Autopsy Cats lose to Suns by 64 points.
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Kobe Gryant
In memoriam of 'The Cliff™' Est: 2011-TBC
Vdubs
Hall of Famer
Intention, yes.
Likelihood, no.
We never not try, but it's evident that we have had several wins on the back of brilliant efforts by Danger and Cameron; both out is too much. Danger out is still the difference, and that is an indictment on where we are at that we are still reliant on a 32yo champion at times. ALL teams rely on superstar players, but not as we do.
Anyway, some years it is not about us, and this is one of them.
Finknottle
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- Aug 2, 2020
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Here is how the midfield of the best team in the comp, Sydney, went against Carlton. Shown in the image are the highest ranked players in the match. 5 of the top 6 players on the ground were from the Swans midfield. That midfield contributed 7 of Sydney's 17 goals. Sydney's midfielders also lay a lot of tackles. Rowbotton alone had 15 of them! These Sydney midfielders are good in all facets of the game and they can hurt you in many ways. Our midfield is a long way off.
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- Sep 15, 2005
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... and yet, Vdubs - must we go quietly into the night?
3 losses in a row is never fun; the past two weeks have been particularly dire; a big loss at home and an even bigger loss up Top.
Sucks.
But we've got 7 wins in the bank, and supposedly a very good coach in Chris Scott.
I think we have time to Right the Ship for one Last Dance, as the kids would have it these days.
Yes, Guthrie the Cam looked cooked and depressingly despondent last night.
Hawkins, Duncan, Dangerfield, Tuohy, Rohan - maybe even Jack Henry - are really up against it. But if there is one thing the '22 Cats proved (to me anyway), it's that older talent needn't be overlooked or undervalued if managed correctly.
We're in a Tight Spot, to quote Everett Mcgill, but we have some runs on the board and maybe it's time to find an unlikely balance from this 2024 list.
Scott's coaching philosophy should have it no other way - if we are to be contending every year then he and the MC should be prepared to be both flexible and ruthless - or at the very least realistic and pragmatic - when it comes to team selection.
I for one rate Mitch Knevitt and would be very happy to see him getting some notches on the belt just as Jhye Clark currently is (with good results).
This year might not be about us, but I would absolutely die a happy man if I saw us pinch one in a season like this.
If we knuckle down we can crack Finals for sure; after that conditioning, luck and momentum start to come into play.
Ultimately I kind of agree with you that this year is probably not about us - but if we are to continue being a Serious Club then we have be really accountable and not accept defeat until it has been served to us on a cold platter.
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- Sep 15, 2005
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Can't get a look in at the moment, maybe a target for us even though he's not young?
Every side has different strengths though.
Our midfield performance was okay (not great...but not soul crushingly pathetic) rounds 1-7 and abhorrent rounds 8-10.
You can have a just-okay midfield if your backline are in tremendous form, wingmen are lighting it up and you have a full set of dangerous forwards linking up well with big scoreboard impact. This was the model during our win streak. Yes there were flaws but there were strengths.
The last 3 weeks it is incredibly obvious the midfield has gone down a couple of gears (pressure/tackling/scrapping has disappeared...efficiency with ball in hand has gone haywire...score differentials to opposition from clearances have exploded). At the same time, a number of defenders and a couple of forwards (Cameron, Henry) have also had reduced impact.
Midfield, midfield, midfield, midfield, midfield.
30 disposals each, 30 disposals each, 30 disposals each, 30 disposals each.
It just isn't that simple. I am losing brain power reading it.
There are a whole number of areas to diagnose and rectify, AND an overall midfield performance resembling round 1-7 will be our first step to allow our other players exert their dominance again. Not sitting here wishing we had Matt Rowell or Chad Warner arrive mid-season.
"Why don't we have a Gold Coast/Sydney/GWS/Port super midfield" is a tired screech we will hear 3000 more times but it is utterly boring and pointless for this season. Getting back to playing Geelong football will do for now. The last 3 weeks, outside of a second half against Port and one quarter against Gold Coast, has not been it.
This. So much this.
I absolutely knew when a couple of losses rolled in (particularly when we had our first big loss) that the defeatist narrative and sardonic pessimists would be fully engaged.
"It was all pointless" "We were always pretenders" "A soft draw saw us fluke some wins" and "time to look to 2025; this season is futile". You know the drill. Anything we did right round 1-7 would be invalidated because what everyone knew would happen finally came to be.
There are these things called form and output that fluctuate for basically all teams throughout a season. Away games are always difficult to win. The Port game was the big blunder, but on their day they are no mugs (they suffer inconsistency issues themselves). It can be both correct to say the side has performed poorly over the past 3 weeks, while maintaining that they executed a lot of things very well during rounds 1-7.
Our midfield has not once been dominant but a stack of midfielders getting 18-20 mostly clean disposals on reduced game time - with a few of them laying 7-10 effective tackles - is a WHOLE LOT DIFFERENT to these players getting 10-15 scrappy touches and letting opposition midfielders walk it up to goal in a series of devastatingly effective scoring chains. Our pressure rating was number 1 through the win streak. Tackles were sticking. Opposition midfielders were hacking it straight to our intercept defenders, and often failing to receive coaches votes. All of these areas have seen a dramatic decline during the losing streak.
Ultimately we are very reliant still on Cameron and Stewart starring. That also stopped after round 6/7. If they bounce back and a couple of veterans find one last breath, we will once again be very competitive. Which, by the way, we were until Friday night.
Giving up on the season is just silly. Tinkering with things to improve and freshen up the team? Absolutely, this is crucial. If some of these changes also benefit our long term rebuild, even better. You can focus on both at the same time (the now, and the future). It is what our whole club is based around this century.
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that's it right there.
That's the Chris Scott/Joel Selwood Era philosophy, and it yielded one, arguably two Flags for the club.
We're Always Contendin'.
We are definitely slumping currently.
Here is Chris Scott's biggest challenge: can he divorce himself from the sentimentality of backing in each and every veteran player who has accompanied him on his journey with the club?
How pragmatic and ruthless can he (and of course by extension the Match Committee and The Club) be in pursuit of the Greater Good in 2024? He had no issue in making those ruthless calls on his way to coaching the 2011 Flag side.
This is why they pay him the big bucks.
Gotta rally and show more than we did in the 2nd half this week; gotta dig deep. I think this list has some depth of character to it; Scott and the coaching team have to find a way to tap into that character and probably re-combine things for a mid-season freshen-up.
There are probably ''better'' teams in it this year, but if we aim to get into the finals then we give ourselves a chance. Time to take a hard look at the list and see who might slot in - or out - to give us a much-needed edge.
Dude, you were sub! We saw you running round out there.
- Jan 25, 2008
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Firstly, sample size of 2 games is statistically insignificant.
Secondly, one of the games he played was in a game where the conditions were ridiculously unfavourable.
Thirdly, he has played 7 career games.
Conclusion, we know nothing about Neale yet.
- Jan 25, 2008
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Grundy has been sacked by 2 clubs in the last 2 seasons.
1 club had a good other option in the ruck, the other club had worse options in the ruck than we do.
Both clubs have been successful without Grundy since he left.
There are reasons for that.
catters05
Norm Smith Medallist
Darwin is fine, but for the 2-3 games they should be in July. May is too early.
He actually turned 34 in April.
He seems to going okay at Sydney, and they’re going okay with him.
We have been beaten by different game styles the last 3 weeks.
This is a bad indication.
Older players are on the decline because of injury and age. Younger players are unknown at this stage.
Concerning situation.
This is a bad indication.
Older players are on the decline because of injury and age. Younger players are unknown at this stage.
Concerning situation.
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catstorm
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****en hell, how sad of an individual do you have to be to come into another teams board for a game you were not involved in to lol react to posts 
Watching last nights game I immediately thought of that comparison.
I have spent a COUPLE OF years bagging McDonald. Last night with a winning midfield in front of him he looked a player ...at last. 54 game mark.
McDonald is a year older than Neale I think. He has played many more AFL games than Neale because outside Buddy they have had little else in tall fit forward stocks and it was easy to pick him. Neale has had the best AFL forward combo to get past, so his low AFL game count is not surprising.
Neale has had to work on his skill development in the VFL (when not injured). I bang on about this I know but playing in our undermanned VFL side these last couple of years was a very poor environment: Little ball at the forward end and no systematic delivery when it did arrive. It does not surprise me that Neale still has lots to learn.
What has surprised me is the way he has taken the very few chances he has had. His marking has been satisfactory ( He did take 5 marks on Thursday night! and got in to position to drop a number of others. Even that negative has a positive silver lining for me.
Footywire
2023
| Description | Date | Opponent | Result | K | HB | D | M | G | B | T | HO | GA | I50 | CL | CG | R50 | FF | FA | BL |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
Round 24 | Aug 26 | 3 | 5 | 8 | 6 | 1 | 0 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 1 | | ||
Round 23 | Aug 19 | 0 | 3 | 3 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 5 | 6 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 1 | | ||
Round 22 | Aug 11 | 6 | 4 | 10 | 5 | 0 | 2 | 3 | 12 | 1 | 2 | 1 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | |
| Description | Date | Opponent | Result | K | HB | D | M | G | B | T | HO | GA | I50 | CL | CG | R50 | FF | FA | AF | SC |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
Round 10 | May 16 | Suns | 6 | 5 | 11 | 5 | 2 | 1 | 0 | 8 | 1 | 2 | 2 | 7 | 1 | 0 | 3 | 55 | 34 | |
Round 5 | Apr 14 | 6 | 1 | 7 | 4 | 3 | 1 | 6 | 5 | 0 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 80 | 88 |
Even including the game v Saints last year ( rucking v Marshall ?) he has contributed. In the game v the Bulldogs ( I think ) he missed at least 2 (very gettable for him) shots at goal after marking and gave one away with a nice pass to a forward 10m out.
Logan for me points out why Neale should be fast tracked = played.
203 cm Forwards don't grow on trees and they don't grow quickly enough in hostile environments (VFL).
Let the younger mids, Ollie, and Neale grow together. What has happened so far in 2024 has exceeded my predictions by a lot but I still think we are building, and not serious top 4 contenders this year. Next year without Hawk and with Neale acclimatised we might be.
A team that strolls into goal with no pressure at all. Just ask Jack Henry.
Really useful graphics, Boris.
Interesting that compared to previous three wins the last three losses has Cuthrie (returning) and more Blitz. Says 2 things IMO -
- understandable desire to throw back in an (near) A grade mid, however now obvious was a mistake - massively underdone and really needed 3 games in VFL first. Chronic foot/toe problems can be hard to fix. Wouldn’t be surprised still a problem. Has cost us - should have played Hardie.
- Blitz there more due to A grade/big bodied opposition (and to cover for Danger loss), which he’s struggled to contain and to cover for Stanley.
This thread has (understandably) focused on Cats issues but there isn’t much about the quality of the opposition-
In the top possession winners and goal kickers, the National Draft selections:
1
2x2
3
6x2
11
The only sub 11 pick was Miller (!)
(above cohort didn’t include Swallow- another ND #1, who also played well)
All except Hymphrey are seasoned, mature bodied players. Shows how chronically bad the Suns have been on ‘return on investment’. Really should have been top 6 (or arguably top 2) last 2-3 years with that in the list, particularly with a nominal home ground advantage (playing in heat, dewy conditions). With a triple premiership coach now, there is absolutely no excuse if they are not playing off in a GF in the next 3 years.
If the Suns were a company, as a chronic underperformer with great assets, a Private Equity firm would have bought them, sold off most of the stars and re-branded and sold back to AFL as the Tassie Devils.
I like the Suns, but their underperformance annoys me (… if you haven’t gathered from my rant!)
In the top possession winners and goal kickers, the National Draft selections:
1
2x2
3
6x2
11
The only sub 11 pick was Miller (!)
(above cohort didn’t include Swallow- another ND #1, who also played well)
All except Hymphrey are seasoned, mature bodied players. Shows how chronically bad the Suns have been on ‘return on investment’. Really should have been top 6 (or arguably top 2) last 2-3 years with that in the list, particularly with a nominal home ground advantage (playing in heat, dewy conditions). With a triple premiership coach now, there is absolutely no excuse if they are not playing off in a GF in the next 3 years.
If the Suns were a company, as a chronic underperformer with great assets, a Private Equity firm would have bought them, sold off most of the stars and re-branded and sold back to AFL as the Tassie Devils.
I like the Suns, but their underperformance annoys me (… if you haven’t gathered from my rant!)
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Tend to agree but as a young KPF who is finally on the park after injury setbacks I’ll back him in .
Give him 2 more preseasons of conditioning and footy smarts and he’ll be a beauty IMO.
Not a lot to be positive about this game but I thought Dempsey battled hard and did some very good things against the odds.
Also Mullin looks to have improved out of sight and seems to relish being around the ball- FMD he’s a quick tough unit and his kicking has gone next level- big tick.
Conway was narrowly beaten but he got 21 touches and showed some positive signs for game 4.
Win another 2 before the Bye and we’ll be in reasonable shape, we’re not dead yet
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