List Mgmt. Welcome Archer Reid (Pick 30, 2023 National Draft)

[AsterixTheGaul]

My one wish for Archer is to watch and replicate the ball drop of Jack Williams when taking set shots.

His right hand at the moment is lacking the final guide down prior to releasing. I was right behind his shot on Sunday and it is a pretty easy one to change. Set shots are about routine and committing to the process. These can be changed much easier that kicking in general play

 

[WCE777]

Archer will be a KF not a KPD, and he will be a beastly one at that in a few years time. Would be a total waste down back

why?

 

[RanaNaved]

why?

A decent KD is easier to find than a good key forward.

 

[WCE777]

A decent KD is easier to find than a good key forward.

The question this year will be who is the next KF or KD following through.
Archer can't kick a goal to save himself at the moment and whether that is technical or fixable I am sure WC will find out.
Shanahan can mark everything and kick straight, he displayed it when playing VFL last year with the bombers and his preseason WAFL form seems to imply a KF in the making, he could also be a KD player with his ability.
We might just have a KF & KD on our list already and its down to who turns out to be the next KF as too who ends up in KD.
A Reid might just be our next ruck if he keeps developing like he is.

 

[stallon]

A decent KD is easier to find than a good key forward.

Probably because good KPDs are usually failed KPFs

 

[RanaNaved]

The question this year will be who is the next KF or KD following through.
Archer can't kick a goal to save himself at the moment and whether that is technical or fixable I am sure WC will find out.
Shanahan can mark everything and kick straight, he displayed it when playing VFL last year with the bombers and his preseason WAFL form seems to imply a KF in the making, he could also be a KD player with his ability.
We might just have a KF & KD on our list already and its down to who turns out to be the next KF as too who ends up in KD.
A Reid might just be our next ruck if he keeps developing like he is.

His kicking isn't that bad and will in theory only get better

 

[Yeahnahmate]

Archer will be a KF not a KPD, and he will be a beastly one at that in a few years time. Would be a total waste down back

You won’t be a waste down back if you become a star key defender. Also the counterpoint above is at least supposedly from the bloke that recruited him / a known looney.

I do see his ability to read the ball in flight, his height and great hands means he’s a headache matchup even when playing deep forward, close to goal. I say keep going how we are with him because he’s way ahead of schedule as it is for a key tall. He’ll be a gun somewhere this young fella

 

[THE A5]

He’s a bloody great talent but his poor set shot kicking really makes it hard to get overly excited. Most players when they mark it in 50 they genuinely get the sense that they have a great chance of kicking it. With him it unfortunately feels like Gaff lining up +35m out.

We’ve had some great set shot kickers in the last few years and I hope the club gets on the front foot and gets lecca and Jk to come in and help him sort it out.

 

[WCE777]

Probably because good KPDs are usually failed KPFs

seriously you blokes, showed none of you have played KDEF before.
If that's how we draft and look at players we are stuffed.
Ask Sam Taylor/Gov/Barrass/Harris Andrews/Alex Pearce/Jacob Weitering if they are failed KPF's?
KPD & KPF are of similar ability and usually the good ones can play either well.
Usually get a couple of years into their development and usually KP players progress more to 1 or the other.

 

[WCE777]

You won’t be a waste down back if you become a star key defender. Also the counterpoint above is at least supposedly from the bloke that recruited him / a known looney.

I do see his ability to read the ball in flight, his height and great hands means he’s a headache matchup even when playing deep forward, close to goal. I say keep going how we are with him because he’s way ahead of schedule as it is for a key tall. He’ll be a gun somewhere this young fella

totally

 

[Dom sheed pocket]

Probably because good KPDs are usually failed KPFs

Eh, I definitely feel like this was the thinking, but has changed pretty dramatically in the last 6-7 years.

Weitering was a number 1 draft pick as a key defender, which would have been unheard of once upon a time.

Key backs are probably now their own thing, and are seen as distinct from KPF's even in the juniors.

 

[FKASC]

He’s a bloody great talent but his poor set shot kicking really makes it hard to get overly excited. Most players when they mark it in 50 they genuinely get the sense that they have a great chance of kicking it. With him it unfortunately feels like Gaff lining up +35m out.

We’ve had some great set shot kickers in the last few years and I hope the club gets on the front foot and gets lecca and Jk to come in and help him sort it out.

I’m critical of his set shot kicking, and have been after seeing him miss some sitters at wafl level last year. but at the same time I do think we should at least let him build confidence first before judging him too harshly. 204 cm 19-20 year olds are gonna be pretty shaky for a while

 

[WCEswift]

I’m critical of his set shot kicking, and have been after seeing him miss some sitters at wafl level last year. but at the same time I do think we should at least let him build confidence first before judging him too harshly. 204 cm 19-20 year olds are gonna be pretty shaky for a while

He wont de-wonky till 22 or 23 (coming from someone taller) i would like him to watch Darcy from the wbd set shot he seems more stable

 

[stallon]

seriously you blokes, showed none of you have played KDEF before.
If that's how we draft and look at players we are stuffed.
Ask Sam Taylor/Gov/Barrass/Harris Andrews/Alex Pearce/Jacob Weitering if they are failed KPF's?
KPD & KPF are of similar ability and usually the good ones can play either well.
Usually get a couple of years into their development and usually KP players progress more to 1 or the other.

Pretty sure Gov was drafted as a KPF
Im sure its been spoken about quite a bit that Barrass played KPF in his junior years- hence the talk of swinging him forward at times?
The others im not as familiar with

Eh, I definitely feel like this was the thinking, but has changed pretty dramatically in the last 6-7 years.

Weitering was a number 1 draft pick as a key defender, which would have been unheard of once upon a time.

Key backs are probably now their own thing, and are seen as distinct from KPF's even in the juniors.

"usually"
Perhaps its a bit of a thing of the past, but a lot of them are still KPFs turned into KPDs, they just are better at identifying it now at an earlier age, so we dont see it

 

[kane249]

Hunter, McIntosh and Jakovich all started their careers forward as well from memory

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

Lever and May are examples of KPP players that played significant time as a forward and back in TAC

 

[RanaNaved]

Yeah May used to kick bags as a junior iirc. Gov was a KF/ruck at Claremont, Moore was a KF, Liam Jones and Rory Lobb, the list goes on

 

[Happy Mastenator]

He's a very, very talented young player who did very well given his age and level of development so far. I still think far and away long term his best position is as a FB. He is also the potential systemic solution that I want to see in coaching. A KPD who can play as the second ruck.

At 204 and with 3-4 years of development however he may well be our ruck solution long term.

His issue as a forward unless we are beyond lucky is that he is and always has been a poor shot on goal and an average field kick (even for a tall). He is however a very, very smart player which is why I don't mind him at ground level as he will follow up the ruck very well or he will make a KPD who is as tall or taller, faster and more athletic than almost all key forwards. He is however again though 3 preseasons away from being strong enough to take that primary role.

WHy would you be pushing for FB over CHB.

Given his mobility and fluidity, i think CHB would be preferable? Don't want him bulking up as much as FB would require?

 

[WCE_phil]

WHy would you be pushing for FB over CHB.

Given his mobility and fluidity, i think CHB would be preferable? Don't want him bulking up as much as FB would require?

1. FB is easier to play
2. CHB requires more kicking.

I'd prefer for him to lock down on an opponent, bring the ball to ground or spoil and through his smarts beat out his opponents 1 vs 1.

 

[Happy Mastenator]

1. FB is easier to play
2. CHB requires more kicking.

I'd prefer for him to lock down on an opponent, bring the ball to ground or spoil and through his smarts beat out his opponents 1 vs 1.

Fair enough.

As much as anything i guess it's a reflection of how important kicking is these days. You just can't afford to carry crap kicks. Sadly we have a stack of them.

 

[WCE777]

1. FB is easier to play
2. CHB requires more kicking.

I'd prefer for him to lock down on an opponent, bring the ball to ground or spoil and through his smarts beat out his opponents 1 vs 1.

Can I ask.
In Archers press conference yesterday he thought he was best suited to the RUCK/KFWD role.
Do you see him as a number 1 ruck with his craft already?

Brock on WAFL form and pre-season looks like he is a decent KDEF option, I think we may find out fairly quickly with Gov out for 4 weeks.

You have mentioned Shanahan you see as a KFWD, also can play KDEF, maybe that CHB spot.

Is Barnett and Livingstone progressing enough in another position or have the skills to be KP players moving forward and warrant another contract?

 

[RanaNaved]

I don't understand why people to talk to phil like he knows what's going on, he's as clueless as anyone on here. It's kind of embarrassing

 

[WCE777]

I don't understand why people to talk to phil like he knows what's going on, he's as clueless as anyone on here. It's kind of embarrassing

They are questions to someone who has insights at the club in the past and also seems seems to have a good grip on players and their abilities.

Whether he is right or not on everything is irrelevant?
He shares his views and and we can take it as we wish, whether his opinions or insights are as clueless as the next person, well that is for those to judge who pay attention too it.

Just like my opinion or yours are of any value to anyone?
Like we all do on here on this platform, we have opinions and sometimes insights and sometimes nothing more than thoughts or vibes from what I can see.

We should all be free to express whatever opinions we all have and the consumer "us" can judge for ourselves the validity and respect we place on those opinions, like all adults should.

 

[RanaNaved]

They are questions to someone who has insights at the club in the past and also seems seems to have a good grip on players and their abilities.

Whether he is right or not on everything is irrelevant?
He shares his views and and we can take it as we wish, whether his opinions or insights are as clueless as the next person, well that is for those to judge who pay attention too it.

Just like my opinion or yours are of any value to anyone?
Like we all do on here on this platform, we have opinions and sometimes insights and sometimes nothing more than thoughts or vibes from what I can see.

We should all be free to express whatever opinions we all have and the consumer "us" can judge for ourselves the validity and respect we place on those opinions, like all adults should.

He's a snake oil salesman

 

[Bender_]

He's a snake oil salesman

Oh thank f*ck, I've been looking everywhere for one since my hypochondriasis started acting up again.