Victorian Covid Outbreak 2021
- Thread starter Magpie45
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Interesting question: Say someone has bladder cancer that invades both ureteric junctions and causes renal obstruction. The renal obstruction causes acute renal failure and they die from a cardiac arrest due to hyperkalemia. Did they die from bladder cancer or with bladder cancer?
Yeah no idea mate! I hate the whole “died with Covid” shi*. Just tell me if they passed away from Covid and if they were vaccinated or not, they are the only stats I feel are important. Where do you draw the line regarding FROM COVID? A 90 year old with cancer that gets Covid to a fit 25 year old that had a pre-existing medical condition.
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This is the big flaw in the comorbidity argument. Some diseases cause some other effect which is the technical thing that kills, but that doesnt mean the initial disease wasnt the cause. Plus many people are living perfectly healthily with their existing conditions, only for covid to cause that to go downhill fast.
Using their logic, we can also stop caring about HIV. after all, noone dies from hiv, just the other disease they get.
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then trust the doctor who states the cause of death.
say a 40 year old lives perfectly healthily with a hearth condition they are born with, not needing any medication but perhaps just needing to exercise and eat well to control their blood pressure. they then get covid and die from heart failure in hospital. there is no argument that they died from covid.
The answer to "from" or "with" is always the answer to the question: "But for covid would they have died TODAY"?
Thats always the key question.
A 90 year old with say prostate cancer who gets covid and dies from pneumonia is dying from covid, because the covid infection was the key to what caused the death. The cancer is a co-morbid factor.
- Apr 23, 2016
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I think it was kingswood that very clearly and thoroughly explained this, and how the death certificates are written.
There isn't a misreporting conspiracy. There isn't a "died with COVID not of COVID" conspiracy.
COVID doesn't directly kill people, it causes a whole heap of other things that then kills the person. As the fact check article even quotes, it can be the cause of a number of comorbidities that people are wanting to pretend are the real reason they died.
Italy doesn't reduce their death toll by 97% because people who can't understand the data and reporting decide it's so.
- Apr 23, 2016
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ohhhhhh who do we believe?! They both look like shonky articles
Italy's 'From Covid' Death Count Drastically Reduced By Over 97 Percent
Global Technocrat shills who pumped death-rate hysteria to the media, along with dystopian policies, have been exposed in Italy. Worldwide, it is now likely that over 90 percent of deaths were "with COVID" and not "from COVID." This could go down in history as the biggest con the world has ever...www.technocracy.news
Probably not the one you linked, probably the actual quotes from the ISS used in the fact check article.
Yeah fair enoughGood to see they have those stats/split of stats nonetheless
So this now becomes very confusing. People want open and honest communication, but then don't want it?
That's more than reasonable, I just wonder if for the true Data if an underlying condition should be attributed to the patient (not cause of death) or is....?
Does anyone know if there is any truth to the USA junking there stats that no matter the reason to be in hospital or cause of death, if they had covid they were listed as covid patient or covid death?
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Given that was just a conspiracy raised by trump and his supporters to defend his handling of the pandemic, yet nothing was done about it, i think thats all it is. lies and slander by people desperate to downplay the virus.
the only way that would be true is if doctors were literally lying about whether people had covid, which i highly doubt. again, if someone with lifelong existing conditions presents to the hospital with issues and is found to have covid, i think its pretty reasonable to put that down as hospitalisation due to covid.
It is very difficult to tell with US news, they have moved into a post truth world where there is no agreement on common facts anymore. Almost all their news is biased one way or the other and reports different 'facts'.
Unfortunately, as this thread and other media shows, Australia is also moving in that direction.
Sttew
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Was it actually the player or a housemate of the player?
Lol not sure mate, does it matter? He’s double vaxxed, people just can’t let it go.
I always figured if you want to give yourself the best chance to know what's going on in the USA, watch CNN and FOX news and then find the middle ground.
I agree with news going and being the same here. Be great if the news outlets reported what was happening, good, bad or indifferent without the bias or agenda leaning reporting and editing. For example agree or not with the current Protest at Parliament in Melbourne, title it Anti Mandate and Proposed Legislation protest. Not anit-vax.
On a side note, when it was the Trump adminstration pushing Operation Warp Speed it seemed many Democrats were against a vaccine that was ("will be" given the timeline) produced so quickly. They have changed their narrative now however. But that's not a vaccine comment by me, just a seems it's only a good idea if we claim it as our idea that American politics is littered with.
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i think the only good thing you can say about american politics is that at least its not a dictatorship. and even thats kinda sketchy tbh.
Corporationship maybe?
It is interesting with their freedom of choice values compared to ours. Say Seat belts for example, I always saw that as common sense rather than a personal freedom removed. However if I am understanding many of the vaccine mandate policies that are being heavily contested by many over there, you don't have to get the injection, as long as you test regularly. If that includes the new swab tests rather than the stick up the snout, I think (but just a personal opinion) most people here would not raise an eyelid and see that as fair and reasonable.
Seriously Dude, WTF.
In the past few days you've rolled with this garbage, the ivermectin falsehood, and that the Vaccine must be unsafe because 0.5% of nurses don't want it!
****, don't you think it's time to lay off social media for a bit?
It's just embarrassing.
- Apr 23, 2016
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Do these people come in thinking they've finally cracked it, they've found this new ground-breaking information on social media that will suddenly make everyone Wake Up and Open Their Eyes?
It's all the same old trash arguments that have been coming out for 18 months now.
If Ivermectin worked so well, we wouldn't be sitting here scratching to find any form of genuine proof after 18 months of the world desperately crying out for something that definitely works.
If the 0.5% of nurses not getting the vaccine is so convincing, what does the 99.5% of nurses and doctors getting it say.
They must all follow the same alt-news social media groups, there's nothing 'new' coming out, they just all rush in with the same old tired things at once every few days. Whatever the latest talking point is.
Just bringing up for an possible interesting way things might move forward and not suggesting the level of truth either way. However it is interesting none the less. There are discussions that the new medicine being floated to combat Covid if infected, has similar traits to other established medicines. But just different enough in make up to be able to get a patent. Be interesting to see how that and the discussion on it develops.
- Apr 23, 2016
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Or are they just different enough to work?
False DUDE. Made a gag about Pfizermectin (tongue in cheek), was genuinely asking when the new pfizer tablets were going to be released. That’s your problem if you can’t handle a joke. If you would like me to reword it “when are the new pfizer tablets being released in Australia?”. There you go boring.
The same poster that said 99% of nurses want it, then 10 mins later said 99.5% want it. Which one is it mr perfection?
And then I said I thought it was odd nurses, ambos and doctors didn’t want to take the vaccine, when I assumed they should know it was safe. Didn’t pick any sides, simply thought it was odd. HOW DARE I THINK SOMETHING IS ODD!
That’s your issue if you want to turn these around.
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