Moo
Premium Platinum
Re: Palmer got poor O-line Protection
We have more of a shot of beating the Colts than the Bengals do
coasting said:
We have more of a shot of beating the Colts than the Bengals do
Teams Cincinnati Bengals - Who Dey
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Moo
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Re: Palmer goes Down
Pffffffffffffffft - watch the hit again ...he was on the ground having been blocked and was trying to pressure the pass.
No malice in it at all.
coasting said:
Pffffffffffffffft - watch the hit again ...he was on the ground having been blocked and was trying to pressure the pass.
No malice in it at all.
Re: Palmer goes Down
So you are referring to the Palmer injury!.............last time I checked this was a contact sport. Those dirty rotten Steelers, how dare they hit Carson!
Grow up.
coasting said:
So you are referring to the Palmer injury!.............last time I checked this was a contact sport. Those dirty rotten Steelers, how dare they hit Carson!
Grow up.
Woodson
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Re: Colts need to play 4 quarters to win still
The rivalry will be INTENSIVE as never before no doubt, but I discount the Palmer injury, many will want to move on from that. It's more about the much improved Bengals playing like a winning team and the hunger factor.
As for the Steelers being a different team than last year? well, I think it's more the wiser about the Steelers learning to cope with thier own expectations than let a 15-1 record go to our heads.
The Jets showed last season that no play-off game can be underestimated if the underdog keeps fighting 'til the end. (remember the Jets played a riviting gut busting game vs the Chargers in last seasons Wildcard) The Colts will have to still perform at thier best on both sides to fend off the Steelers who have character and a mean streak to unsettle any opposition. Won't be easy. Like the 9.5pt start.
coasting said:
The rivalry will be INTENSIVE as never before no doubt, but I discount the Palmer injury, many will want to move on from that. It's more about the much improved Bengals playing like a winning team and the hunger factor.
As for the Steelers being a different team than last year? well, I think it's more the wiser about the Steelers learning to cope with thier own expectations than let a 15-1 record go to our heads.
The Jets showed last season that no play-off game can be underestimated if the underdog keeps fighting 'til the end. (remember the Jets played a riviting gut busting game vs the Chargers in last seasons Wildcard) The Colts will have to still perform at thier best on both sides to fend off the Steelers who have character and a mean streak to unsettle any opposition. Won't be easy. Like the 9.5pt start.
Woodson
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Re: Sticky keyboards NOT ALLOWED
Who the hell are you WTTF ??? Blow in 'sudden NFL fan' where the hell were you when the regular season was kicking ??? you should be ashamed of yourself, go wash your hands before coming on BF NFL in January.
And Moo ???? another bandwagon fan are you ?? Didn't hear a boo from you when the Steelers were on the ropes before the 4 game winning streak..... really F***s me off when ppl decide to 'join a forum and PRETEND they have been on the NFL scene for over 10 years' Push off. Coasting has EVERY RIGHT to vent his displeasure whether the 'real NFL fans on BF' agree or not.
WTTF said:
Who the hell are you WTTF ??? Blow in 'sudden NFL fan' where the hell were you when the regular season was kicking ??? you should be ashamed of yourself, go wash your hands before coming on BF NFL in January.
And Moo ???? another bandwagon fan are you ?? Didn't hear a boo from you when the Steelers were on the ropes before the 4 game winning streak..... really F***s me off when ppl decide to 'join a forum and PRETEND they have been on the NFL scene for over 10 years' Push off. Coasting has EVERY RIGHT to vent his displeasure whether the 'real NFL fans on BF' agree or not.
Moo
Premium Platinum
Woodson said:
Mate - I've been on the Steelers for about 30 years, just because I haven't posted here ...thats hardly the judgement call on being a NFL fan is it?
Great way to expand the voices on the forum.....we dont want you to come and play blah, blah, blah. Plus if I was a blow in fan ...do you think I wouldnt be saying Go Colts? Man I go for the Steelers and the Penguins.
I have just moved to another country and am looking for the forum to replace the convos I used to have with my real live mates.
Coasting has every right, absolutely - but dont I have the right to reply.
If you noticed I was posting during the game ....does that sound like a troll to you? How many trolls stay up to 1:30AM (ME time) and sit and watch a NFL game with a lap top? I never eally thought about BF for NFL, I have just discovered discussing NBA as well - it is not a playoff thing for me, its a timing (as I have just moved thats all)
As I was watching the game and saw Palmer go down, I went to the board to see what others were thinking ? I havent been particularly abusive to Coaster - however of course you never made a first post here.
Forget about it - didnt realise this was a closed shop.
Coasting - no offense meant, I just dont agree that it was a nasty hit and my answer would have been the same if the hit was reversed on Roethlisberger.
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Re: Palmer goes Down
picture ->
When I first saw it, my initial reaction was that Kimo Von Cheapshot was trying to hurt him and I stand by it. I just don't see how this LATE hit was accidental. Look how he has not only driven his shoulder into Palmers leg, but how he has his arm wrapped around the leg. He could have easily pulled up or not wrapped his arm around his ankle. He could have slid to the left or the right and still tackled him, it's really not that hard, but instead he drove his shoulder into his leg and wrapped his arms around his ankle preventing him from even falling down if he wanted to. What topped it off was his academy-award-winning performance "Like did I do that?" Oh please.
There is no doubt in my mind that this was a payback for the Odell Thurman hit on Big Ben. The Steelers made alot of noise about that one... Big Ben even said something like "any hit on the knee is dirty". The Steelers did the only thing they could do to win the game, take out Palmer, so hats off to them. I liken it to when Brisbane bullied Reiwoldt off the field while he was injured - its legal and within the rules but highly unethical.
As for the Steelers, they didn't impress me at all. Struggled to overcome Cincy with a backup QB and the 5th worse defense in the league. Relied on dodgy pass interference calls and tricks plays to get it done. That won't fly against the Colts. They'll have to play alot better, and I mean alot better, to get it done.
Moo said:
picture ->
When I first saw it, my initial reaction was that Kimo Von Cheapshot was trying to hurt him and I stand by it. I just don't see how this LATE hit was accidental. Look how he has not only driven his shoulder into Palmers leg, but how he has his arm wrapped around the leg. He could have easily pulled up or not wrapped his arm around his ankle. He could have slid to the left or the right and still tackled him, it's really not that hard, but instead he drove his shoulder into his leg and wrapped his arms around his ankle preventing him from even falling down if he wanted to. What topped it off was his academy-award-winning performance "Like did I do that?" Oh please.
There is no doubt in my mind that this was a payback for the Odell Thurman hit on Big Ben. The Steelers made alot of noise about that one... Big Ben even said something like "any hit on the knee is dirty". The Steelers did the only thing they could do to win the game, take out Palmer, so hats off to them. I liken it to when Brisbane bullied Reiwoldt off the field while he was injured - its legal and within the rules but highly unethical.
As for the Steelers, they didn't impress me at all. Struggled to overcome Cincy with a backup QB and the 5th worse defense in the league. Relied on dodgy pass interference calls and tricks plays to get it done. That won't fly against the Colts. They'll have to play alot better, and I mean alot better, to get it done.
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Re: Palmer goes Down
I think it was cheap.
Some of u guys do get a bit personal. Fourms are for people to debate points of view.
I think it was cheap.
Some of u guys do get a bit personal. Fourms are for people to debate points of view.
Moo
Premium Platinum
Re: Palmer goes Down
A still photo does not show that Kimo Von Oelhoffen had just come off a block and almost had his back turned ...he wouldn't have known whether the ball had been released or not. The contact was not hard, unfortunately for Palmer it was akward.
Also KVO's reaction seemed genuine but anyway we will agree to disagree.
I totally agree that the Steelers will get pumped, but I would pity anyone facing the Colts ...I think the last couple of regular season games were a distraction - I expect them to come to play against us.
coasting said:picture ->
When I first saw it, my initial reaction was that Kimo Von Cheapshot was trying to hurt him and I stand by it. I just don't see how this LATE hit was accidental. Look how he has not only driven his shoulder into Palmers leg, but how he has his arm wrapped around the leg. He could have easily pulled up or not wrapped his arm around his ankle. He could have slid to the left or the right and still tackled him, it's really not that hard, but instead he drove his shoulder into his leg and wrapped his arms around his ankle preventing him from even falling down if he wanted to. What topped it off was his academy-award-winning performance "Like did I do that?" Oh please.
There is no doubt in my mind that this was a payback for the Odell Thurman hit on Big Ben. The Steelers made alot of noise about that one... Big Ben even said something like "any hit on the knee is dirty". The Steelers did the only thing they could do to win the game, take out Palmer, so hats off to them. I liken it to when Brisbane bullied Reiwoldt off the field while he was injured - its legal and within the rules but highly unethical.
As for the Steelers, they didn't impress me at all. Struggled to overcome Cincy with a backup QB and the 5th worse defense in the league. Relied on dodgy pass interference calls and tricks plays to get it done. That won't fly against the Colts. They'll have to play alot better, and I mean alot better, to get it done.
A still photo does not show that Kimo Von Oelhoffen had just come off a block and almost had his back turned ...he wouldn't have known whether the ball had been released or not. The contact was not hard, unfortunately for Palmer it was akward.
Also KVO's reaction seemed genuine but anyway we will agree to disagree.
I totally agree that the Steelers will get pumped, but I would pity anyone facing the Colts ...I think the last couple of regular season games were a distraction - I expect them to come to play against us.
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Re: Moo gets ALL CLEAR
I'll BUY that story but I trust you can appreciate my TESTING the WATERS on snapperheads that ain't the REAL DEAL. Feel free to hang around and return next season by all means.
Where the hell has JD dissappeared to lately??
Moo said:
I'll BUY that story but I trust you can appreciate my TESTING the WATERS on snapperheads that ain't the REAL DEAL. Feel free to hang around and return next season by all means.
Where the hell has JD dissappeared to lately??
Re: Palmer goes Down
I cannot believe how many so-called experts on various NFL related websites are saying that the injury to Palmer had little to no influence on the outcome of the game.
Gee I wonder who you would rather face. A Bengal offence led by Carson Palmer, or one with Jon Kitna at the helm?
I cannot believe how many so-called experts on various NFL related websites are saying that the injury to Palmer had little to no influence on the outcome of the game.
Gee I wonder who you would rather face. A Bengal offence led by Carson Palmer, or one with Jon Kitna at the helm?
Woodson
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Re: Nothing to Lose, Pressure on Peyton
Yup and throughout the 4 quarters, INDY will have ALL the PRESSURE on them to perform. They were AWESOME on D on that MNF meeting and the Steelers KNOW IT so it's up to Cowher & his assistants to take CHANCES and LIVE or DIE by the SWORD. Bring on the trick plays, the flea flicker HAS TO BE USED OFTEN vs the COLTS as I don't think running the ball will get us many points and then there is Peyton, who may FEEL the PINCH if the Steelers LB get close enough. Deflected passes is the tonic to picks and I'll be hoping my man, Troy will snare a few.
Parker on the screen can be a LETHAL WEAPON and INDY may not want to be give him space so that's where HEATH MILLER enters the equation and sets himself as the X factor downfield. Steelers will have to be wary of the INDY blitzing DE tandum and that means BIG BEN firing bullets out of the SHOT GUN often.
coasting said:
Yup and throughout the 4 quarters, INDY will have ALL the PRESSURE on them to perform. They were AWESOME on D on that MNF meeting and the Steelers KNOW IT so it's up to Cowher & his assistants to take CHANCES and LIVE or DIE by the SWORD. Bring on the trick plays, the flea flicker HAS TO BE USED OFTEN vs the COLTS as I don't think running the ball will get us many points and then there is Peyton, who may FEEL the PINCH if the Steelers LB get close enough. Deflected passes is the tonic to picks and I'll be hoping my man, Troy will snare a few.
Parker on the screen can be a LETHAL WEAPON and INDY may not want to be give him space so that's where HEATH MILLER enters the equation and sets himself as the X factor downfield. Steelers will have to be wary of the INDY blitzing DE tandum and that means BIG BEN firing bullets out of the SHOT GUN often.
Woodson
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Re: Emotion ADDS to the equation
Well, consider that Carson didn't exactly have HUGE games (by his standards) vs the Steelers in either game. That's perhaps where the logic comes from. I however agree that the injury had a BIG IMPACT emotionally and that has been UNDER-ESTIMATED.
Jon Kitna would be a walk up STARTER at least 5 clubs. McNair has been rumoured to join Miami btw.
flamethrower said:
Well, consider that Carson didn't exactly have HUGE games (by his standards) vs the Steelers in either game. That's perhaps where the logic comes from. I however agree that the injury had a BIG IMPACT emotionally and that has been UNDER-ESTIMATED.
Jon Kitna would be a walk up STARTER at least 5 clubs. McNair has been rumoured to join Miami btw.
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Re: Bengal Anderson DEFENDS Kimo
Hey Coasting.... read on
Von Oelhoffen offers apology after Palmer's injury
Associated Press
CINCINNATI -- Pittsburgh Steelers defensive lineman Kimo von Oelhoffen spent half his NFL career playing in Cincinnati and still has great affection for the Bengals and the town.
Kimo von Oelhoffen
Defensive Tackle
Pittsburgh Steelers
Profile
2005 SEASON STATISTICS
Tot Ast Solo FF Sack Int
36 23 13 1 4 0
No wonder he doesn't want to spend the next nine months being the city's most disliked man.
Von Oelhoffen's unintentionally firm tug on quarterback Carson Palmer's left knee during the Bengals' second play of the game Sunday put Palmer out with a serious injury and affected the course of the Steelers' 31-17 victory.
Afterward, von Oelhoffen apologized to Palmer, his family and the Bengals' fans, saying no player ever wants to hurt another.
"Yeah, I hate to see that happen to any player," von Oelhoffen said. "I don't think anybody on this team would intentionally do something like that."
As Palmer lay on the turf before being taken off on a cart, several Bengals players could be seen yelling toward the Steelers' huddle. But von Oelhoffen said he didn't hear any remarks directed toward him, and at least one Bengals player -- Pro Bowl tackle Willie Anderson -- defended him after the game.
"I know Kimo. He's not a dirty player," Anderson said of von Oelhoffen, who played for the Bengals from 1994-99 before moving to Pittsburgh for the chance to become a starter. "Guys were infuriated, but your first reaction is to defend your player. It wasn't a dirty play."
Von Oelhoffen said the injury -- Palmer tore at least one ligament -- affected his own play for at least a quarter.
"I'm not gonna lie, it affected me a little bit," von Oelhoffen said. "That kid deserved a shot to play in this game. It's always horrible when somebody gets hurt. We're all football players -- we're together, we compete against each other, but we're together."
Asked what he was trying to do on the play, von Oelhoffen said, "Sack the quarterback. What else?"
Von Oelhoffen said he didn't personally apologize to Palmer because he didn't see him after he left the field.
"How would it affect you if you had just torn one of the most promising quarterback's knees out? You do not like to see that happen. But he'll rebound," von Oelhoffen said. "He's young and he's going to be around for a long time. ... I hope he gets better because he's a great player."
What several Steelers disliked was the insinuation that the injury greatly influenced the game, and that they needed something like that to win in Cincinnati, where they have won five of their last six.
"I'm not going to sit here and let that be a reason to spoil our victory, Carson not playing," linebacker Joey Porter said of the Steelers' 14th victory in 17 road games over the last two seasons. "This is the NFL and people get hurt; it's not the first time someone's got hurt in a game. We've had people get hurt all year. You take your wounds and keep on ticking."
The Steelers played four games without their own starting quarterback, Ben Roethlisberger, with two knee injuries, and left tackle Marvel Smith also missed substantial time.
"We came away with a victory. If Palmer had played, I think the same thing would have happened," Porter said.
Even if Bengals wide receiver Chad Johnson didn't agree after being held without a touchdown by Pittsburgh for the third time this season.
coasting said:picture ->
When I first saw it, my initial reaction was that Kimo Von Cheapshot was trying to hurt him and I stand by it. I just don't see how this LATE hit was accidental. Look how he has not only driven his shoulder into Palmers leg, but how he has his arm wrapped around the leg. He could have easily pulled up or not wrapped his arm around his ankle. He could have slid to the left or the right and still tackled him, it's really not that hard, but instead he drove his shoulder into his leg and wrapped his arms around his ankle preventing him from even falling down if he wanted to. What topped it off was his academy-award-winning performance "Like did I do that?" Oh please.
There is no doubt in my mind that this was a payback for the Odell Thurman hit on Big Ben. The Steelers made alot of noise about that one... Big Ben even said something like "any hit on the knee is dirty". The Steelers did the only thing they could do to win the game, take out Palmer, so hats off to them. I liken it to when Brisbane bullied Reiwoldt off the field while he was injured - its legal and within the rules but highly unethical.
Hey Coasting.... read on
Von Oelhoffen offers apology after Palmer's injury
Associated Press
CINCINNATI -- Pittsburgh Steelers defensive lineman Kimo von Oelhoffen spent half his NFL career playing in Cincinnati and still has great affection for the Bengals and the town.
Kimo von Oelhoffen
Defensive Tackle
Pittsburgh Steelers
Profile
2005 SEASON STATISTICS
Tot Ast Solo FF Sack Int
36 23 13 1 4 0
No wonder he doesn't want to spend the next nine months being the city's most disliked man.
Von Oelhoffen's unintentionally firm tug on quarterback Carson Palmer's left knee during the Bengals' second play of the game Sunday put Palmer out with a serious injury and affected the course of the Steelers' 31-17 victory.
Afterward, von Oelhoffen apologized to Palmer, his family and the Bengals' fans, saying no player ever wants to hurt another.
"Yeah, I hate to see that happen to any player," von Oelhoffen said. "I don't think anybody on this team would intentionally do something like that."
As Palmer lay on the turf before being taken off on a cart, several Bengals players could be seen yelling toward the Steelers' huddle. But von Oelhoffen said he didn't hear any remarks directed toward him, and at least one Bengals player -- Pro Bowl tackle Willie Anderson -- defended him after the game.
"I know Kimo. He's not a dirty player," Anderson said of von Oelhoffen, who played for the Bengals from 1994-99 before moving to Pittsburgh for the chance to become a starter. "Guys were infuriated, but your first reaction is to defend your player. It wasn't a dirty play."
Von Oelhoffen said the injury -- Palmer tore at least one ligament -- affected his own play for at least a quarter.
"I'm not gonna lie, it affected me a little bit," von Oelhoffen said. "That kid deserved a shot to play in this game. It's always horrible when somebody gets hurt. We're all football players -- we're together, we compete against each other, but we're together."
Asked what he was trying to do on the play, von Oelhoffen said, "Sack the quarterback. What else?"
Von Oelhoffen said he didn't personally apologize to Palmer because he didn't see him after he left the field.
"How would it affect you if you had just torn one of the most promising quarterback's knees out? You do not like to see that happen. But he'll rebound," von Oelhoffen said. "He's young and he's going to be around for a long time. ... I hope he gets better because he's a great player."
What several Steelers disliked was the insinuation that the injury greatly influenced the game, and that they needed something like that to win in Cincinnati, where they have won five of their last six.
"I'm not going to sit here and let that be a reason to spoil our victory, Carson not playing," linebacker Joey Porter said of the Steelers' 14th victory in 17 road games over the last two seasons. "This is the NFL and people get hurt; it's not the first time someone's got hurt in a game. We've had people get hurt all year. You take your wounds and keep on ticking."
The Steelers played four games without their own starting quarterback, Ben Roethlisberger, with two knee injuries, and left tackle Marvel Smith also missed substantial time.
"We came away with a victory. If Palmer had played, I think the same thing would have happened," Porter said.
Even if Bengals wide receiver Chad Johnson didn't agree after being held without a touchdown by Pittsburgh for the third time this season.
Moo
Premium Platinum
Re: Palmer goes Down
No it absolutely had a massive effect on the game ...look at the season Palmer has had, his team mates would ahve dropped a notch or two seeing him going off.
Woodson promise I'm not a snapperhead (or cheesehead for that matter).
I'll post with regular monotomy, unfortunately I only get 1 game per week here and no highlight show ...thats why I was praying to see the Steelers and not Carolina.
flamethrower said:
No it absolutely had a massive effect on the game ...look at the season Palmer has had, his team mates would ahve dropped a notch or two seeing him going off.
Woodson promise I'm not a snapperhead (or cheesehead for that matter).
I'll post with regular monotomy, unfortunately I only get 1 game per week here and no highlight show ...thats why I was praying to see the Steelers and not Carolina.
Re: Palmer goes Down
I'm with Coasting on this.......unethical at best and it certainly affected the outcome (points wise!). I had Cincy teased to +10pts and it cost me plenty of $$'s.
I expect the Steelers to find it alot harder this week and I'm quite happy to tease Indy into -2.5pts to be sure! (into Broncs +4 & Seattle -2)
Caro +10 into any of the above = $$$
Woodson....I hope you're right about McNair coming down to the Phins!!
GL if you are having a punt this week.
I'm with Coasting on this.......unethical at best and it certainly affected the outcome (points wise!). I had Cincy teased to +10pts and it cost me plenty of $$'s.
I expect the Steelers to find it alot harder this week and I'm quite happy to tease Indy into -2.5pts to be sure! (into Broncs +4 & Seattle -2)
Caro +10 into any of the above = $$$
Woodson....I hope you're right about McNair coming down to the Phins!!
GL if you are having a punt this week.
Re: Moo gets ALL CLEAR
While I don't have 30 years of NFL viewing behind me I do have more than 15. I too have only recently become involved with the BF site and as such have barely poked my head outside the Regional Leagues forum. I trust I will be given every chance to prove I'm the real deal. As a long suffering Atlanta Falcons fan I reckon I've done the hard yards already!
BTW I'm interested in the tipping threads I see in here. Where do I go to log my interest in particpating in next years' tipping contest?
Any guys in here participate in FF?
Apologies for the hijack, I now return you to your regularly scheduled bitch fight about knee injuries and intent.
Woodson said:
While I don't have 30 years of NFL viewing behind me I do have more than 15. I too have only recently become involved with the BF site and as such have barely poked my head outside the Regional Leagues forum. I trust I will be given every chance to prove I'm the real deal. As a long suffering Atlanta Falcons fan I reckon I've done the hard yards already!
BTW I'm interested in the tipping threads I see in here. Where do I go to log my interest in particpating in next years' tipping contest?
Any guys in here participate in FF?
Apologies for the hijack, I now return you to your regularly scheduled bitch fight about knee injuries and intent.
Re: Sticky keyboards NOT ALLOWED
Sorry Rod.
How dare I engage someone in a discussion about NFL on this forum.
You should be encouraging people to come back to the board. I won't bother again, I'm not going to waste my time putting up with crap like that.
Woodson said:
Sorry Rod.
How dare I engage someone in a discussion about NFL on this forum.
You should be encouraging people to come back to the board. I won't bother again, I'm not going to waste my time putting up with crap like that.
Moo
Premium Platinum
Re: Sticky keyboards NOT ALLOWED
C'mon WTTF ...I think he made it clear they just dont want blow ins at the business end of the season just making 1 or 2 posts but they have laid out the welcome mate if we want to participate as genuine NFL fans (well thats how I took it).
I had a mini-spit the dummy too but in true NFL form, I blew up and now I'm over it and looking to next week ...do the same hey?
I'm looking forward to discussing the rest of the playoffs, the bowl and on to next season.
WTTF said:
C'mon WTTF ...I think he made it clear they just dont want blow ins at the business end of the season just making 1 or 2 posts but they have laid out the welcome mate if we want to participate as genuine NFL fans (well thats how I took it).
I had a mini-spit the dummy too but in true NFL form, I blew up and now I'm over it and looking to next week ...do the same hey?
I'm looking forward to discussing the rest of the playoffs, the bowl and on to next season.
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Re: Palmer goes Down
CINCINNATI (AP) -- Carson Palmer's knee injury was "devastating and potentially career-ending," but his surgeon said Thursday that he is optimistic the Cincinnati Bengals quarterback can recover and play next season.
Palmer tore ligaments in his left knee when he was hit by Pittsburgh's Kimo von Oelhoffen on his first pass during the Steelers' 31-17 playoff victory Sunday.
The team announced that he had torn the anterior cruciate and medial collateral ligaments. The damage was much more extensive and severe, but Dr. Lonnie Paulos said surgery went well and Palmer could be ready for the regular season.
Palmer had surgery Tuesday in Houston. Doctors used grafts from other parts of his body and donated tissue to fix the damage during an operation that lasted more than two hours. Palmer headed back to California on Thursday to do his rehabilitation.
"It's not just like it was a torn ACL," Paulos said Thursday, in a phone interview from Houston. "It's a magnitude more difficult to recover from and repair. It can and has ended careers, without a doubt.
"However, I feel very comfortable with Carson as an athlete and the heart that he's got. In the end, that's the bottom line. I can see the look in his eye already. He's ready to get going."
Paulos, an orthopedic surgeon who has worked with the U.S. Ski Team since 1983, replaced the anterior cruciate ligament, which runs through the middle of the knee and provides stability. He said the medial collateral ligament, which runs along the side of the knee, was damaged "real bad."
"On a scale of 1 to 3, it was a 4," he said. "It was off the chart. It was pretty badly damaged -- shredded is the better term."
The kneecap dislocated when Palmer was hit, damaging tissue around it. There also was some cartilage damage, he said.
Paulos was able to repair the knee without removing pieces of cartilage or soft tissue, a good sign.
"The things that were torn could be repaired," he said. "They were not torn beyond repair. So he's got all his parts in there, which is good. We're optimistic, actually."
If rehabilitation goes well, Palmer could be running in a couple of months and might be able to play in the first regular season game, Paulos said. The 2006 schedule hasn't been set.
The Bengals declined to comment on Paulos' description of the injury, but released a statement from him late Thursday night reiterating that he is optimistic about Palmer's recovery.
Palmer has worn a protective brace on the left knee since he sprained it near the end of the 2004 season. The knee bowed inward on von Oelhoffen's hit even though Palmer was wearing the brace,
"The brace didn't function well in this environment and should have done better than it did, frankly," Paulos said.
The plan is for Palmer to wear more substantial braces on both knees when he returns.
"No brace is perfect," Paulos said. "No brace can prevent every injury, but they do help."
Paulos saw the replay of the injury and wasn't surprised at the extent of the damage it caused. Palmer has absolved von Oelhoffen, saying he didn't think the lineman was trying to hurt him. The lineman said he was trying to sack Palmer, not injure him. He wasn't penalized for the hit.
Palmer made the Pro Bowl in only his second season as a starter, throwing an NFL-leading 32 touchdown passes. The club extended his contract through the 2014 season.
Jon Kitna, who has been Palmer's backup and mentor the last two years, can become a free agent. Palmer's injury will force the Bengals to make sure they have another reliable quarterback on board
CINCINNATI (AP) -- Carson Palmer's knee injury was "devastating and potentially career-ending," but his surgeon said Thursday that he is optimistic the Cincinnati Bengals quarterback can recover and play next season.
Palmer tore ligaments in his left knee when he was hit by Pittsburgh's Kimo von Oelhoffen on his first pass during the Steelers' 31-17 playoff victory Sunday.
The team announced that he had torn the anterior cruciate and medial collateral ligaments. The damage was much more extensive and severe, but Dr. Lonnie Paulos said surgery went well and Palmer could be ready for the regular season.
Palmer had surgery Tuesday in Houston. Doctors used grafts from other parts of his body and donated tissue to fix the damage during an operation that lasted more than two hours. Palmer headed back to California on Thursday to do his rehabilitation.
"It's not just like it was a torn ACL," Paulos said Thursday, in a phone interview from Houston. "It's a magnitude more difficult to recover from and repair. It can and has ended careers, without a doubt.
"However, I feel very comfortable with Carson as an athlete and the heart that he's got. In the end, that's the bottom line. I can see the look in his eye already. He's ready to get going."
Paulos, an orthopedic surgeon who has worked with the U.S. Ski Team since 1983, replaced the anterior cruciate ligament, which runs through the middle of the knee and provides stability. He said the medial collateral ligament, which runs along the side of the knee, was damaged "real bad."
"On a scale of 1 to 3, it was a 4," he said. "It was off the chart. It was pretty badly damaged -- shredded is the better term."
The kneecap dislocated when Palmer was hit, damaging tissue around it. There also was some cartilage damage, he said.
Paulos was able to repair the knee without removing pieces of cartilage or soft tissue, a good sign.
"The things that were torn could be repaired," he said. "They were not torn beyond repair. So he's got all his parts in there, which is good. We're optimistic, actually."
If rehabilitation goes well, Palmer could be running in a couple of months and might be able to play in the first regular season game, Paulos said. The 2006 schedule hasn't been set.
The Bengals declined to comment on Paulos' description of the injury, but released a statement from him late Thursday night reiterating that he is optimistic about Palmer's recovery.
Palmer has worn a protective brace on the left knee since he sprained it near the end of the 2004 season. The knee bowed inward on von Oelhoffen's hit even though Palmer was wearing the brace,
"The brace didn't function well in this environment and should have done better than it did, frankly," Paulos said.
The plan is for Palmer to wear more substantial braces on both knees when he returns.
"No brace is perfect," Paulos said. "No brace can prevent every injury, but they do help."
Paulos saw the replay of the injury and wasn't surprised at the extent of the damage it caused. Palmer has absolved von Oelhoffen, saying he didn't think the lineman was trying to hurt him. The lineman said he was trying to sack Palmer, not injure him. He wasn't penalized for the hit.
Palmer made the Pro Bowl in only his second season as a starter, throwing an NFL-leading 32 touchdown passes. The club extended his contract through the 2014 season.
Jon Kitna, who has been Palmer's backup and mentor the last two years, can become a free agent. Palmer's injury will force the Bengals to make sure they have another reliable quarterback on board
Moo
Premium Platinum
Re: Palmer goes Down
On a scale of 1 to 3 ...its a 4
Man that is bad news for Cinnci, hope he gets back to his pro-bowl form, but ? we are looking at 07.
On a scale of 1 to 3 ...its a 4
Man that is bad news for Cinnci, hope he gets back to his pro-bowl form, but ? we are looking at 07.
- Thread starter
- #97
Re: Palmer goes Down
Yes its bad. Our 2006 season is pretty much blown. Hopefully we can make another run in 2007.
And Moo, check this out... this pretty much sums up how I feel about it.
Those Late Hits
By Bob Oates, Latimes.com
This is a football season that has been defined, in large part, by late hitters, who have taken out two of the game's great quarterbacks, Donovan McNabb and Carson Palmer. Last September, the hit that felled McNabb led shortly to season-ending surgery. In the first quarter Sunday, in the first round of the playoffs, it was Palmer who went down and out.
The carnage is happening despite NFL efforts to prevent just that. League policy, in all cases of doubt, is to punish late hitters. Game officials have repeatedly been so advised. What these two incidents demonstrate, among other things, is how hard it is to control the hitters in a sport that is as intrinsically ferocious as football.
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In a happier scene for both quarterbacks, Palmer could have faced McNabb in the Super Bowl on Feb.5
For, in last year's game, McNabb led Philadelphia, which in pre-season forecasts remained a favorite in this year's.
Palmer, when cut down, was battling Ben Roethlisberger for his first playoff victory against AFC rival Pittsburgh.
Injured on the play when he delivered the great pass of the day --- a 66-yard bomb setting up the game's first touchdown --- he was hurt after letting the ball go.
The man who got him, 299-pound defensive end Kimo von Delhoffen, came in not only late but low, striking Palmer's knees. The referee, Larry Semmers, whose primary responsibility is keeping an eye on the quarterback, apparently didn't see it. The TV report, as relayed from the officials, was that von Delhoffen was blocked into Palmer. It didn't happen that way. As the side-view replay clearly shows, von Delhoffen drove both his hands into the blocker's chest, then cut hard and dove inward toward Palmer.
Von Delhoffen wasn't pushed or otherwise aided. He was diving on his own initiative. A Steeler veteran, Von Delhoffen didn't have to hit him --- the ball was gone --- and didn't have to hit him low.
__________
The Question is Why?
Why would a Steeler do such a thing? The worst answer might be the right one: It could have been a blood-feud payback. A month ago in Pittsburgh, Bengal middle linebacker Odell Thurman attacked Steeler quarterback Roethlisberger knee-high.
Afterward, Roethlisberger, in a heavily publicized complaint, took exception to the hit. At absolutely the first opportunity for payback, von Delhoffen ruined Palmer and the Bengals, whose new coach, Marvin Lewis, had in three years led them from 2-14 to 12-5 and the division title.
Palmer, unlike Roeethlisberger, has declined to whine about the attack, but Lewis has pointedly and publicly identified von Delhoffen's blow as a late hit. And in the circumstances, that demands the NFL's largest fine if a widely based defensive crusade against quarterbacks is to be headed off.
Lewis rose to prominence as the 1996-2001 defensive coordinator in Baltimore, where the 2000 Ravens became the only team in a 14-year passing era to win the Super Bowl with defense and a run-based offense. Basically a defensive team, those Ravens won their last three games, including the Super Bowl, only after all three of their opponents had in those games lost their quarterbacks in contact.
__________
The Lawless Ones are a Minority
Curiously, in the Bengals' first playoff start after their biggest regular-season run in many years, the season has ended the way it began for Philadelphia --- which had also been a dominating team. For both the Eagles and Bengals, it all ended with a double foul.
The von Delhoffen hit on Palmer was both late and low. On opening day in Atlanta, Falcon nose tackle Chad Lavalais not only hit McNabb late, he lowered his head to hit him with the crown of his helmet.
Although it's hard to see what else the league could do to shut down its lawless minority, the obvious truth is that if the illegal hitters can't be kept from going after quarterbacks, NFL teams will in time have to get along without most of their most talented and creative artists.
Yes its bad. Our 2006 season is pretty much blown. Hopefully we can make another run in 2007.
And Moo, check this out... this pretty much sums up how I feel about it.
Those Late Hits
By Bob Oates, Latimes.com
This is a football season that has been defined, in large part, by late hitters, who have taken out two of the game's great quarterbacks, Donovan McNabb and Carson Palmer. Last September, the hit that felled McNabb led shortly to season-ending surgery. In the first quarter Sunday, in the first round of the playoffs, it was Palmer who went down and out.
The carnage is happening despite NFL efforts to prevent just that. League policy, in all cases of doubt, is to punish late hitters. Game officials have repeatedly been so advised. What these two incidents demonstrate, among other things, is how hard it is to control the hitters in a sport that is as intrinsically ferocious as football.
ADVERTISEMENT
In a happier scene for both quarterbacks, Palmer could have faced McNabb in the Super Bowl on Feb.5
For, in last year's game, McNabb led Philadelphia, which in pre-season forecasts remained a favorite in this year's.
Palmer, when cut down, was battling Ben Roethlisberger for his first playoff victory against AFC rival Pittsburgh.
Injured on the play when he delivered the great pass of the day --- a 66-yard bomb setting up the game's first touchdown --- he was hurt after letting the ball go.
The man who got him, 299-pound defensive end Kimo von Delhoffen, came in not only late but low, striking Palmer's knees. The referee, Larry Semmers, whose primary responsibility is keeping an eye on the quarterback, apparently didn't see it. The TV report, as relayed from the officials, was that von Delhoffen was blocked into Palmer. It didn't happen that way. As the side-view replay clearly shows, von Delhoffen drove both his hands into the blocker's chest, then cut hard and dove inward toward Palmer.
Von Delhoffen wasn't pushed or otherwise aided. He was diving on his own initiative. A Steeler veteran, Von Delhoffen didn't have to hit him --- the ball was gone --- and didn't have to hit him low.
__________
The Question is Why?
Why would a Steeler do such a thing? The worst answer might be the right one: It could have been a blood-feud payback. A month ago in Pittsburgh, Bengal middle linebacker Odell Thurman attacked Steeler quarterback Roethlisberger knee-high.
Afterward, Roethlisberger, in a heavily publicized complaint, took exception to the hit. At absolutely the first opportunity for payback, von Delhoffen ruined Palmer and the Bengals, whose new coach, Marvin Lewis, had in three years led them from 2-14 to 12-5 and the division title.
Palmer, unlike Roeethlisberger, has declined to whine about the attack, but Lewis has pointedly and publicly identified von Delhoffen's blow as a late hit. And in the circumstances, that demands the NFL's largest fine if a widely based defensive crusade against quarterbacks is to be headed off.
Lewis rose to prominence as the 1996-2001 defensive coordinator in Baltimore, where the 2000 Ravens became the only team in a 14-year passing era to win the Super Bowl with defense and a run-based offense. Basically a defensive team, those Ravens won their last three games, including the Super Bowl, only after all three of their opponents had in those games lost their quarterbacks in contact.
__________
The Lawless Ones are a Minority
Curiously, in the Bengals' first playoff start after their biggest regular-season run in many years, the season has ended the way it began for Philadelphia --- which had also been a dominating team. For both the Eagles and Bengals, it all ended with a double foul.
The von Delhoffen hit on Palmer was both late and low. On opening day in Atlanta, Falcon nose tackle Chad Lavalais not only hit McNabb late, he lowered his head to hit him with the crown of his helmet.
Although it's hard to see what else the league could do to shut down its lawless minority, the obvious truth is that if the illegal hitters can't be kept from going after quarterbacks, NFL teams will in time have to get along without most of their most talented and creative artists.
Moo
Premium Platinum
Re: Palmer goes Down
Fair enough Coasting - I do see your point, but we will have to agree to disagree.
I honestly wish it hadnt happened, I'd rather take the L with Palmer in than the W with him injured.
I am a Steelers fan, maybe this is clouding my vision ...I'd like to think that my seeing it as an accident rather than intentional act would be the same regardless of whether it was the Raiders, Buccs or Cowboys - however I cant be sure.
Fair enough Coasting - I do see your point, but we will have to agree to disagree.
I honestly wish it hadnt happened, I'd rather take the L with Palmer in than the W with him injured.
I am a Steelers fan, maybe this is clouding my vision ...I'd like to think that my seeing it as an accident rather than intentional act would be the same regardless of whether it was the Raiders, Buccs or Cowboys - however I cant be sure.
JeffDunne
TheBrownDog
Re: Moo gets ALL CLEAR
Fantastic game by the Steelers, bad luck to Palmer and to a lesser extent the Bengals. People always talk up these sort of incidents but it has more to do with the injury than it does the actual incident. Anyhow, if the Bengals thought it was a cheap shot, they had plenty of time to do something about it - on the field where it counts.
I'm well and truely on the bandwagon now so watch out. Or should I say Peyton watch out!
I've been on an island for the last week - left just after the game on Monday and arrived back in time for tomorrow's game. No internet, no cable, no mobile - just lots of water and sunshine. So I haven't heard any news or fallout from after the game but I can imagine.Woodson said:
Fantastic game by the Steelers, bad luck to Palmer and to a lesser extent the Bengals. People always talk up these sort of incidents but it has more to do with the injury than it does the actual incident. Anyhow, if the Bengals thought it was a cheap shot, they had plenty of time to do something about it - on the field where it counts.
I'm well and truely on the bandwagon now so watch out. Or should I say Peyton watch out!
Woodson
Former AE commish
- Mar 20, 2001
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Re: The return of the closet Steeler fan
Welcome back JD. The news of the day is that Indy CB Harper has been stabbed by his wife and is doubtful tommorrow. Just hope the Steelers can strike FIRST BLOOD and get the running game churning as it will be crucial to stay in the game by half time. Controlling the clock and NO turnovers will be the key to winning. Set your alarm on JD, I'll be online.
JeffDunne said:I'm well and truely on the bandwagon now so watch out. Or should I say Peyton watch out!
Welcome back JD. The news of the day is that Indy CB Harper has been stabbed by his wife and is doubtful tommorrow. Just hope the Steelers can strike FIRST BLOOD and get the running game churning as it will be crucial to stay in the game by half time. Controlling the clock and NO turnovers will be the key to winning. Set your alarm on JD, I'll be online.
