Irish BlueBagger
Ophidian Old Boys Season 37 Grand Final Winner
Yes it was fine.
Banter Who will be Better in 2025, Collingwood or Carlton? Part 4
- Thread starter Wosh
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Banter threads are not to be taken too seriously. Have fun. Let others have fun.
Correct.
After the league moved on from the suburban VFL country zones to national AFL with a draft and salary cap Carlton have been poor. The Blueshizens have only made 3 GFs - for 1 win and 2 losses - in the AFL era (which is 35 seasons in now).
Old crusty Baggers don't seem to care that Carlton have been uncompetitive, because they remember the glory days from 50 years ago when the VFL gave them a plum country zone.
In 2025, unfortunately for Carlton there will be no magic return to VFL era, instead we get to enjoy the Blueshizens of modern AFL era once more.
How will we ever bridge that 5 game gap in the modern era
Irish BlueBagger
Ophidian Old Boys Season 37 Grand Final Winner
Outside of beating the Saints your club has only won two flags since 1958.
Where does this delusion that you are a powerhouse club come from? It must be some pretty powerful drugs some of you are on!
Collingwood haven't been a power club since the 1930's. It's only been the odd flag here and there for you since then.
Competed in more than 1 of every 3 Grand Finals contested since the beginning of the competition.Outside of beating the Saints your club has only won two flags since 1958.
Where does this delusion that you are a powerhouse club come from? It must be some pretty powerful drugs some of you are on!
Collingwood haven't been a power club since the 1930's. It's only been the odd flag here and there for you since then.
Have won more games of football than any other team in the competition.
That's why Collingwood are a powerhouse, and we don't have to focus on limited timelines to argue as such.
Irish BlueBagger
Ophidian Old Boys Season 37 Grand Final Winner
You still flatter to deceive more often than not in grand finals though.
For all the competitive advantages handed to Collingwood on a plate, three flags over the course of the last seven decades is a very poor return.
Anyway it 2025 and we'll be finishing in front of you again!
Again, we use the total data, and don't have to focus on limited timeframes.
Most premierships
Most Grand Finals
Most Top 4 finishes
Most Finals appearances
Most Finals games won
The powerhouse of the VFL/AFL competition.
Irish BlueBagger
Ophidian Old Boys Season 37 Grand Final Winner
You don't have most premierships outright yet. You forgot to mention the twenty seven grand final defeats as well.
Greatest chokers of all time
Even in the last 14 GF season appearances, won 3 lost 11
Even in the last 14 GF season appearances, won 3 lost 11
Yep because 'winning a spoon' is a much greater achievement than 'losing a Grand Final'.You don't have most premierships outright yet. You forgot to mention the twenty seven grand final defeats as well.
Collingwood = Powerhouse.
And Carlton too are awesome, having not lost a Grand Final for 25 years...
- Mar 25, 2019
- 13,785
- 28,300
- AFL Club
- Carlton
And yet how many flags in the last 60 years?
- Oct 25, 2001
- 14,842
- 12,414
- AFL Club
- Collingwood
- Other Teams
- IOM Gyms, Preston Nth End
You destroyed the moral fabric of your club. These days 5th is an achievement.
We keep making Grand Finals through hard work and moral fibre.
We win lots and lose more: it's to be expected given the League is forever bending rules to favour weak clubs like Carlton and Sydney.
AFL bending the rules for all clubs apart from the Pies
You destroyed the moral fabric of your club. These days 5th is an achievement.
We keep making Grand Finals through hard work and moral fibre.
We win lots and lose more: it's to be expected given the League is forever bending rules to favour weak clubs like Carlton and Sydney.
Irish BlueBagger
Ophidian Old Boys Season 37 Grand Final Winner
Participation ribbons might be good enough for Collingwood, but they'll never be good enough for Carlton.
You destroyed the moral fabric of your club. These days 5th is an achievement.
We keep making Grand Finals through hard work and moral fibre.
We win lots and lose more: it's to be expected given the League is forever bending rules to favour weak clubs like Carlton and Sydney.
We'll look at actual successful modern-day clubs like Geelong, Hawthorn and Richmond as our example on how to do things.
Robertio
Spotswood Guinness Bar manager
You keep banging on about this and when asked you haven't provided a shred of evidence besides you think so, time now to put up or shut up.
Robertio
Spotswood Guinness Bar manager
Don't you get tired of posting the same stuff?
JustaBattler
Everyone Looks Better In Blue
- May 31, 2012
- 28,722
- 67,349
- AFL Club
- Carlton
I think there is more improvement potential in the Carlton players already on the list than can be expected from Collingwood players on their list - against which best 22 Collingwood players dont really have to improve.
In terms of traded out players - I prefer to see Moir/Motlop/Kemp/Durdin as forward defensive and goal kicking options
In terms of Kennedy out - I think E Holland, Smith have him covered for outside duties and Docherty as a rotation has him covered for each way running
Collingwood have a proven big match capability from their lineup - however, banter aside, the results of 2024 show that there isnt much difference between the sides in close hard fought encounters a goal each way is proof of that
Whilst I can see Collingwood having a strong season aided by a fitter squad and the inclusion of a couple of developed good players with some added depth in forward marking power - I can also see Carlton improving merely from the same fitter list but more importantly the inherent improvement from another pore-season into younger players..
It will be interesting to see wether or not Carlton can improve both forward defensive performance ( the main negative in 2024) and wether they can also improve the between the arcs ball movement in transition if there is improvement in either of these areas I think Carlton will start to blow teams off the park - more regularly.
Whilst Collingwood have an ability to score quickly and heavily - Carlton proved that they could score quickly and heavilly against better opposition in 2024 - the main difference between the two Clubs and it should be expected- is that when Collingwodo got their best forwrd on line on the park they wer emore reliable and consistent - they find a way against most opposition - and they can do this because they are a better kicking team and have faster outside runners.
One Club strong and trying to develop consistency the other Club all things going well should be a contender - again.
Toss a coin which club will finish higher than the other - both supporter groups have plenty to be confident about.
Round 4 will see the first match-up Carlton coming off a game against Hawthorn and Collingwood coming off a game against the Doggies.
I hope both Clubs are in great form in this game - it should be one of the best games of the year to look forward to.
In terms of traded out players - I prefer to see Moir/Motlop/Kemp/Durdin as forward defensive and goal kicking options
In terms of Kennedy out - I think E Holland, Smith have him covered for outside duties and Docherty as a rotation has him covered for each way running
Collingwood have a proven big match capability from their lineup - however, banter aside, the results of 2024 show that there isnt much difference between the sides in close hard fought encounters a goal each way is proof of that
Whilst I can see Collingwood having a strong season aided by a fitter squad and the inclusion of a couple of developed good players with some added depth in forward marking power - I can also see Carlton improving merely from the same fitter list but more importantly the inherent improvement from another pore-season into younger players..
It will be interesting to see wether or not Carlton can improve both forward defensive performance ( the main negative in 2024) and wether they can also improve the between the arcs ball movement in transition if there is improvement in either of these areas I think Carlton will start to blow teams off the park - more regularly.
Whilst Collingwood have an ability to score quickly and heavily - Carlton proved that they could score quickly and heavilly against better opposition in 2024 - the main difference between the two Clubs and it should be expected- is that when Collingwodo got their best forwrd on line on the park they wer emore reliable and consistent - they find a way against most opposition - and they can do this because they are a better kicking team and have faster outside runners.
One Club strong and trying to develop consistency the other Club all things going well should be a contender - again.
Toss a coin which club will finish higher than the other - both supporter groups have plenty to be confident about.
Round 4 will see the first match-up Carlton coming off a game against Hawthorn and Collingwood coming off a game against the Doggies.
I hope both Clubs are in great form in this game - it should be one of the best games of the year to look forward to.
Well you've certainly mastered the Richmond model - well on your way to three consecutive decades where you've barely won a final...Participation ribbons might be good enough for Collingwood, but they'll never be good enough for Carlton.
We'll look at actual successful modern-day clubs like Geelong, Hawthorn and Richmond as our example on how to do things.
I very much agree that the boring crusty Baggers gloating about winning 7 flags 50 years ago during VFL zoning is boring and repetitive.
It ain't relevant anymore, Carlton fans are stuck in the past.
2024 Carlton couldn't beat Collingwood.
Carlton enters season 2025 with an ACTIVE 24 year streak since they even managed a top 4 H&A finish...let alone even making a GF.
Robertio
Spotswood Guinness Bar manager
2024 Collingwood couldn't beat Essendon, cost them a finals birth, Carlton played in a Prelim in 2023 you know where the top 4 play to see who makes the GF and back it up with finals again in2024. Wonder how the Pies went in 2024?
PinnochiArr0w points out that Dopple references Carlton posters talking about what happened 50 years ago, with another post from Dopple highlighting what happened in the most recent season, together with a reference to an active streak.
And he thinks he hit some type of gotcha...
And he thinks he hit some type of gotcha...
Carlton poster highlighting Carlton's 2023 Preliminary Final, as some type of gotcha, to a Collingwood supporter...
Yeah, I wish my team could have played their first Preliminary Final in over two decades, then followed up in 2024 with an Owen 60 Elimination Final performance, instead of actually winning the flag in 2023....
We're sooooo jealous!
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