Autopsy Well, that happened vs Doggies

[Uncle_Leo]

Brother Leo, reality doesn't sit in on/off, yes/no, good/bad just because your ego is hurt. Once you let go and free yourself you will see Maya for what it is and be at peace

 

[McKuursma]

It isn't an easy adjustment I am aware. Maybe the first step would be recognising what frustrates you in others and then asking yourself why you may identify with that trait. I only mean well Brother Leo

 

[Uncle_Leo]

It isn't an easy adjustment I am aware. Maybe the first step would be recognising what frustrates you in others and then asking yourself why you may identify with that trait. I only mean well Brother Leo

I’ve worked it out. I know what frustrates me. 15 wins in 5 years with no end in sight

 

[McKuursma]

I’ve worked it out. I know what frustrates me. 15 wins in 5 years with no end in sight

I won't argue with you on that, but recognising direction and spin of a particle allows you to understand where it has been and where it is going to go. You are stuck Brother Leo

 

[Passmore]

I won't argue with you on that, but recognising direction and spin of a particle allows you to understand where it has been and where it is going to go. You are stuck Brother Leo

I just want to hear about Leo giving it to the players and coaches about offering excuses at the function he’s off to.

 

[barnrokn]

5 years of shitness, an appalling end to 2024 and they come out Round 1 with question marks over application. How does this happen?

 

[Uncle_Leo]

I just want to hear about Leo giving it to the players and coaches about offering excuses at the function he’s off to.

Where have I said it’s the players and coaches?

Just the imbeciles on here

 

[ferball]

Where have I said it’s the players and coaches?

Just the imbeciles on here

So you're giving shit to the people who aren't responsible for the poor performance for trying to keep some hope about the future.

Nice.

 

[Uncle_Leo]

So you're giving shit to the people who aren't responsible for the poor performance for trying to keep some hope about the future.

Nice.

Giving shit to people who constantly make excuses for poor performance making up ridiculous excuses

Have you read some of the excuses given for last week? Come on

It was hot, Dogs must be used to that.

 

[ferball]

Giving shit to people who constantly make excuses for poor performance making up ridiculous excuses

Have you read some of the excuses given for last week? Come on

It was hot, Dogs must be used to that.

The main reason we lost last week was Cam Z messing up the first half. His missed kicks (to players and on goal) and poor defense cost us seven or eight goals!!! (Depending on whether you blame him for Naughton's first or not, probably other players just as responsible for that tho.) Putting aside all the other stuff, half as many errors from Cam and we win that game.

Without all that he would have been one our best players too. If not BOG.

 

[Passmore]

Where have I said it’s the players and coaches?

Just the imbeciles on here

The players and coaches are the only people who can control what's happening.

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[Only Forwards]

The main reason we lost last week was Cam Z messing up the first half. His missed kicks (to players and on goal) and poor defense cost us seven or eight goals!!! (Depending on whether you blame him for Naughton's first or not, probably other players just as responsible for that tho.) Putting aside all the other stuff, half as many errors from Cam and we win that game.

Without all that he would have been one our best players too. If not BOG.

Nah pinning it on a single player is a bit nonsense IMO. I said Cam was a net negative, but it ain't all on him.

We lost because collectively and individually we have been down so long that the only belief that I can see in the team is one where we believe we are not able to win.

It is why they collectively do not do all the hard things that are required to be done to win games of football.

We have the talent to beat the dogs from last week.

The game in front of us is winnable.

we won't though. Because when push comes to shove, when we absolutely need to do the thing (be it hit a simple handball, put the shepherd in, lead to the space, hit the kick, take the shot) we do not have the mental fortitude to do it. We are not resilient enough in game when it matters.

we show glimpses of having it but we have not put it all together and until we actually do, then my opinion that we mentally can't won't change.

Our club has become the very thing it feared becoming when we used to have the mentality of not being able to bottom out. Now we have and we do not know how to get back up.

Historically we have relied on having a chip on our shoulder. I do not see anywhere near the anger required to say that will be the way out now.

 

[Uncle_Leo]

The main reason we lost last week was Cam Z messing up the first half. His missed kicks (to players and on goal) and poor defense cost us seven or eight goals!!! (Depending on whether you blame him for Naughton's first or not, probably other players just as responsible for that tho.) Putting aside all the other stuff, half as many errors from Cam and we win that game.

Without all that he would have been one our best players too. If not BOG.

The players and coaches are the only people who can control what's happening.

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Thanks captain obvious

So we should stop making excuses like many on here are?

 

[Uncle_Leo]

The game in front of us is winnable.

we won't though. Because when push comes to shove, when we absolutely need to do the thing (be it hit a simple handball, put the shepherd in, lead to the space, hit the kick, take the shot) we do not have the mental fortitude to do it. We are not resilient enough in game when it matters.

we show glimpses of having it but we have not put it all together and until we actually do, then my opinion that we mentally can't won't change.

Our club has become the very thing it feared becoming when we used to have the mentality of not being able to bottom out. Now we have and we do not know how to get back up.

Historically we have relied on having a chip on our shoulder. I do not see anywhere near the anger required to say that will be the way out now.

 

[Passmore]

Thanks captain obvious

So we should stop making excuses like many on here are?

If random, anonymous, forum posters want to make excuses, then go for it. What does it matter?

If we're making excuses internally, then we have a problem.



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[Uncle_Leo]

If random, anonymous, forum posters want to make excuses, then go for it. What does it matter?

If we're making excuses internally, then we have a problem.



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Kind of flys in the face of this comment though doesn't it? People can make excuses but I can't question it?

I just want to hear about Leo giving it to the players and coaches about offering excuses at the function he’s off to.

 

[Frank Thring]

5 years of shitness, an appalling end to 2024 and they come out Round 1 with question marks over application. How does this happen?

I don't think it's application, I actually thought we had a crack but our sloppiness in transition kills us. If it wasn't for effort, we could have lost by 50 plus

 

[ferball]

Nah pinning it on a single player is a bit nonsense IMO. I said Cam was a net negative, but it ain't all on him.

Yes there were other reasons we lost as well be ****ed so much up.

Other players get payed out as whipping boys but he was shocking.

Five missed shots on goal, two where he turned his back on players in better positions, one where he marked in front of Larkey in a spot Larkey is 90% likely to kick the goal from. He missed passes to open players on the lead (ie didn't see them) going inside 50 and his player (Dale) kicked two goals and won multiple contests running off HB to set up other goals. The worst of them was how he stood there next to (less than 10m away) Bailey Dale while Dale ran past him then around kicked one from 50 under absolutely no pressure getting the hands from Gallagher who had a free outside his range.

We lost because collectively and individually we have been down so long that the only belief that I can see in the team is one where we believe we are not able to win.

It is why they collectively do not do all the hard things that are required to be done to win games of football.

He's sposed to be a leader and he could have led by tracking Dale and tackling him on 50, passing off to team mates or letting Larkey mark or just pushing back harder when his player runs off HB. If he set the example by doing those hard things other players would follow. And they'd all feed off the vibe it creates.

We have the talent to beat the dogs from last week.

The game in front of us is winnable.

we won't though. Because when push comes to shove, when we absolutely need to do the thing (be it hit a simple handball, put the shepherd in, lead to the space, hit the kick, take the shot) we do not have the mental fortitude to do it. We are not resilient enough in game when it matters.

Yes. And a big part of that is on Cam. He is guilty of all that stuff you just mentioned.

we show glimpses of having it but we have not put it all together and until we actually do, then my opinion that we mentally can't won't change.

Our club has become the very thing it feared becoming when we used to have the mentality of not being able to bottom out. Now we have and we do not know how to get back up.

Historically we have relied on having a chip on our shoulder. I do not see anywhere near the anger required to say that will be the way out now.

All of that stuff is on him as well. He's a leader. He's been at the club for nearly a decade now and his future is secure because of it. I don't like singling players out but thought his kicking cost us.

Then I watched the replay ... he wasn't doing all of the stuff you mentioned. He'd be dropped at Hawthorn for that performance.

 

[Frank Thring]

The main reason we lost last week was Cam Z messing up the first half. His missed kicks (to players and on goal) and poor defense cost us seven or eight goals!!! (Depending on whether you blame him for Naughton's first or not, probably other players just as responsible for that tho.) Putting aside all the other stuff, half as many errors from Cam and we win that game.

Without all that he would have been one our best players too. If not BOG.

Yeah but Cam put in a shift and while his kicking for goal was shite, I'd rather see Zurhaar putting in as the goal kicking will turn

 

[Only Forwards]

Yes there were other reasons we lost as well be ****ed so much up.

Other players get payed out as whipping boys but he was shocking.

Five missed shots on goal, two where he turned his back on players in better positions, one where he marked in front of Larkey in a spot Larkey is 90% likely to kick the goal from. He missed passes to open players on the lead (ie didn't see them) going inside 50 and his player (Dale) kicked two goals and won multiple contests running off HB to set up other goals. The worst of them was how he stood there next to (less than 10m away) Bailey Dale while Dale ran past him then around kicked one from 50 under absolutely no pressure getting the hands from Gallagher who had a free outside his range.





He's sposed to be a leader and he could have led by tracking Dale and tackling him on 50, passing off to team mates or letting Larkey mark or just pushing back harder when his player runs off HB. If he set the example by doing those hard things other players would follow. And they'd all feed off the vibe it creates.




Yes. And a big part of that is on Cam. He is guilty of all that stuff you just mentioned.



All of that stuff is on him as well. He's a leader. He's been at the club for nearly a decade now and his future is secure because of it. I don't like singling players out but thought his kicking cost us.

Then I watched the replay ... he wasn't doing all of the stuff you mentioned. He'd be dropped at Hawthorn for that performance.

Do you think dropping him would have changed the outcome?

I certainly don't.

His issues are a symptom not a cause.

 

[Samsquanch]

5 years of shitness, an appalling end to 2024 and they come out Round 1 with question marks over application. How does this happen?

They played two practise matches in the weeks prior to round 0 and the application was even more questionable.

 

[ferball]

Yeah but Cam put in a shift and while his kicking for goal was shite, I'd rather see Zurhaar putting in as the goal kicking will turn

It wasn't just the goal kicking. It was the turning his back, the mark in front of Larkey and the failure to stop Dale's run off HB that cost us. If he'd looked and not taken those options cos he thought they were too risky and still missed then he'd get a pass but he didn't look. Letting Dale run past him in the first for that goal was shocking tho. Parker did it as well.

 

[ferball]

Do you think dropping him would have changed the outcome?

Not before that game.

If we dropped him this week and told him to go back and work on that stuff then it might change the outcomes over the next few months and seasons and set an example to the younger players. Plus he might actually work on that stuff, see the benefit and understand why he should do it.

I certainly don't.

His issues are a symptom not a cause.

What is the cause then?

WE talk about our forwards and mids not working hard enough in defense ... Dale kicked two and was significantly involved in more. That's the difference between the sides on the scoreboard right there. All players make errors (like missing shots on goals or taking a mark from a player who should have the shot,) on our side and on the opposition sides. Its the hard work they put in to make up for those errors that matters. And he didn't put that work in.

The only home grown players older than him on the list are Jy and LMac, while Larkey is a couple of weeks younger. Whether he likes it or not he's one of the players who will either hold the side up or let it fall over the coming years.

 

[Karanicolas]

When Konstanty is the only one showing any real enthusiasm in the last quarter, you need to wonder about our mentality.

At the end of the third quarter, we had all the momentum, the NMFC crowd is ready to explode, and the players attending the first CBA may as well have been waiting for their coffee order outside Roasting Warehouse.

 

[Only Forwards]

If we dropped him this week and told him to go back and work on that stuff then it might change the outcomes over the next few months and seasons and set an example to the younger players. Plus he might actually work on that stuff, see the benefit and understand why he should do it.

Head on a pike is fine.

It is not how we operate, I cannot recall Scott ever employing this as a thing, I cannot recall if Laidly ever took this approach.
Might work might not, I legit don't think an individual player is the difference.

I get the idea but it just wont be something we do.

What is the cause then?

Collective mindset, lack of belief and lack of confidence.

We are mentally soft and it makes the required effort look like a million miles away.

Blue juice said it best in a lyric of theirs which I will paraphase:

We've been down so long we've gotten comfortable on our knees.

you can say it was Cam all you like, we would take the ball at nearly any point on the ground and the bloke with the ball would look up to 17 other guys not moving an inch. We want the easy options. It is why we are stagnant, it is why we kick the ball long down the line, it is why our preferred forward entry is one of kick it on their heads or try and get it over the back. It sticks out like dogs nuts when anyone does something different.

Every team knows they turn up the heat and we crumble. The dogs did it twice, once at the end of the first into the start of the second and we conceded 4 goals. again at the start of the fourth and we conceded 3 goals.

I expect that will be almost exactly how Sunday plays out. there will come a point where Melbourne need to step it up and we won't go with them, they will burst on a score that is enough to break us and it'll be the game.

I have no belief we can counter that because why would I believe in a thing I haven't seen in half a decade?

Edit - Cam is a product of this.