To all the idiots who blame America for September 11....

[Thegibbsgamble]

Yasser atafat is a nothing but a light weight.


Hitler
Bin laden
Al. Bagdaddy

And epstien didn't commit suicide

Arafat does have a starring role in this legendary thread, but he only died once

The others, well at least twice. Al bagdaddy the leader of isis wins hands down. He died five times. The only explication could be all those virgins.

I wonder how this pussy dies for the sixth time?

 

[Catters 070911]

If the US are bombing anywhere else other than Afghanistan in retribution of the Sept.11 attacks, then please let me know.

Why did they not bomb Libya to high hell in the 80s? They have training camps and commited numerous terrorist acts against the US....

The US always have a hidden agenda, don't be naive and think that this attack is solely for the purpose of combatting terrorism.

Because Libya didn't attack America first.

They started it by having planes fly in the Twin Towers. All the US was doing is getting revenge, and sending the world a message not to be messed with.

I suppose you think the US caused Pearl Harbor as well?

 

[Present Not Past]

I was alive in 2001. Why should I be dead

 

[Danger2Jenkins]

I couldn't believe this crap when I saw it. I woke up on the day to watch Dragon Ball Z on Cheez TV and it still makes me furious when thinking about it. Every single channel was hijacked by the same bullshit newsfeed. No one could watch anything else it felt lke Goerge Orwells 1984. Literally every channel was hijacked! I was a child and my reaction to it was we don't live in america. And if this happened in Australia we wouldn't receive the same regard. Such an incredibly pretentious nation.

From memory it was right when Goku was fighting Freeza and had just become a super saiyan. Literally that episode of the one after I was so pissed off.

 

[Thegibbsgamble]

I couldn't believe this crap when I saw it. I woke up on the day to watch Dragon Ball Z on Cheez TV and it still makes me furious when thinking about it. Every single channel was hijacked by the same bullshit newsfeed. No one could watch anything else it felt lke Goerge Orwells 1984. Literally every channel was hijacked! I was a child and my reaction to it was we don't live in america. And if this happened in Australia we wouldn't receive the same regard. Such an incredibly pretentious nation.

From memory it was right when Goku was fighting Freeza and had just become a super saiyan. Literally that episode of the one after I was so pissed off.

. With the way you recall every vivid detail of that event, all those years ago. You need counselling. Does dragon ball z have thier own hotline for its depressed fans?

Gold help You brother.

 

[Thegibbsgamble]

Here's an article by John Pilger, ratbag journo etc. Your thoughts would be appreciated Yassir.....


Don't necessarily agre with the Pilger perspective on everything, but its nice to have a contrary view sometimes!!!!


URL is http://mirror.icnetwork.co.uk/news/allnews/page.cfm?objectid=11392430&method=full

or try
http://www.johnpilger.com/


PILGER: THIS WAR IS A FRAUD By John Pilger, Former Mirror chief foreign correspondent




The war against terrorism is a fraud. After three weeks' bombing, not a single terrorist implicated in the attacks on America has been caught or killed in Afghanistan.

Instead, one of the poorest, most stricken nations has been terrorised by the most powerful - to the point where American pilots have run out of dubious "military" targets and are now destroying mud houses, a hospital, Red Cross warehouses, lorries carrying refugees.

Unlike the relentless pictures from New York, we are seeing almost nothing of this. Tony Blair has yet to tell us what the violent death of children - seven in one family - has to do with Osama bin Laden.

And why are cluster bombs being used? The British public should know about these bombs, which the RAF also uses. They spray hundreds of bomblets that have only one purpose; to kill and maim people. Those that do not explode lie on the ground like landmines, waiting for people to step on them.

If ever a weapon was designed specifically for acts of terrorism, this is it. I have seen the victims of American cluster weapons in other countries, such as the Laotian toddler who picked one up and had her right leg and face blown off. Be assured this is now happening in Afghanistan, in your name.

None of those directly involved in the September 11 atrocity was Afghani. Most were Saudis, who apparently did their planning and training in Germany and the United States.

The camps which the Taliban allowed bin Laden to use were emptied weeks ago. Moreover, the Taliban itself is a creation of the Americans and the British. In the 1980s, the tribal army that produced them was funded by the CIA and trained by the SAS to fight the Russians.

The hypocrisy does not stop there. When the Taliban took Kabul in 1996, Washington said nothing. Why? Because Taliban leaders were soon on their way to Houston, Texas, to be entertained by executives of the oil company, Unocal.

With secret US government approval, the company offered them a generous cut of the profits of the oil and gas pumped through a pipeline that the Americans wanted to build from Soviet central Asia through Afghanistan.

A US diplomat said: "The Taliban will probably develop like the Saudis did." He explained that Afghanistan would become an American oil colony, there would be huge profits for the West, no democracy and the legal persecution of women. "We can live with that," he said.

Although the deal fell through, it remains an urgent priority of the administration of George W. Bush, which is steeped in the oil industry. Bush's concealed agenda is to exploit the oil and gas reserves in the Caspian basin, the greatest source of untapped fossil fuel on earth and enough, according to one estimate, to meet America's voracious energy needs for a generation. Only if the pipeline runs through Afghanistan can the Americans hope to control it.

So, not surprisingly, US Secretary of State Colin Powell is now referring to "moderate" Taliban, who will join an American-sponsored "loose federation" to run Afghanistan. The "war on terrorism" is a cover for this: a means of achieving American strategic aims that lie behind the flag-waving facade of great power.

The Royal Marines, who will do the real dirty work, will be little more than mercenaries for Washington's imperial ambitions, not to mention the extraordinary pretensions of Blair himself. Having made Britain a target for terrorism with his bellicose "shoulder to shoulder" with Bush nonsense, he is now prepared to send troops to a battlefield where the goals are so uncertain that even the Chief of the Defence Staff says the conflict "could last 50 years".

The irresponsibility of this is breathtaking; the pressure on Pakistan alone could ignite an unprecedented crisis across the Indian sub-continent. Having reported many wars, I am always struck by the absurdity of effete politicians eager to wave farewell to young soldiers, but who themselves would not say boo to a Taliban goose.

In the days of gunboats, our imperial leaders covered their violence in the "morality" of their actions. Blair is no different. Like them, his selective moralising omits the most basic truth. Nothing justified the killing of innocent people in America on September 11, and nothing justifies the killing of innocent people anywhere else.

By killing innocents in Afghanistan, Blair and Bush stoop to the level of the criminal outrage in New York. Once you cluster bomb, "mistakes" and "blunders" are a pretence. Murder is murder, regardless of whether you crash a plane into a building or order and collude with it from the Oval Office and Downing Street.

If Blair was really opposed to all forms of terrorism, he would get Britain out of the arms trade. On the day of the twin towers attack, an "arms fair", selling weapons of terror (like cluster bombs and missiles) to assorted tyrants and human rights abusers, opened in London's Docklands with the full backing of the Blair government.

Britain's biggest arms customer is the medieval Saudi regime, which beheads heretics and spawned the religious fanaticism of the Taliban.

If he really wanted to demonstrate "the moral fibre of Britain", Blair would do everything in his power to lift the threat of violence in those parts of the world where there is great and justifiable grievance and anger.

He would do more than make gestures; he would demand that Israel ends its illegal occupation of Palestine and withdraw to its borders prior to the 1967 war, as ordered by the Security Council, of which Britain is a permanent member.

He would call for an end to the genocidal blockade which the UN - in reality, America and Britain - has imposed on the suffering people of Iraq for more than a decade, causing the deaths of half a million children under the age of five.

That's more deaths of infants every month than the number killed in the World Trade Center.

There are signs that Washington is about to extend its current "war" to Iraq; yet unknown to most of us, almost every day RAF and American aircraft already bomb Iraq. There are no headlines. There is nothing on the TV news. This terror is the longest-running Anglo-American bombing campaign since World War Two.

The Wall Street Journal reported that the US and Britain faced a "dilemma" in Iraq, because "few targets remain". "We're down to the last outhouse," said a US official. That was two years ago, and they're still bombing. The cost to the British taxpayer? £800 million so far.

According to an internal UN report, covering a five-month period, 41 per cent of the casualties are civilians. In northern Iraq, I met a woman whose husband and four children were among the deaths listed in the report. He was a shepherd, who was tending his sheep with his elderly father and his children when two planes attacked them, each making a sweep. It was an open valley; there were no military targets nearby.

"I want to see the pilot who did this," said the widow at the graveside of her entire family. For them, there was no service in St Paul's Cathedral with the Queen in attendance; no rock concert with Paul McCartney.

The tragedy of the Iraqis, and the Palestinians, and the Afghanis is a truth that is the very opposite of their caricatures in much of the Western media.

Far from being the terrorists of the world, the overwhelming majority of the Islamic peoples of the Middle East and south Asia have been its victims - victims largely of the West's exploitation of precious natural resources in or near their countries.

There is no war on terrorism. If there was, the Royal Marines and the SAS would be storming the beaches of Florida, where more CIA-funded terrorists, ex-Latin American dictators and torturers, are given refuge than anywhere on earth.

There is, however, a continuing war of the powerful against the powerless, with new excuses, new hidden agendas, new lies. Before another child dies violently, or quietly from starvation, before new fanatics are created in both the east and the west, it is time for the people of Britain to make their voices heard and to stop this fraudulent war - and to demand the kind of bold, imaginative non-violent initiatives that require real political courage.

The other day, the parents of Greg Rodriguez, a young man who died in the World Trade Center, said this: "We read enough of the news to sense that our government is heading in the direction of violent revenge, with the prospect of sons, daughters, parents, friends in distant lands dying, suffering, and nursing further grievances against us.

"It is not the way to go...not in our son's name."

The man is a prophet

The “Afghanistan Papers”: Deep State narrative management

An awful lot of modern “leaks” are no such thing. They are Orwellian exercises in controlling the conversation. And this is no exception, carefully making sure the “establishment&…

off-guardian.org

 

[its free real estate]

I believe that America have made a big mistake in naming their campaign a War on Terrorism. Terrorism occurs frequently throughout the world in places as diverse as Northern Ireland, Spain, Colombia and Sri Lanka.

Following the September 11 attacks, the US stated that they were going to flush the world of terrorism once and for all, this is definitely a noble cause. But were the US ever realistically intending on doing this?

To eliminate or dramatically reduce terrorism worldwide would be a huge operation which would take place in tens of countries throughout the world and take decades to complete. While America's War on Terrorism takes place in Afghanistan, terrorist attacks have recently occured in Birmingham, England (attributed to the Real IRA group), Madrid, Spain (attributed to ETA Basque separatists), and numerous other places throughout the world.

When America have finished their War on Terrorism in Afghanistan, it is extremely unlikely to say the least they will venture to any other troublespots throughout the world to clean up terrorism and this could well cause resentment in areas affected by terrorism.

These necro-bumps are usually boring, but this is a great post in 2001 from Sydneyfan (I hope he still visits this forum). His main point was correct, the War on Terrorism was fruitless in that it failed to defeat terrorism, but it did have some notable victories. Quoted from Sydneyfan:

While America's War on Terrorism takes place in Afghanistan, terrorist attacks have recently occured in Birmingham, England (attributed to the Real IRA group), Madrid, Spain (attributed to ETA Basque separatists), and numerous other places throughout the world.​

​

ETA and IRA effectively ceased their terrorist operations after September 11, no longer attracting funding from the citizens who had previously backed them. Many other non-jihadist organisations ceased as well, and the Tamil Tigers, who had been waging war for nearly 40 years, ceased to exist 6-7 years after the US attacks and GWB declared war on terrorism.

Did the war on terrorism destroy terrorism? No, and in the jihadist case terrorism only got worse, but in a number of other cases its successes were extraordinary.

 

[Freomaniac]

Isn't the interpretation of Islam, the stance taken by the Taliban, a fundamentalist one?

the taliban still exist?

 

[Mobbs]

the taliban still exist?

Why are you asking me?

 

[ABSOLUTE MADMAN]

Was still jerkin it to magazines when this thread was started.

 

[Thegibbsgamble]

the taliban still exist?

Al queda still does. They helped overthrow ghaddaffi and took large parts of Syria, while we gave them air support...

While our volunteer firefighters have to sell raffles for equipment, we're flying air support for Al Queda.

Yep,. It shows how dumb Australians are.

 

[Sydneyfan]

These necro-bumps are usually boring, but this is a great post in 2001 from Sydneyfan (I hope he still visits this forum). His main point was correct, the War on Terrorism was fruitless in that it failed to defeat terrorism, but it did have some notable victories. Quoted from Sydneyfan:

While America's War on Terrorism takes place in Afghanistan, terrorist attacks have recently occured in Birmingham, England (attributed to the Real IRA group), Madrid, Spain (attributed to ETA Basque separatists), and numerous other places throughout the world.​

​

ETA and IRA effectively ceased their terrorist operations after September 11, no longer attracting funding from the citizens who had previously backed them. Many other non-jihadist organisations ceased as well, and the Tamil Tigers, who had been waging war for nearly 40 years, ceased to exist 6-7 years after the US attacks and GWB declared war on terrorism.

Did the war on terrorism destroy terrorism? No, and in the jihadist case terrorism only got worse, but in a number of other cases its successes were extraordinary.

Thanks for the bump from half a lifetime ago. I’m amazed I had the foresight back then to see the fruitlessness of attacking terrorism by inflicting terror, which does a great job of propagating further terrorism in return. As you mentioned, 9/11 was successful in concluding ETA & IRA’s terrorist attacks as they realised attacks would be extremely counterproductive and poorly received in the West. Sri Lanka has since seen a ceasefire, and end of Tamil Tiger terrorist activities.

But, the root causes of terrorism in the Middle East are as evident now, even more so, as 18 years ago and sadly don’t show significant signs of abating soon. Call me idealist but if only the US were half as keen to drop books as they dropped bombs, fund libraries half as much as militias perhaps we’d be seeing already a different paradigm.

 

[Hawk_francais]

This thread aged horribly. So many innocent lives lost as a result of the Iraq/Afghan conflicts that 9/11 is simply nothing in comparison. Are yes, the US are still to blame for that attack, even if I would never go so far as to say they deserved it.

Shame on Australia for walking into Iraq with the US
Shame on the Liberal party for sending men and women to die in that baseless war
Shame on those who have already forgotten about it

 

[Lebbo73]

I was alive in 2001. Why should I be dead

You might as well have been

 

[Present Not Past]

You might as well have been

Wrong.

 

[Thegibbsgamble]

This thread aged horribly. So many innocent lives lost as a result of the Iraq/Afghan conflicts that 9/11 is simply nothing in comparison. Are yes, the US are still to blame for that attack, even if I would never go so far as to say they deserved it.

Shame on Australia for walking into Iraq with the US
Shame on the Liberal party for sending men and women to die in that baseless war
Shame on those who have already forgotten about it

There was a meeting in Washington the day norad simulated an attack on the wtc by use of airliners. It was very large war game and turned out to be big brother reality TV. It was a false flag to justify going to war. Its not something that can be argued rationally.
John Howard was at that Meeting and so was some other major players. They had pivotal roles in what was to come.

Currently 90 percent of the world's opium comes from Afghanistan, that was down to nothing in 2001 and inmeaditley went back up when we invaded. Rumsfield is a big pharma lobbyist. Was an executive. We also cut off Iran from the world and China.

Imagine if they legalised pot instead, no need to go to war to supply western nations with opium.

Our society relies in opium as much as water and breathing. People don't work unless they get thier pain killers. Our economy falters, the sheep stop listening to the shepard.

When you use opium for pain, it dumbs down your thinking. When you use pot, it opens your heart and then the mind. You can't be controlled by your shepard.

 

[Slartibartfast]

There was a meeting in Washington the day norad simulated an attack on the wtc by use of airliners. It was very large war game and turned out to be big brother reality TV. It was a false flag to justify going to war. Its not something that can be argued rationally.
John Howard was at that Meeting and so was some other major players. They had pivotal roles in what was to come.

Currently 90 percent of the world's opium comes from Afghanistan, that was down to nothing in 2001 and inmeaditley went back up when we invaded. Rumsfield is a big pharma lobbyist. Was an executive. We also cut off Iran from the world and China.

Imagine if they legalised pot instead, no need to go to war to supply western nations with opium.

Our society relies in opium as much as water and breathing. People don't work unless they get thier pain killers. Our economy falters, the sheep stop listening to the shepard.

When you use opium for pain, it dumbs down your thinking. When you use pot, it opens your heart and then the mind. You can't be controlled by your shepard.

You do realise Australia is the largest producer of legal opioids in the world ??
Afghans are not supplying 90% to big pharma.

The Global Opioid Supply Chain Begins in Tasmania

Pharmaceutical companies exploited a regulatory loophole that allowed for a decades-long boom in licit opioid production fueled by Tasmanian-grown poppies. Here's what the island can tell us about the next wave of the crisis.

psmag.com