract. Ollie is averaging 11 this year in a better side and his best is 16. He delivered much more than Ollie has this year.

I didn't argue that Ollie was better. In fact, I agreed Lob was better offensively.

 

[Soapy V]

Almost agree with your point except the LOB comparison.

Ollie has been limited in his attacking game and probably provides a bit less there than Lochie did, however, he's a much, much better quantity when it comes to defensive patterns, putting his body on the line and supporting the D50. So even though his attacking game isn't there defensively he normally provides plenty.

I am very confident that Ollie will be a heck of a player. He's young, in his second year and still needs to get stronger which is a big issue the way we play.

Personally, I think he needs to go back to reserves for a few weeks and get back to winning some football and enjoying himself. I have NO doubt he will bounce back

 

[Coops93]

I am very confident that Ollie will be a heck of a player. He's young, in his second year and still needs to get stronger which is a big issue the way we play.

Personally, I think he needs to go back to reserves for a few weeks and get back to winning some football and enjoying himself. I have NO doubt he will bounce back

Agree, I'd send him back and challenge him to add a layer or 2 to his offensive game. We know he's a great defensive running wing but we need development in the forward half.

 

[morningbrown]

Christ are we really retroactively making LOB out to be good now. Ollie miles ahead.