Collingwood's Rolling Best 22

[Countrypie]

Collingwood after trade period:

B. Scharenberg ~ Keeffe ~ Ramsay
HB. Maynard ~ Reid ~ Howe
C. Adams ~ Treloar ~ Sidebottom
HF. Wells ~ Moore ~ Mayne
F. Elliot ~ Cox ~ Fasolo
R. Grundy ~ Pendlebury (c) ~ De Goey
I. Crisp ~ Varcoe ~ Aish ~ Hoskin-Elliot
C. Buckley

E. White, Langdon, Broomhead


Extra: Phillips, Greenwood, Sinclair, Dunn, Crocker, Smith, Wills, Goldsack

Or Magpie magoos

B. Thomas ~ Dunn ~ Smith
HB. Sinclair ~ Goldsack ~ Langdon
C. Phillips ~ Blair ~ Oxley
HF. Broomhead ~ White ~ Crocker
F. Daicos* ~ Draft ~ Brown*
R. Draft ~ Wills ~ Greenwood
I. Sier ~ draft ~ draft ~ draft

The more I think about this the more comfortable I am with who we've let go. WIth the exception of Brown and Marsh I coudn't see any of them making best 30.
Edit: The fact that Greenwood is not in anyone's best 22 must indicate we have more top end value.

 

[Seedsfan]

I just can't see how we've gone backwards. We've replaced ball butchers with ball users. We'll finish somewhere between 7th and 10th. I expect that next year the competition will even up further (with the exception of GWS) 13 wins might get a place in the top 4 but will still need 12 wins to make 8.

Richmond, Melbourne, St Kilda and Freo will be the 4 sides from outside the 8 fighting it out for finals next year. They have all had far better off seasons than us

 

[Saintly Viewed]

The more I think about this the more comfortable I am with who we've let go. WIth the exception of Brown and Marsh I coudn't see any of them making best 30.
Edit: The fact that Greenwood is not in anyone's best 22 must indicate we have more top end value.

The caveat I'd we get healthy bodies out there.

Elliot would bebhuge, Fasolo likewise, Hoskin Elliot wow if healthy.

A consistent threesome supporting Moore with Mayne pressure sounds terrific to me.

I like Greenwood, he's a bit too maligned for my liking. He's thereabouts

 

[Countrypie]

Richmond, Melbourne, St Kilda and Freo will be the 4 sides from outside the 8 fighting it out for finals next year. They have all had far better off seasons than us

I don't think you can judge where we'll finish on a trade period. There will be several teams slide as well. I can make an argument for every team in the 8 with the exception of GWS to slide next year - how far is a moot point. But I would back our best 22 to be competitive against all comers next year. If we have a run with injuries like Adelaide did last year we make the 8. Its way too early to write the season off. I'm quietly optimistic. We essentially have three possibly 4 new ready made recruits next year Ramsey, Elliott, Sharenberg and you could make an argument for Fasolo as well (missed at least half the year), so let's wait and see.

 

[Gone Critical]

With regard to the 4 new players and a rolling 22 this is where I see them

Wells- Fantastic pick up if we consider 2017. Automatic selection and would expect with a full season he will go close to placing in the Copeland

Mayne- Solid inclusion for 2017. Should be automatic selection based on recent output and should be a good role player. If things go really well may rediscover goal kicking prowess.

Dunn - Probably gets best 22 by default but hopefully is VFL depth because Keeffe is able to make to step back into AFL footy. Will be a solid enough back up but uncertain as he approaches 30 how quick his decline continues to be. Has been said to have lost pace which could be terminal for an older undersized KPB

Hoskin Elliott - Most uncertain of the group. Has X factor and was thoughth to have great potential which has not been realised to date. Record in the 13 games he has managed in 2015-6 is pretty terrible stats wise. He is battling against 3 others who have their own X factor and 2 of which are clearly better players so far in their career. Fas and Elliot are clearly ahead in the small medium forward and Broomy probably just ahead. Based on his record you would think he should start as a VFL player and be told to go out and dominate at that level if he wants to play AFL. Has a bit of the Karnesis about him for now.

 

[Seedsfan]

I don't think you can judge where we'll finish on a trade period. There will be several teams slide as well. I can make an argument for every team in the 8 with the exception of GWS to slide next year - how far is a moot point. But I would back our best 22 to be competitive against all comers next year. If we have a run with injuries like Adelaide did last year we make the 8. Its way too early to write the season off. I'm quietly optimistic. We essentially have three possibly 4 new ready made recruits next year Ramsey, Elliott, Sharenberg and you could make an argument for Fasolo as well (missed at least half the year), so let's wait and see.

Our depth is woeful if we lose a combination of Moore Grundy or Reid for a prolonged period we are a lock for bottom 4. None of our recruits significantly improve us from last year

 

[NoobPie]

. Has a bit of the Karnesis about him for now.

...Except he would overlap him in a 400 metre race

 

[Gone Critical]

The caveat I'd we get healthy bodies out there.

Elliot would bebhuge, Fasolo likewise, Hoskin Elliot wow if healthy.

A consistent threesome supporting Moore with Mayne pressure sounds terrific to me.

I like Greenwood, he's a bit too maligned for my liking. He's thereabouts

Apart from being a pick 4 in 2011 and having a good highlight reel what makes you see Hoskin Elliott in the team immediately. He has come off 2 very ordinary AFL seasons and not done much in the NEAFL.

I see him as a player that needds to prove himself in the VFL by consistent performance before he knocks out any best 22 incumbants.

 

[Countrypie]

Our depth is woeful if we lose a combination of Moore Grundy or Reid for a prolonged period we are a lock for bottom 4. None of our recruits significantly improve us from last year

Our depth was woeful last year - they played in the 1's for most of it. there's still a draft to go through yet, just let it play out

 

[Seedsfan]

Our depth was woeful last year - they played in the 1's for most of it. there's still a draft to go through yet, just let it play out

Are depth was far better for talls last year

 

[Bay Pie]

FB Ramsay Dunn Scharenberg
HB Howe Reid Crisp
C Wells Treloar Sidebottom
HF Fasolo White WHE
FF Elliott Moore Mayne
R Grundy Pendles Adams
INT Aish Varcoe Smith Goldsack

DEPTH Cox DeGoey Maynard Greenwood Blair Langdon Sinclair Broomhead Oxley Wills Phillips Crocker Keeffe Thomas Seir Brown Daicos

That team looks really skillful and mobile. Where have all the ball-butchers gone? Should play finals in 2017 if we get something close to full seasons out of Reid, Grundy, Elliott and Moore. Fingers crossed for better run on injury front than in past three years. We're due a bit of luck.

I'd swap Smith and Goldsack out and include JDG and Maynard. Maynard on HBF with Crispo on interchange. Probably Sinclair to start the year ahead of Ramsay until he's got full confidence in his knee.

Indeed, where have all the ball-butchers gone? I have to go back past 20 years to see a Collingwood team with so few ball-butchers. That should put some of the grey hairs on hold.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Apart from being a pick 4 in 2011 and having a good highlight reel what makes you see Hoskin Elliott in the team immediately. He has come off 2 very ordinary AFL seasons and not done much in the NEAFL.

I see him as a player that needds to prove himself in the VFL by consistent performance before he knocks out any best 22 incumbants.

All true and correct.
I am projecting because if he and a few others like Scharenberg don't reach the better levels, this includes a fully healthy Elliot and Fasolo, I'm afraid winter will be very cold.
So my best twenty two needs a few to step up.

 

[DaVe86]

I'm actually not going to make any changes to my top 22 at this point.

Dunn and WHE are not walk ups at this stage...although realistically both will be there r1. Dunn probably ahead of Goldsack or Langdon at Full back...and WHE probably coming in at the expense of Aish or Greenwood as a forward option.

My VFL 22 will be amended though.

 

[DaVe86]

With regard to the 4 new players and a rolling 22 this is where I see them

Wells- Fantastic pick up if we consider 2017. Automatic selection and would expect with a full season he will go close to placing in the Copeland

Mayne- Solid inclusion for 2017. Should be automatic selection based on recent output and should be a good role player. If things go really well may rediscover goal kicking prowess.

Dunn - Probably gets best 22 by default but hopefully is VFL depth because Keeffe is able to make to step back into AFL footy. Will be a solid enough back up but uncertain as he approaches 30 how quick his decline continues to be. Has been said to have lost pace which could be terminal for an older undersized KPB

Hoskin Elliott - Most uncertain of the group. Has X factor and was thoughth to have great potential which has not been realised to date. Record in the 13 games he has managed in 2015-6 is pretty terrible stats wise. He is battling against 3 others who have their own X factor and 2 of which are clearly better players so far in their career. Fas and Elliot are clearly ahead in the small medium forward and Broomy probably just ahead. Based on his record you would think he should start as a VFL player and be told to go out and dominate at that level if he wants to play AFL. Has a bit of the Karnesis about him for now.

Agree with this. I can't put Hoskin Elliott straight into the 22 until I see how he goes over the off-season.

Dunn is probably in there by default, but for now I'll stick with Langdon and Goldsack in the defensive positions.

I'm a bit underwhelmed with our work over the trade period. While we improve the team with Wells and Mayne, I just don't see the long-term strategy.

We haven't brought in high end draft picks and we look devoid of any depth for Key Position players....which is unlikely to be resolved this year.

All I can hope is that we've cleaned the list up from the list-cloggers, and we will have real crack at a gun player next year.

 

[Gone Critical]

Agree with this. I can't put Hoskin Elliott straight into the 22 until I see how he goes over the off-season.

Dunn is probably in there by default, but for now I'll stick with Langdon and Goldsack in the defensive positions.

I'm a bit underwhelmed with our work over the trade period. While we improve the team with Wells and Mayne, I just don't see the long-term strategy.

We haven't brought in high end draft picks and we look devoid of any depth for Key Position players....which is unlikely to be resolved this year.

All I can hope is that we've cleaned the list up from the list-cloggers, and we will have real crack at a gun player next year.

Fair assessment. We probably didnt have much to work with with no high draft pick and all the players we were moving on having little value. Still as you say it seemed a bit hit and miss without a great plan. KPFs and KPBs are a worry. Will probably take a few seasons of trading and drafting to solve that. List currently unbalanced and still rebuilding.

 

[Jekyll and Hyde]

Our depth is woeful if we lose a combination of Moore Grundy or Reid for a prolonged period we are a lock for bottom 4. None of our recruits significantly improve us from last year

That's all teams!
If Melbourne loose Gawn, hogan and McDonald at the same time, I'm sure that they will struggle too.

 

[Baird]

Ramsay - Guy - Guy
Howe - Reid - Guy
Wells - Adams - Sidebottom
Guy - Guy - Varcoe
Elliott - Moore - Fasolo
Grundy - Pendlebury - Treloar
Crisp - Aish - Guy - Guy

 

[MrStealYourGirl]

To Start the season I reckon it will look like this:
FB:Maynard - Goldsack - Howe
HB:Sinclair - Reid - Smith
C:Sidebottom - Treloar - Wells
HF:Fasolo - Mayne - De Goey
FF: White - Moore - Elliot
R:Grundy - Pendlebury - Adams
B:Crisp - Aish - Varcoe - Langdon

First in line for spots:
1. Hoskin-Elliott - Potentially in for Elliot if he still isn't fit or even Langdon if they feel they're big enough down back.
2. Scharenberg - If he hits the season playing well he'll easily be ahead of Langdon.
3. Dunn - If they're playing against a Hawkins type forward he comes in to take them.
4. Blair - Not best 22, but serviceable and could slot in to one of the small forward spots if an injury occurs.
5. Greenwood - First grunt mid in if an injury occurs. Potential tagging role.
6. Broomhead - Probably behind Blair and WHE for a forward spot but could come in to play on a wing.
7. Cox - Back up ruck and key forward.

Backline - 4 guys over 190cm in Langdon, Howe, Goldsack and Reid so capable of playing on big forwards. Dunn could play if a 'gorilla' forward plays for the opposition (Hawkins, Patton, Casboult, Cloke or Dixon). Howe will come in 3rd man up otherwise, similarly to Easton Wood and Sinclair and Smith provide run off the half-back line. Maynard to play as the #1 lock down defender and take the kick outs along with Howe.

Midfield - Sidebottom and Wells rotating with Aish. Sidebottom to feature more predominantly at HF and Wells will have some runs through the middle with Varcoe having an occasional run there. Pendles, Adams, Treloar, Crisp, De Goey and Wells to be the main centre bounce players and rotating through the middle. Grundy to ruck 85-90% game time.

Forwards - Mayne to play the hit up option from half-back. Moore and Fasolo to stay deep, with White pushing up the ground a bit further. Elliot to play across half forward and needs to lead up and hit back to crumb the packs with Sidebottom and Varcoe been other crumbing options. Langdon potential swing option from the backline if extra height is needed.

 

[mike123]

Seniors:
B: Jeremy Howe ~ Lynden Dunn ~ Jackson Ramsay
HB: Travis Varcoe ~ Ben Reid ~ Will Hoskin-Elliott

C: Daniel Wells ~ Taylor Adams ~ James Aish
R: Brodie Grundy ~ Scott Pendlebury ~ Adam Treloar

HF: Alex Fasolo ~ Chris Mayne ~ Steele Sidebottom
F: Jesse White ~ Darcy Moore ~ Jamie Elliott

I/C: Jordan De Goey ~ Tim Broomhead ~ Brayden Maynard ~ Jack Crisp

Reserves:
B: Tyson Goldsack ~ Lachlan Keeffe ~ Ben Sinclair
HB: Tom Langdon ~ Mathew Scharenberg ~ Adam Oxley

C: Josh Smith ~ Levi Greenwood ~ Tom Phillips
R: Mason Cox ~ Rupert Wills ~ Josh Thomas

HF: Josh Daicos ~ Ben Crocker ~ Callum Brown
F: ????? ~ ????? ~ Jarryd Blair

I/C: Brayden Sier ~ ???? ~ ???? ~ ????

I want to see Keeffe play before I put him ahead of Dunn.

 

[Prochard123]

B: Ramsay ~ Dunn ~ Howe
HB:Maynard ~ Reid ~ Varcoe
C: Wells ~ Pendlebury ~ Sidebottom
HF:Hoskin-Elliot ~ White ~ Mayne
F: Elliot ~ Moore ~ Fasolo
R: Grundy ~ Treloar ~ De Goey
Interchange: Adams, Aish, Broomhead, Crisp

For the bench:
Adams-inside mid/half-back
Aish-half-back/wing
Broomhead-Wing/Half-forward
Crisp-Inside mid/wing

Unlucky: Aish-Comp

MUCH better footskills than last year. Looking across all lines very poor kicks are around.

• Scharenberg is a walk-up starter if fit. He needs to catchup with his development and his elite footskills is enough to justify a selection regardless of his defensive ability
• De Goey needs to play in the centre permanently. No more half-forward bullshit where he doesn't play his best footy. Let him play as a full-time clearance specialists which he obviously enjoys. We're also in need of someone getting the hardball gets at the stoppages. De Goey is a capable half-forward, but any half decent coach needs to identify that he MUST be played as a full time midfielder.
• Happy to see Adams play 50-50 Mid-def, and rotate with the other 6 defenders.
• Dunn is going to be very serviceable. Defensively he's ok for a KPD and offensively he's above average, and is ahead of Keefe early on.
• Plenty of run now with Scharenberg, Howe from defense. Varcoe, Wells, Aish and Sidebottom on the wing. And Hoskin-Elliot/Broomhead at half forward.
• Despite our incredibly poor list management this side still shows plenty of potential
• Our defense and forward line are better in practise than on paper
• Confident we will make finals

 

[Seedsfan]

That's all teams!
If Melbourne loose Gawn, hogan and McDonald at the same time, I'm sure that they will struggle too.

Melbourne have much greater depth then is in their tall stocks than we do

 

[Prochard123]

Seniors:
B: Jeremy Howe ~ Lynden Dunn ~ Jackson Ramsay
HB: Travis Varcoe ~ Ben Reid ~ Will Hoskin-Elliott

C: Daniel Wells ~ Taylor Adams ~ James Aish
R: Brodie Grundy ~ Scott Pendlebury ~ Adam Treloar

HF: Alex Fasolo ~ Chris Mayne ~ Steele Sidebottom
F: Jesse White ~ Darcy Moore ~ Jamie Elliott

I/C: Jordan De Goey ~ Tim Broomhead ~ Brayden Maynard ~ Jack Crisp

Reserves:
B: Tyson Goldsack ~ Lachlan Keeffe ~ Ben Sinclair
HB: Tom Langdon ~ Mathew Scharenberg ~ Adam Oxley

C: Josh Smith ~ Levi Greenwood ~ Tom Phillips
R: Mason Cox ~ Rupert Wills ~ Josh Thomas

HF: Josh Daicos ~ Ben Crocker ~ Callum Brown
F: ????? ~ ????? ~ Jarryd Blair

I/C: Brayden Sier ~ ???? ~ ???? ~ ????

I want to see Keeffe play before I put him ahead of Dunn.

Question:
Why have WHE as half back when we have plenty of candidates for that role and WHE has always been an electrifying half forward?

 

[Prochard123]

To Start the season I reckon it will look like this:
FB:Maynard - Goldsack - Howe
HB:Sinclair - Reid - Smith
C:Sidebottom - Treloar - Wells
HF:Fasolo - Mayne - De Goey
FF: White - Moore - Elliot
R:Grundy - Pendlebury - Adams
B:Crisp - Aish - Varcoe - Langdon

First in line for spots:
1. Hoskin-Elliott - Potentially in for Elliot if he still isn't fit or even Langdon if they feel they're big enough down back.
2. Scharenberg - If he hits the season playing well he'll easily be ahead of Langdon.
3. Dunn - If they're playing against a Hawkins type forward he comes in to take them.
4. Blair - Not best 22, but serviceable and could slot in to one of the small forward spots if an injury occurs.
5. Greenwood - First grunt mid in if an injury occurs. Potential tagging role.
6. Broomhead - Probably behind Blair and WHE for a forward spot but could come in to play on a wing.
7. Cox - Back up ruck and key forward.

Backline - 4 guys over 190cm in Langdon, Howe, Goldsack and Reid so capable of playing on big forwards. Dunn could play if a 'gorilla' forward plays for the opposition (Hawkins, Patton, Casboult, Cloke or Dixon). Howe will come in 3rd man up otherwise, similarly to Easton Wood and Sinclair and Smith provide run off the half-back line. Maynard to play as the #1 lock down defender and take the kick outs along with Howe.

Midfield - Sidebottom and Wells rotating with Aish. Sidebottom to feature more predominantly at HF and Wells will have some runs through the middle with Varcoe having an occasional run there. Pendles, Adams, Treloar, Crisp, De Goey and Wells to be the main centre bounce players and rotating through the middle. Grundy to ruck 85-90% game time.

Forwards - Mayne to play the hit up option from half-back. Moore and Fasolo to stay deep, with White pushing up the ground a bit further. Elliot to play across half forward and needs to lead up and hit back to crumb the packs with Sidebottom and Varcoe been other crumbing options. Langdon potential swing option from the backline if extra height is needed.

Hoskin-Elliot is well ahead of De Goey as a half forward. If you want De Goey you must play him at the centre bounce. Both should be in best 22.

 

[Brent24]

Seniors:
B: Jeremy Howe ~ Lynden Dunn ~ Jackson Ramsay
HB: Travis Varcoe ~ Ben Reid ~ Will Hoskin-Elliott

C: Daniel Wells ~ Taylor Adams ~ James Aish
R: Brodie Grundy ~ Scott Pendlebury ~ Adam Treloar

HF: Alex Fasolo ~ Chris Mayne ~ Steele Sidebottom
F: Jesse White ~ Darcy Moore ~ Jamie Elliott

I/C: Jordan De Goey ~ Tim Broomhead ~ Brayden Maynard ~ Jack Crisp

Reserves:
B: Tyson Goldsack ~ Lachlan Keeffe ~ Ben Sinclair
HB: Tom Langdon ~ Mathew Scharenberg ~ Adam Oxley

C: Josh Smith ~ Levi Greenwood ~ Tom Phillips
R: Mason Cox ~ Rupert Wills ~ Josh Thomas

HF: Josh Daicos ~ Ben Crocker ~ Callum Brown
F: ????? ~ ????? ~ Jarryd Blair

I/C: Brayden Sier ~ ???? ~ ???? ~ ????

I want to see Keeffe play before I put him ahead of Dunn.

Put WHE up forward (I like the smallish mix we would have). Replace him with Sinclair or Sharenberg hopefully. Remove Broomhead*. Otherwise I believe that is a competitive 22.
I rate Broomhead in potential, but i think he's a fair way behind right now.

 

[Prochard123]

Collingwood after trade period:

B. Scharenberg ~ Keeffe ~ Ramsay
HB. Maynard ~ Reid ~ Howe
C. Adams ~ Treloar ~ Sidebottom
HF. Wells ~ Moore ~ Mayne
F. Elliot ~ Cox ~ Fasolo
R. Grundy ~ Pendlebury (c) ~ De Goey
I. Crisp ~ Varcoe ~ Aish ~ Hoskin-Elliot
C. Buckley

E. White, Langdon, Broomhead


Extra: Phillips, Greenwood, Sinclair, Dunn, Crocker, Smith, Wills, Goldsack

Or Magpie magoos

B. Thomas ~ Dunn ~ Smith
HB. Sinclair ~ Goldsack ~ Langdon
C. Phillips ~ Blair ~ Oxley
HF. Broomhead ~ White ~ Crocker
F. Daicos* ~ Draft ~ Brown*
R. Draft ~ Wills ~ Greenwood
I. Sier ~ draft ~ draft ~ draft

This is very good however Wells really needs to be played on the wing and Adams really isn't a winger