Analysis Witts and Grundy development

[Alexander323bc]

Been thinking during these last few weeks about gun midfielders and the impact ruckmen have on their effectiveness. Could the development if Witts and Grundy offset the loss of Beams? So while we may not improve as much as we would like to, surely we are not going to drop off as much as people think. Do our Ruckmen now become critical in us making the 8?

 

[TW Sherrin]

the major issue we have to overcome is injuries. given a reasonable run we can make finals.

 

[MISFITS]

Been thinking during these last few weeks about gun midfielders and the impact ruckmen have on their effectiveness. Could the development if Witts and Grundy offset the loss of Beams? So while we may not improve as much as we would like to, surely we are not going to drop off as much as people think. Do our Ruckmen now become critical in us making the 8?

Could we entice big Monkey to return to his home at Victoria Park?
Damien Monkhorst has been developing a small army of ruckmen at Hawthorn!
Macevoy benefitted from a stint in the 2's!
Grimly and Lowden could play 1sts for most clubs but cannot get a game in the Hawthorn seniors due to being excess to needs!
All courtesy due to a great VFL development system and a progressive ruck/forward coach in Monkhorst!

 

[Vicky Park]

Just so excited about these two.

But can someone please advise - have we replaced Huddo as specialist ruck coach?

 

[mike123]

I think we should play the two instead of one and White. It allows them to be more rested and more effective in the ruck and up forward.

 

[Pies_10]

Both will be good, however Witts will be the better actual ruckman.
I can see Grundy going forward and kicking a few.

 

[mike123]

Both will be good, however Witts will be the better actual ruckman.
I can see Grundy going forward and kicking a few.

I actually think the exact opposite.

 

[Vass]

I actually think the exact opposite.

I think they can both be 50 50. Witts IMO has showed more to date, he will monster opponents. He also reads the play pretty well up forward. Grundy is more athletic and has a good leap, but needs to improve hes around the ground work, which i think he will. I think they can complement each other very well, it will give the coaching stuff good flexibility.

 

[Reykjavik]

I actually think the exact opposite.

With you there. I see Grundy as number one and Witts as Forward/Ruck like Ryder.

 

[mike123]

I think they can both be 50 50. Witts IMO has showed more to date, he will monster opponents. He also reads the play pretty well up forward. Grundy is more athletic and has a good leap, but needs to improve hes around the ground work, which i think he will. I think they can complement each other very well, it will give the coaching stuff good flexibility.

From what I've seen so far Grundy is better at a hit-outs to advantage IMO and also is better at second efforts. Witts is better around with around the marking and accumulating possessions. Witts is a better set shot than Grundy but and has better leading patterns up forward IMO.

 

[partypie]

I actually think the exact opposite.

That's the beauty of them both - Witts can use pure size to clunk a few and he's a good finisher 25-40m out from goal. Brodie is more of your hard leading type and I was left impressed and surprised at his contested marking ability (a few of his efforts when he was outnumbered 2 or 3-on-1 late in the season were especially impressive).

He can also kick the shit out of it and anywhere within 55m isn't out out of the question for him as we've seen, which is unusual for a ruckman as they aren't usually great when it comes to penetration with their kicking despite their size and he's almost a little bit mercurial in terms of what he can do at times - ie. drilling one from 50 on the RHF flank on the wrong side for a right footer which you *never* see a ruckman do (like he did at the end of the 2014 Anzac Day game).

There's a spot for both of them in our best 22 - especially as Grundy's speed and agility continues to improve along with his tank.

 

[SwanBet]

I actually think the exact opposite.

IMO Witts provides better delivery to the mids with superior taps, however grundy seems better in the contest with things like tackling.

i'm not sold on either of them forward tbh, Witts is useless at ground level, and isn't a great mark over head, whereas Grundy just struggles to attract the footy when he plays forward.

Interestingly i noticed towards the backend of the season we would actually play both of them together in the ruck around stoppages and particularly at boundary throw ins, where one would go third man up. I felt all year we were better playing 2 ruckman and 2 key forwards, and our form at the start of the year was with this structure.

 

[Morganashlee]

Witts really started to come on after the public spray by Bucks. He held his ground more often and found a way to impact contests using his size. With that change came an increase in his contested marking. Witts really took a step passed Brodie this year, hopefully they can both continue to develop in 2015.

 

[otfc42]

The main positive for this trade period is what hasn't been said by fellow BF posters...'we need a bloody ruckman...!'

Looking forward to watching the two big guys go around next year. Sometimes playing together and also competing for the number 1 position on other occasions.

Most clubs would love to have our young combination.

 

[Jelly Bean]

Witts really started to come on after the public spray by Bucks. He held his ground more often and found a way to impact contests using his size. With that change came an increase in his contested marking. Witts really took a step passed Brodie this year, hopefully they can both continue to develop in 2015.

That was the exact moment, wasn't it. That was at 3QTR time, and he kicked two goals in the final quarter and then continued to kick goals and/or take contested marks from that point.

Grundy is a better tap ruckman though. Witts still doesn't really get off the ground much and doesn't use his reach much.

 

[Bay Pie]

These guys have the greatest ability to influence our fortunes next year, out of any 2 youngsters on our list.

3rd year players now. Both need a big pre-season with no injuries then hit the ground running to start the year. Very bullish about these guys this year.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

How lucky are we to have two of the most promising big men in the AFL on our list
And we get to discuss which of them is best suited to which role

Collingwood...heading back to the top

 

[ottoman]

How lucky are we to have two of the most promising big men in the AFL on our list
And we get to discuss which of them is best suited to which role

Collingwood...heading back to the top

make that 3. Moore

 

[Dynamics]

Just so excited about these two.

But can someone please advise - have we replaced Huddo as specialist ruck coach?

Good question.

Anyone?

 

[otfc42]

That was the exact moment, wasn't it. That was at 3QTR time, and he kicked two goals in the final quarter and then continued to kick goals and/or take contested marks from that point.

Grundy is a better tap ruckman though. Witts still doesn't really get off the ground much and doesn't use his reach much.

Not so sure about that JB. His last 6 or so games I was hugely impressed with some of his deft taps, especially in contests around the ground. I felt he would have been even more effective if our peripheral players blocked the spaces that our mids were trying to get to. Some work to be done there.

 

[PieNSauce]

No knowledge of the specialist ruck coach position sorry.

On Witts and Grundy I have to say that I am excited to see how they go next season. I saw some real progress this year and it will be unsurprising if that progress continues. From what I saw this year the key will be for these two to improve their ability to direct the ball to advantage rather than just be competitive or just get their hands to the ball. Their competitiveness is the area where I saw the biggest improvement this year and if you add a little confidence and composure to that they will be a massive asset. They may even more than amply make up for the loss of Beams. Let's face it, since the big sook left we have not actually been able to win the clearances even though these two have been nullifying opposition ruckmen to some extent or even getting first hands to the ball.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

It was interesting to hear Grundy at the Copeland.
He said our new forward coach "wants him kicking more goals"
So I assume that means he will be spending a lot more time forward, I like it.....stretch the opposition defenses

 

[Chilli Con Incarnate]

The main positive for this trade period is what hasn't been said by fellow BF posters...'we need a bloody ruckman...!'

Looking forward to watching the two big guys go around next year. Sometimes playing together and also competing for the number 1 position on other occasions.

Most clubs would love to have our young combination.

But we need a bloody ruck coach!

 

[Taylor]

White and one of these two was playing because you lost so much run due to playing so many depth players who weren't up to the workload of your first choice 22.

 

[orion21]

It was interesting to hear Grundy at the Copeland.
He said our new forward coach "wants him kicking more goals"
So I assume that means he will be spending a lot more time forward, I like it.....stretch the opposition defenses

Yes this interested me as well. I think we need to play both in side but was worried about their forward impact. Seems like Grace (think he new forward coach) wants more goals out of Grundy so it seems perhaps they will go with the witts/grundy combo. Personally think in another 2 years these 2 along with Freeman and Shaz will be our most important top 4 players...........