List Mgmt. The 2024 Draft (Nov 20/21)

[Keys]

Quick links

• Player contract status
• Draft prospect video highlights (thanks to noobermensch)
• Provisional 2025 Draft order

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Drafted

• Bo Allan - Pick 16
• Jobe Shanahan - Pick 30
• Tom Gross - Pick 46
• Lucca Grego - Pick 48
• Hamish Davis - Pick 65
• Malakai Champion - Cat B

List Spots Available

• One on either main OR rookie list to be filled as a SSP selection following train on assessments

Trade and draft period

In: F1, F2, F3, Baker, Owies, Graham, Allan, Shanahan, Gross, Grego, Davis, Champion
Out: 3, 63, F3, F4, Barrass, Darling

 

[PremiershipNo4]

When’s the protest starting? “we want Irish, I like Guinness, 1,2,3”

 

[Dark Sharks]

Damn, not signing that 1 random Cat B irishman has probably cost us multiple flags i reckon.

 

[Keys]

Rookie Players - AFL.com.au

Australian Football League. All the latest AFL news, video, results and information

www.afl.com.au

That’s out of date

This is from the current CBA

https://www.aflplayers.com.au/app/uploads/2024/01/2023-2027-Collective-Bargaining-Agreement-FINAL.pdf

 

[GoEaglesGoSGIO]

That’s out of date

This is from the current CBA

https://www.aflplayers.com.au/app/uploads/2024/01/2023-2027-Collective-Bargaining-Agreement-FINAL.pdf

View attachment 2157214

Wow okay. I thought it was changed post COVID to be honest. In that case play on. Dewar/Livingstone are the right choices

 

[mattyc75]

Probably.

In all likelihood.

You dont sound really confident in your opinion here.

Sorry unlike yourself i don't own a crystal ball

On SM-S921B using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[mattyc75]

Why?

Jack has shown much more that Bailey or Flynn.

Its like soe posters just love to imagine a negative outcome in every scenario.


Agreed. A serious upgrade on the Mark Seaby ruck/forward as a player.
-
Edit: Younger posters frowning. Who the hell is Mark Seaby

I like JWilliams, he's shown some good stuff but he's not a first choice ruckman and he won't be a first choice forward barring injury or a major reshuffle.
He'll be there when we need him but I can see him playing plenty of time in the beagles

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[JackOutback]

I like JWilliams, he's shown some good stuff but he's not a first choice ruckman and he won't be a first choice forward barring injury or a major reshuffle.
He'll be there when we need him but I can see him playing plenty of time in the beagles

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I can 100 per cent see him being our full forward with Allen at CHF and Waterman floating around. He's been very impressive given he was forced to play long before he was ready in the COVID years.

 

[Grahame]

Until something changes hes still the captain, im not sure what youre trying to prove here

OP was a pretty simple question I’d have thought.

When will the 2025 leadership group be announced?

 

[Altum Volantes]

Usually when they are back after Christmas and have been training for about a month - so late Jan, early Feb…

So wait until then, get rid of him as skipper, low ball him on the contract early and then force a trade during FA?

Pretty straight forward.

 

[Byron_Clanger]

Pretty sure the players vote on who the captain is. Which means the only way the captain(s) will no longer be the captains is if they literally put their hands up and say they don't wanna be captain anymore ala Hurn at the end of '19 and when Shuey pulled the pin.

When you think about it, it's kinda wild Hurn played for another four years after stepping down as captain. The Covid era was such a blur I just assumed he played for one or two more years then called it.

 

[stallon]

Since you’re happy to be proven wrong……

There number of Cat B rookies allowed was reduced to 2 at the same time as list sizes were reduced to 42 during Covid for the 2021 season

It hasn’t been changed back since

Last year, Jordyn Baker was shifted from the Cat B list to the rookie list to create the spot necessary to add Livingstone as a Cat B. He and Dewar are our two Cat B rookies

If we wanted to run the risk of Champion not being bid on and adding him as a Cat B, we’d have to move Dewar (or Livingstone) to the rookie list first

We won’t do that however, because if we did and a bid came for Champion we’d then be one player short on our list.

Mind you, then we could chase an Irishman

Do you know if we can do the swap of Dewar to main rookie list between the draft and rookie draft, so we can see whether Champion gets drafted or not first?
Or do we have to guess on where Champion goes

 

[mattyc75]

I can 100 per cent see him being our full forward with Allen at CHF and Waterman floating around. He's been very impressive given he was forced to play long before he was ready in the COVID years.

If waterman continues the form he showed last season he should be played at full forward.
He's sacrificed his game for years playing up the ground but now he's the main man

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[PremiershipNo4]

If waterman continues the form he showed last season he should be played at full forward.
He's sacrificed his game for years playing up the ground but now he's the main man

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Isn’t it great that our Forward line actually looks very strong, with many options tall and small, and with pressure coming from those outside the 22.
We just need to find the players to get it down there more often, and I think we will be much improved in that area in 2025.

 

[sharps24]

I can 100 per cent see him being our full forward with Allen at CHF and Waterman floating around. He's been very impressive given he was forced to play long before he was ready in the COVID years.

So we've just signed and AA selected Waterman up on a million a season for 5 years and we're going to send him back to the role he was irrelevant in, because some 4th round pick has shown some good signs spending 20% of games in the ruck and kicking some goals against the other sides 3rd defender? I mean I can totally see Simmo doing that but probably not the new coach.

I love J Williams, also love Archer Reid, if Flynn has a good preseason neither of them stand much chance of playing much senior footy next season though. The reality of AFL football for talls is that career success depends as much [probably more] on luck as it does on talent. If injuries weren't a thing Jack Williams would be on 0 AFL games. If Allen, Waterman, Bailey Williams and Flynn stay fit this year he will struggle to get an opportunity.

Luckily for him, odds are someone will get injured and he'll continue to get games and develop. It's no certainty though.

 

[sharps24]

If waterman continues the form he showed last season he should be played at full forward.
He's sacrificed his game for years playing up the ground but now he's the main man

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He's easily the better option, comparing Jakes 2024 to Oscars 2023 is pretty wild. Both finished on 53 goals but Jake did it with 3 fewer games, and basically smashed Oscar in every other stat along the way.

Jake Waterman and Oscar Allen AFL Stats Comparison

Jake Waterman and Oscar Allen AFL Stats Comparison.

www.footywire.com

 

[Goroyals22]

So we've just signed and AA selected Waterman up on a million a season for 5 years and we're going to send him back to the role he was irrelevant in, because some 4th round pick has shown some good signs spending 20% of games in the ruck and kicking some goals against the other sides 3rd defender? I mean I can totally see Simmo doing that but probably not the new coach.

I love J Williams, also love Archer Reid, if Flynn has a good preseason neither of them stand much chance of playing much senior footy next season though. The reality of AFL football for talls is that career success depends as much [probably more] on luck as it does on talent. If injuries weren't a thing Jack Williams would be on 0 AFL games. If Allen, Waterman, Bailey Williams and Flynn stay fit this year he will struggle to get an opportunity.

Luckily for him, odds are someone will get injured and he'll continue to get games and develop. It's no certainty though.

There is no logical way in any world that b Williams plays football ahead of j Williams if Flynn is fit… none


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[stallon]

He's easily the better option, comparing Jakes 2024 to Oscars 2023 is pretty wild. Both finished on 53 goals but Jake did it with 3 fewer games, and basically smashed Oscar in every other stat along the way.

Jake Waterman and Oscar Allen AFL Stats Comparison

Jake Waterman and Oscar Allen AFL Stats Comparison.

www.footywire.com

Waterman did it in a much better side than Allen had.

 

[sharps24]

There is no logical way in any world that b Williams plays football ahead of j Williams if Flynn is fit… none


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If all are fit B Williams will likely play ahead of both of them.

 

[eaglevision]

If all are fit B Williams will likely play ahead of both of them.

I watched most sessions last summer before Flynn avulsed his hamstring. There is no way on earth B Williams is selected before Flynn as primary ruck if both are fully fit and have a similar preseason until that injury. Flynn absolutely dominated him and gave the mids first use in pretty much every simulation.

If we’re serious about development there is also no way B Williams should be selected as forward/ruck before J Williams both on ability and future planning.

In my view B Williams is depth for Flynn and if we actually have some balls and rookie Knobel and he spends the summer in the strong room then B Williams could be looking for a trade at the end of 2025.

 

[Obeanie1]

Sorry unlike yourself i don't own a crystal ball

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Actually looks like you do.

The Crystal ball of doom and gloom.

 

[Keys]

Do you know if we can do the swap of Dewar to main rookie list between the draft and rookie draft, so we can see whether Champion gets drafted or not first?
Or do we have to guess on where Champion goes

I had thought it was possible to transfer a Cat B player to the regular rookie list after the main draft but another poster (might have been WCE_phil ) has said it needs to be done prior to the draft

Personally think a bid will come at some point late in the draft but if not we can just take him with our last pick. Or we could hold over to the rookie draft on the assumption neither Richmond or North select him first (this would mean we couldn’t draft Knobel as a rookie though)

 

[sharps24]

Waterman did it in a much better side than Allen had.

This is a nonsense argument.

At the end of the day we won 2 more games in 2024, but had more 100 point losses so it's hardly a big difference. In fact it seems like being a "much better side" meant we kicked a grand total of 29 extra goals for the season. Whats that a tad over 1 more a game?

The Eagles in 2023 had no trouble scoring and for the most part, the defeats came from conceding great numbers of goals due to missing players down back.

If you look at the output of Allen, Waterman, Darling, Cripps, J Williams and Ryan across 2023/2024, the evidence suggests Allen kicked his 53 being the primary focal point and Waterman kicked his 53 in a team that shared the goals around.

Waterman almost certainly had less opportunity than Allen the year before, most likely because he would have spent far less time just sitting at ff given his superior work rate.

So 2024 Jack kicks same as Oscar 2023 [in 3 less games]

However, in 2024 v 2023

Cripps kicks +11
Ryan +9,
Jack Williams + 11
JD goes slightly backwards -4.
Then Oscar kicks + 9 compared to Waterman 2023 [if we say for arguments sake they swapped roles]

Rough math, the main non full forwards kicked an extra 36 goals compared to last year while the team overall was up 29 goals total. Can't be bothered looking into Long v Dewar and Maric stats and whether midfield kicked more or less and all that.

It's improved forward output but only highlights the fact that the forward line with Oscar in 23 was more one dimensional than it was with Waterman. [Or that comparatively Oscar played more stay at home than Waterman meaning the other forwards were less likely to be hit up as targets]

 

[Obeanie1]

There is no logical way in any world that b Williams plays football ahead of j Williams if Flynn is fit… none


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Unless J Williams is not fit or loses form that is.

We have some serious competition for that ruck/ forward position which is a good problem to have. That is how teams improve, pressure from below.

Right now Id rank the ruck / forward position pecking order as:

1 J Williams
2. B Williams
3. A Ried
4. Livingston
5. Barnett


For rhe #1 ruck

1 Flynn
2 B Williams
3 ......checks notes...........hmmmmm nothing.

Just how and when it that problem is going to be addressed? Who knows.

 

[Obeanie1]

Usually when they are back after Christmas and have been training for about a month - so late Jan, early Feb…

So wait until then, get rid of him as skipper, low ball him on the contract early and then force a trade during FA?

Pretty straight forward.

The club has made a comittment with Oscar.

And you are now suggesting the club turf him out for a comoo pick at the end of 2025.

 

[JackOutback]

There is room in the forward line for three talls, particularly when a) Waterman ain’t that tall, and b) JWilliams gives us a second ruck option. How you make that work is why coaches get paid the big bucks.