Prediction Who will be better in 2025? Carlton or Hawthorn

Who will be better in 2025

  • Hawthorn

    Votes: 155 68.9%
  • Carlton

    Votes: 70 31.1%

  • Total voters
    225

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I think most would agree for example that comparatively a player coming 6th in BnF for the premier (who also made AA squad) had a better year than a player coming 8th for a team that didn't finish top 4 and didn't make AA squad.

But some ignore the above and prefer to lean on footywire profiles and who had more stats as their "evidence" of who had a better year.
I think he's forgetting that Nic Newman has finished second in Carlton's past two best and fairests when he's making his argument....
 
I think he's forgetting that Nic Newman has finished second in Carlton's past two best and fairests when he's making his argument....
Lol what does this have to do with anything?

If anything this strengthens my point. Is Nic Newman now a better player currently than every player that didn't finish top 2 in their respective club's BnF?
 
This is especially the case when comparing players from different teams.
Yes not really fair to use 2024 BnFs when trying to talk 2025 performance.

Hawks still have their entire top10 on the list fit and raring to go, and have added two players who finished top10 in BnFs at other clubs in 2024.... probably why majority expect Hawks to pull further in front of Carlton in 2025.
 

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Yes not really fair to use 2024 BnFs when trying to talk 2025 performance.

Hawks still have their entire top10 on the list fit and raring to go, and have added two players who finished top10 in BnFs at other clubs in 2024.... probably why majority expect Hawks to pull further in front of Carlton in 2025.
Have enjoyed the trolling but seems this topic has now diverged into something completely different. Hope you have submitted your vote in the poll at the top of the page - should hopefully be a fun season!
 
Feel free to highlight any 'trolling'?

Ironic you used that term in response to a post that was very much on topic.
Apologies, I must have been a bit delirious with joy after your Newman comment which proved the whole point I was making. Not often we agree on something - my hope in it ever happening was fading fast before tonight.
 
Yes not really fair to use 2024 BnFs when trying to talk 2025 performance.

Hawks still have their entire top10 on the list fit and raring to go, and have added two players who finished top10 in BnFs at other clubs in 2024.... probably why majority expect Hawks to pull further in front of Carlton in 2025.
Hawks have a very good list. A deep 22 but lack the star power that others possess and are still lacking in a couple of key spots.

A team with Chol and Ramsden as the spearheads up forward for instance, doesn't fill me with confidence, a lot will depend on if they can get Dear and Lewis back on the park and playing good football.
 
Have enjoyed the trolling but seems this topic has now diverged into something completely different. Hope you have submitted your vote in the poll at the top of the page - should hopefully be a fun season!
Thinking the Hawks will be better in 2025 because they were better in 2024 and have added two top quality players (both have had consecutive top 10 BnF finishes at respective clubs in 2023/24)...is trolling?

Pointing out flaws in using footywire profiles as "evidence" as to which players are better. Give me Hardwick over Saad despite less "stats" .....is trolling?
 
Thinking the Hawks will be better in 2025 because they were better in 2024 and have added two top quality players (both have had consecutive top 10 BnF finishes at respective clubs in 2023/24)...is trolling?
What does this have to do with the topic about comparing players from different teams by using BnF results?
 
I'm not sure my reference to Newman proved any point you were trying to make.

But anyway....
You said Nic Newman has finished top-2 in Carlton's BnF over the last two years.

Does that now mean he has been better than any player who hasn't achieved that same feat in 23' and 24 for their club'?
 
What does this have to do with the topic about comparing players from different teams by using BnF results?
Pointing out flaws in using footywire profiles as "evidence" as to which players are better.

Hardwick came 4th in Hawks BnF, compared to Saad who wasn't top 10.

BnF results a much better way of evaluating players, but some will use "stats" as evidence that Saad was better.

And yes, a bit silly to expect all 12 players on Hawks list who were top 10 in their club BnF to again be top 10 in 2025...if Hawks improve to a top4 team a strong BnF results is much more impressive.
 
You said Nic Newman has finished top-2 in Carlton's BnF over the last two years.

Does that now mean he has been better than any player who hasn't achieved that same feat in 23' and 24 for their club'?
He's had two great years, but the point was let's not pretend it's harder to finish in Carlton's top 5 than any other team in the comp, which is the point you were trying to make...
 

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Hardwick came 4th in Hawks BnF, compared to Saad who wasn't top 10.

BnF results a much better way of evaluating players, but some will use "stats" as evidence that Saad was better.
And Sicily didn't finish in the top 10 of the Hawthorn BnF. Must mean there were at least 180 players better than him in 2024!
 
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Thinking the Hawks will be better in 2025 because they were better in 2024 and have added two top quality players (both have had consecutive top 10 BnF finishes at respective clubs in 2023/24)...is trolling?

Pointing out flaws in using footywire profiles as "evidence" as to which players are better. Give me Hardwick over Saad despite less "stats" .....is trolling?
Hardwick over Saad

Spider Man Lol GIF
 
He's had two great years, but the point was let's not pretend it's harder to finish in Carlton's top 5 than any other team in the comp, which is the point you were trying to make...
I did not even come close to making this point at all. My argument had nothing to do with Carlton - it's about comparing BnFs of ANY two teams.
 
He's had two great years, but the point was let's not pretend it's harder to finish in Carlton's top 5 than any other team in the comp, which is the point you were trying to make...
To quote you - "Carlton rely on their top 6 more than any other team in the comp"

Would be a very hard top 5 BNF to crack into in that case
 
Hawks have a very good list. A deep 22 but lack the star power that others possess and are still lacking in a couple of key spots.

A team with Chol and Ramsden as the spearheads up forward for instance, doesn't fill me with confidence, a lot will depend on if they can get Dear and Lewis back on the park and playing good football.
Hawks had 8 players kick 20 goals in 2024, and that didn't include Lewis.

Adding some quality KPDs also allows the Hawks to throw Sicily forward when it suits.

A forward line of - Sicily, Dear, Moore, Ginni, Lewis, Wizard and MacDonald - goes alright. And then they have Chol, Breust, Gunston as depth before you get to kids.
 
To quote you - "Carlton rely on their top 6 more than any other team in the comp"

Would be a very hard top 5 BNF to crack into in that case
If ever their top 6 all played 100% of games every season and were in prime form, yes it would be...

But as we know, that never happens.

And it is also a comment on the players outside their top 6.
 
And Sicily didn't finish in the top 10 of the Hawthorn BnF. Must mean there were at least 180 players better than him in 2024!
All more reason to be confident in Hawthorn improving in 2025.

Sicily and Day, two of the Hawks most talented players, both had average seasons in 2024.

Lewis, their best KPF, couldn't get on the park.

Plus they add two quality defenders (top 6 players from respective clubs) in Battle and Barrass.

And then the "growth" from their kids.
 

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Prediction Who will be better in 2025? Carlton or Hawthorn


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