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Coach Who should be our next coach?

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15/8 Board toppled (reportedly will pursue Clarkson)
19/8 Alastair Clarkson to join North
21/8 Ben Rutten sacked
22/8 Coach selection sub-committee to be established to find a replacement
26/8 Committee members announced: Josh Mahoney (GM-Footy, chair), Dorothy Hisgrove (Board member), Andrew Thorburn, Simone McKinnis, Robert Walls, Jordan Lewis
7/9 James Hird, Dean Solomon, Brendon Lade, Adem Yze interviewed at EY
13/9 Daniel Giansiracusa reportedly interviewed
17/9 Don Pyke “not pursuing that at this stage”
21/9 Brad Scott contacted by the club but won’t make a decision on whether to pursue the role until after the Grand Final
21/9 Adem Yze has second interview and tours the training facilities at Tullamarine
22/9 Blake Caracella will put his hat in the ring
27/9 Brendon Lade appointed as assistant coach at the Western Bulldogs, out of the running for Essendon job
28/9 Brad Scott to be interviewed on Thursday
29/9
 
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Lore said:
Rutten's record was eight years of coaching at the time he was sacked, including 2 years as Senior Coach (18.27 including one elimination finals loss), 4 years as an assistant with the Tigers with a record of 60.34 including four finals wins and two premierships (he missed their third one). Two years as an assistant at Essendon in 2019 and 2020, (18.1.20), with an elimination final loss. Perhaps experience in one other team for four years and two premierships is not good enough, and fair enough if that's how it lands given he didn't produce much thereafter.

But you can't say "need someone more experienced" and then come up with someone who has half as much experience 7 years out of date at a club that was a complete shambles before, during and after, and still is today, and go "yep, that's exactly the kind of experience we had in mind!"


If Hird comes in it's because he's got gravitas or friends in high places or everyone else dropped out of the race and he Bradbury'd it in.

Perhaps, in the grand tradition of Essington, we make one more appointment based on business leadership and potential commercial opportunities, rather than prioritising football success. That would be such a Brasher/Campbell thing to do... but I thought we were hoping to get away from that?

Maybe he had a super impressive interview, and told them everything he *ed up before and how he'd do it better next time. Perhaps he has so much charisma that they even believed him.

But it's not because of his experience as a successful coach in a professionally run football organisation, because he has none.
Click to expand...

Truck was only at Richmond for 1 premiership.
 
Mr Mojo Risin said:
Maybe, but has he had any recent experience?

Can't see him winning in a proper process over Yze, Graham etc
Click to expand...


Why do you think recent experience matters?

Not rhetorical. Actually reason it out. What is it from the last 5 to 7 years that has changed so much?

The games changes but not that dramatically. We're still well within the same defensive evolution of the game post Sydney/early Hawthorn and Lyon. Ground defence, forward defence, pressure, transition are all fundamentally the same. Rule changes have opened the ground a little.

Do you remember him bagging Reimers after kicking 8 for his lack defence? Howlett and Kommer (I shudder at the thought) playing forward defensive roles? Jetta couldn't get a game.

They were still newish concepts at the time, or perhaps, they were new to football coverage.

It's not like his experience was from coaching in the 90s.
 

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Hypothetical Question(s)

If Paul Roos came out and said he was desperate to coach again:

a) Should Essendon target him?
b) Would we make him go through the process?
c) Would his absence of 6 years in the coaches box matter?
 
Mr Mojo Risin said:
Hypothetical Question(s)

If Paul Roos came out and said he was desperate to coach again:

a) Should Essendon target him?
b) Would we make him go through the process?
c) Would his absence of 6 years in the coaches box matter?
Click to expand...
a. Yes
b. Yes
c. Yes

And that's for a premiership coach who oversaw two extremely successful handovers.
 
BrunoV said:
Why do you think recent experience matters?

Not rhetorical. Actually reason it out. What is it from the last 5 to 7 years that has changed so much?

The games changes but not that dramatically. We're still well within the same defensive evolution of the game post Sydney/early Hawthorn and Lyon. Ground defence, forward defence, pressure, transition are all fundamentally the same. Rule changes have opened the ground a little.

Do you remember him bagging Reimers after kicking 8 for his lack defence? Howlett and Kommer (I shudder at the thought) playing forward defensive roles? Jetta couldn't get a game.

They were still newish concepts at the time, or perhaps, they were new to football coverage.

It's not like his experience was from coaching in the 90s.
Click to expand...
I think you missed the joke.

But out of respect I'll answer your question.

The importance of recent experience can greatly differ depending on the industry and your role in it. In addition it needs to be weighed against the reasons behind the absence of recent experience, the candidate's credentials and work history combined with their suitability for the position based on talent brought to the role.

As someone who regularly has to hire people to work within my team and help others recruit within my organisation, recent experience isn't as relevant as:
  • Clear demonstration of understanding of the technical fundamentals of the role
  • An ability to apply those fundamentals to a given hypothetical on the fly and explain their response to a varied audience
  • Demonstrating an ability to work under pressure both within a team and autonomously
  • Showing they would be a good fit for the organisation

There are other factors too.

Overall recent experience may be used as a tie-breaker and while it's important that the gap in work experience isn't too long (like 10+ years without demonstration of re-training etc), it isn't a core reason not to hire an outstanding candidate, more a reason to strike weak candidates without fear of HR complaints.
 
Last edited:
Mr Mojo Risin said:
Hypothetical Question(s)

If Paul Roos came out and said he was desperate to coach again:

a) Should Essendon target him?
b) Would we make him go through the process?
c) Would his absence of 6 years in the coaches box matter?
Click to expand...
a) Yes
b) Yes
c) Yes, which justifies (b)
 
ghostdog said:
a) Yes
b) Yes
c) Yes, which justifies (b)
Click to expand...
eth-dog said:
a. Yes
b. Yes
c. Yes

And that's for a premiership coach who oversaw two extremely successful handovers.
Click to expand...

Given you've both answered the same way, if another club was in the running for his services and were not requiring him to go through a lengthy process, would you alter your approach?
 
BrunoV said:
Think about how easy it would be.

So James, what would you do in your first 30 days?

For a start I want to sit down with each players. I've also got to address the elephant in the room because the players are all old enough to have an opinion of me based on what we went through. I need them to know that, while I have standards and will not compromise on those, there is a part of the relationship that must be 2 way. I want them to know they can ask me anything about that time to satisfy themselves that there is simply no way that they would ever be placed in situation like that. I want them to know the door is always open to get feed back, so they can grow their game, bla, bla, bla, developing men bla, bla, bla.

That's 90 seconds work there.

It's Hird saying this stuff. By the end of it the panel will be pledging their undying loyalty. That's the sort of guy he is.
Click to expand...

images
 
Re James Hird, I'm too short on tinfoil to make a hat at the moment and don't buy into the conspiracy touted by a few on here about a sham process where the outcome is designed to lead to a Hird appointment. Having said that, I think we should all be prepared for the (however slim) possibility that he comes out of the process recommended by the panel and becomes the next coach.

Essentially, the question of whether it's appropriate for Hirdy to coach the club again isn't a question for the panel, it's a question for the board (whether he's learnt lessons, has a strong plan to prevent that type of thing happening again etc likely would be a panel consideration). If the rumours that he has/will interview are true, then the club/board has decided that it is open to James being coach again. That's not a question that you would consider post-interview, and I'm sure the board (although recent Barham history [Truck treatment] takes away a little of my confidence) has far too much respect for James to allow him to interview knowing full well they're not open to offering him the job.
 

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Mr Mojo Risin said:
Given you've both answered the same way, if another club was in the running for his services and were not requiring him to go through a lengthy process, would you alter your approach?
Click to expand...
Nope
 
Mr Mojo Risin said:
Given you've both answered the same way, if another club was in the running for his services and were not requiring him to go through a lengthy process, would you alter your approach?
Click to expand...
I think Roos has to do the whole process since he has been out of the coaches box for years.
 
Mr Mojo Risin said:
How much of the process would you expect him to participate in?
Click to expand...
Similar to Lyon or Pyke, both would have skipped the first phase and moved onto the second stage.
 

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Mr Mojo Risin said:
Given you've both answered the same way, if another club was in the running for his services and were not requiring him to go through a lengthy process, would you alter your approach?
Click to expand...
No
Soz, I'll elaborate; I think they should still go through the process because we need to know how well these experienced coaches philosophies on coaching and game play stack up in the modern game.

I trust someone like Jordan Lewis, given the extent of resources he has at his disposal and the football minds he has surrounded himself with working in the media, would be all over the modern game, what game plans are working, not working, looking promising etc. Some of the experienced coaches haven't coached in so many years. I would want to hear the full gamut of what they've learned and what they think and to compare and evaluate. Clarko, for instance, spent a whole lot of time watching the NBA. Even Bruno V recently commented on watching a whole lot of soccer. Okay, bring your learning and your philosophy in and lets test it through an even-handed process. For all we know, young Billy the Kidd is a freaking genius with a whiteboard while the game has gone past experienced dude, but no-one noticed.

The aim of a process, when it's run with integrity, is to find these things out. When you presume someone can do x, you run into trouble.
 
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Mr Mojo Risin said:
Even if it means losing him as a candidate?
Click to expand...
yes, I would still want him to go through the experienced route. Which supposedly means he misses step 1 of this process.

I think we're at a point where we have to have this process no matter who it is applying.


P.S. I am expecting Scott will nominate but Roos is certainly an interesting hypothetical.
 
eth-dog said:
Similar to Lyon or Pyke, both would have skipped the first phase and moved onto the second stage.
Click to expand...
Agreed. It's important to show respect for their previous achievements and experience.

Regarding the gap in experience, what about it would concern you for Roos? Would much of his well known ethos have changed fundamentally in today's game? Would how he delivers his message have changed or his ability to view vision and create an appropriate game plan for his list?

I personally don't see the gap as that relevant. If they go through the process and show they are as sharp as ever with a clear vision, it won't matter.

A pity it's a hypothetical because I think our club could really be set up well with Roos. Sadly, I'm left hoping Scott is interested or that Graham or Yze can transition successfully to senior roles.
 
I just hope the process is transparent and fair.

Each of the panel probably have a preferred candidate, so will be interesting. Problem these days, people get baffled by BS presentations etc. Anyone can say the right things & make a good case, it is up to the panel to see through the guff and get to the nitty gritty.

One thing I will say, If Hird has put his hand up and willing to go through the whole process after all he has been through then he is 200% committed. 99% of the population would have run a mile from footy in his situation.
 
Mr Mojo Risin said:
Agreed. It's important to show respect for their previous achievements and experience.

Regarding the gap in experience, what about it would concern you for Roos? Would much of his well known ethos have changed fundamentally in today's game? Would how he delivers his message have changed or his ability to view vision and create an appropriate game plan for his list?

I personally don't see the gap as that relevant. If they go through the process and show they are as sharp as ever with a clear vision, it won't matter.

A pity it's a hypothetical because I think our club could really be set up well with Roos. Sadly, I'm left hoping Scott is interested or that Graham or Yze can transition successfully to senior roles.
Click to expand...
Oh it would definitely whether or not the game has become too different from when it was in his era. However that's why you have someone like Jordan Lewis on the panel. If he can demonstrably present his vision and how it would work, it would be a hand in glove moment.

On top of that, you could give him 2 years, similar to Melbourne, and then install Jaymie Graham as heir apparent given his proclivity with what's happened at West Coast, state leagues and Freo so far.

It really is a shame, because just typing it out makes me think that this would be what we need the most.
 
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