Mega Thread The 2017 'Buckley's Chances' Thread

[jmac70]

His head was tilted down and eyes up.. clearly an issue with Buckley. Did you actually watch it? His way of deliberately trying to conceal an issue.

Utterly ridiculous.

 

[TW Sherrin]

His head was tilted down and eyes up.. clearly an issue with Buckley. Did you actually watch it? His way of deliberately trying to conceal an issue.

Was that when he said he loved bucks since the academy?

 

[PieNSauce]

I'd prefer to interpret the left over leaves in the bottom of Treloar's tea cup.

You would get way more information that way. Seriously, you do have to shake your head at some of the stuff that gets posted here. Bizarre!

 

[Saintly Viewed]

I thought I'd take a look at the premiership coaches of the last 20 years and see how they stacked up against Buckley and in particular whether I was correct in my assumption that no coach prior to winning there first premiership missed finals 4 years running.

The good news for Buckley diehards is that there was one and none other than Mick Malthouse. It does come with an asterisk attached as those 4 years only a top 5 was in play so it makes it harder to judge. In two of those 4 years his side missed out on finals by 1 game and percentage.

Below are the results I've compiled with the maximum amount of consecutive years of non finals appearances per coach bolded as well as the years they occurred. Some notes of interest on each man also included.

Luke Beveridge coach 2016 to present - 0 (won premiership 2nd year)

Alastair Clarkson coach 2005 to present - 2 - years 05-06 (pre 2008 premiership) (won premiership in 4th year)

John Longmire coach 2011 to present - 0 (never missed finals) (won premiership in 2nd year)

Chris Scott coach 2011 to present - 1 - year 15 (post 2011 premiership) (won premiership 1st year)

Mick Malthouse coach 1984 to 2015 - 4 - years 86-89 (pre 1992 premiership, all Footscray, top 5 in play) (won premiership in 9th year)

Mark Thompson coach 2000 to 2010, 2014 - 3 - years 01-03 (pre 2007 premiership) (won premiership in 8th year)

John Worsfold coach 2002 to 2013, 2016 to present - 3 - years 08-10 (post 2006 premiership) (won premiership in 5th year)

Paul Roos coach 2002 to 2010, 2014 to 2016 - 3 - years 14-16 (post 2005 premiership, all Melbourne) (won premiership in 4th year)

Mark Williams coach 1999 to 2010 - 3 - years 08-10 (post 2004 premiership) (won premiership in 6th year)

Leigh Matthews coach 1986 to 1995, 1999 to 2008 - 4 - years 05-08 (post 2003 4th premiership) (won premiership in 5th year)

Kevin Sheedy coach 1981 to 2007, 2012 to 2013 - 5 - years 05-07, 12-13 (post 2000 4th premiership, includes 2 years at GWS) (won premiership in 4th year)

Denis Pagan coach 1993 to 2002, 2003 to 2007 - 5 - years 03-07 (post 1999 2nd premiership, all Carlton) (won premiership in 4th year)

Malcolm Blight coach 1989 to 1994, 1997 to 1999, 2001 - 2 - years 99, 01 (post 1998 2nd premiership, includes 15 games at St.kilda) (won premiership in *7th year *not including playing coach in 81)

David Parkin coach 1977 to 1980, 1981 to 1985, 1986 to 1988, 1991 to 2000 - 4 - years 87-88, 91-92 (post 1982 3rd premiership, 3 years at Fitzroy, top 6 in play 92) (won premiership in 2nd year)

Fascinating list.
Like many stats they are an indicator not a definer.

Not to be pedantic, Nathan has coached two finals campaigns (acquired a finals team; as did Chris Scott) and has thus far only missed three finals series (this year would be the fourth, not looking that great so far).

I love exploring the records of flag winning coaches. They are telling.
But one thing I've always noticed, is a few telling signs.

All these coaches look in charge, have authority and obviously have strong football knowledge.

One other thing they all have, is a quality team, often laden with lots of top level talent.
That surely can't be a coincidence.

The premiership coaches that do it multiple times (era sides) tend to have stars and more stars. Not every star is always available but they overall they are there.

But that is just "coincidence."

Clarkson: Franklin, Hodge, Mitchell S, Roughead, Rioli, Burgoyne, Crawford (one flag), Lake etc

Thompson: Ablett, Bartel, Johnson, Scarlett, Kelly, etc

Matthews: Voss, Black, Ackermanis, Brown, Lynch, Leppitsch etc

Jeans: Matthews, Brereton, Platten, Dunstall, Tuck, Buckenara, Jarman, Langford (amazing they didn't win more flags) NB: Joyce also had this list pretty much sans Matthews

Sheedy: Madden, Watson, Daniher, Baker, Weston, etc then had Hird, Lloyd, Mecuri, Misiti, Long etc

In conclusion there is more to coaching than meets the eye.
Nathan may never reach the ultimate success, only one in 18 succeed each year, but it is amazing how the key factor in success (the players, hello, the players!) is sometimes not as well regarded as who is who in the FD or who is who in admin etc. or even who is being the medical guru. Important but the players go and do the business.

 

[BringouttheGimp]

You would get way more information that way. Seriously, you do have to shake your head at some of the stuff that gets posted here. Bizarre!

Why is it so bizarre reading someone's body language.. mate did you see how he answered the question about Buckley.. hardly convincing.

 

[PieNSauce]

See the way I see it is Nathan has finally got the puzzle that he wanted coming together, yes I know it was a dam good side that he took over but that's a different conversation.
He has build this side and I think the amount of young talent is there but lacks the experience right now to compete consistently, so Buckley should get first crack at turning his list into something special, I believe he will be coaching us into next year and that's when the pressure should come if results are lacking.
I personally am happy for him to remain as long as we are improving as 2017 unfolds, the first 2 rounds haven't been as bad as the media are making out.
Just a little frustrating for us supporters.

My only problem with all of that is that we've been saying it for a couple of years now. I have high expectations that we must improve this year and that almost certainly involves playing finals. I have always been in the Buckley camp and as of this moment I still am. That said, if we go backwards this season I will most likely be joining those who wish to shake his hand and say farewell and thanks.

 

[PieNSauce]

Why is it so bizarre reading someone's body language.. mate did you see how he answered the question about Buckley.. hardly convincing.

It's not. It's nearly as worthwhile as reading their tea leaves.

 

[doodles98]

Anyone get a good look at Treloar's body language and maneurisms when asked about Buckley last night on 360? Clearly there are issues there.

Gimpy.. are you at it again? You are aren't you. Look at moi Gimpy look at moi.

 

[doodles98]

His head was tilted down and eyes up.. clearly an issue with Buckley. Did you actually watch it? His way of deliberately trying to conceal an issue.

Gimpy gold right there. Its so special it deserves to be framed and hung on the wall at your IGA.

 

[Countrypie]

Fascinating list.
Like many stats they are an indicator not a definer.

Not to be pedantic, Nathan has coached two finals campaigns (acquired a finals team; as did Chris Scott) and has thus far only missed three finals series (this year would be the fourth, not looking that great so far).

I love exploring the records of flag winning coaches. They are telling.
But one thing I've always noticed, is a few telling signs.

All these coaches look in charge, have authority and obviously have strong football knowledge.

One other thing they all have, is a quality team, often laden with lots of top level talent.
That surely can't be a coincidence.

The premiership coaches that do it multiple times (era sides) tend to have stars and more stars. Not every star is always available but they overall they are there.

But that is just "coincidence."

Clarkson: Franklin, Hodge, Mitchell S, Roughead, Rioli, Burgoyne, Crawford (one flag), Lake etc

Thompson: Ablett, Bartel, Johnson, Scarlett, Kelly, etc

Matthews: Voss, Black, Ackermanis, Brown, Lynch, Leppitsch etc

Jeans: Matthews, Brereton, Platten, Dunstall, Tuck, Buckenara, Jarman, Langford (amazing they didn't win more flags) NB: Joyce also had this list pretty much sans Matthews

Sheedy: Madden, Watson, Daniher, Baker, Weston, etc then had Hird, Lloyd, Mecuri, Misiti, Long etc

In conclusion there is more to coaching than meets the eye.
Nathan may never reach the ultimate success, only one in 18 succeed each year, but it is amazing how the key factor in success (the players, hello, the players!) is sometimes not as well regarded as who is who in the FD or who is who in admin etc. or even who is being the medical guru. Important but the players go and do the business.

TO add to that I stumbled over a great interview with David Mckay (perhaps my favourite ever Carlton player - which isn't saying much I know)who said that those Carlton sides of late 70's and 80's "coached themselves" and that Parkin had little influence. It's a long interview but worth watching. There's a classic line in it somewhere wwhere Parkin rang him up before a final and McKay told him "Parko..it's just a game" 9.35

 

[BringouttheGimp]

Gimpy gold right there. Its so special it deserves to be framed and hung on the wall at your IGA.

I'd like it hung at the IGA in Thomo.. they wouldn't have the slightest clue what it means. They're all bright sparks down that way.

 

[Buckley is my hero]

My only problem with all of that is that we've been saying it for a couple of years now. I have high expectations that we must improve this year and that almost certainly involves playing finals. I have always been in the Buckley camp and as of this moment I still am. That said, if we go backwards this season I will most likely be joining those who wish to shake his hand and say farewell and thanks.

Can't disagree with these comments except to say that we could improve, picking up an extra couple of wins over last year, without making finals. What happens if we pick up eleven wins this season, but aren't good enough to get into the final eight. Does the coach walk or stay?

 

[jmac70]

Gimpy gold right there. Its so special it deserves to be framed and hung on the wall at your IGA.

Don't encourage the fool.

 

[Countrypie]

Can't disagree with these comments except to say that we could improve, picking up an extra couple of wins over last year, without making finals. What happens if we pick up eleven wins this season, but aren't good enough to get into the final eight. Does the coach walk or stay?

I think the ball will be placed in his court. I think he'd walk but ...who knows?

 

[PieNSauce]

Can't disagree with these comments except to say that we could improve, picking up an extra couple of wins over last year, without making finals. What happens if we pick up eleven wins this season, but aren't good enough to get into the final eight. Does the coach walk or stay?

I'm not making a call on the specifics right now which is why I said "almost certainly". For me, the improvement must be clear and for what it's worth, despite results, I certainly see signs. We just need to start converting the huge opportunities we keep generating and I'm sure that improvement will come.

 

[The Plowking]

I think he'd walk but ...who knows?

Same.

 

[Countrypie]

I'm not making a call on the specifics right now which is why I said "almost certainly". For me, the improvement must be clear and for what it's worth, despite results, I certainly see signs. We just need to start converting the huge opportunities we keep generating and I'm sure that improvement will come.

Agree. The media sharks are circling but that's no reason to throw the toys out of the cot. They never give us credit when we're doing well. They stick the boots in when we're not. A paid mark here, an opportunity taken there and we could be 2 -0. We're not. Let the season play out then make the decisions required.

 

[ThePhantom777]

We were 4th youngest side in round 2...surely we can only go up from here! As mentioned above. A few straight kicks for goal, some momentum and we are 2-0. I reckon we're close to turning the corner. Grundy has been an absolute beast.

 

[PhiloBeddoe]

Why is it so bizarre reading someone's body language.. mate did you see how he answered the question about Buckley.. hardly convincing.

I remember a supposed body language expert saying that the left foot pointing towards you meant that the female was interested in you.
I was at a party sitting near an absolute glamour. I started talking to her and noticed that her left foot was pointing towards me. The only thing was, she had a feet like Fred Flinstone. I stopped talking to her. ****ing experts give me the shits.

 

[nahnah]

We were 4th youngest side in round 2...surely we can only go up from here! As mentioned above. A few straight kicks for goal, some momentum and we are 2-0. I reckon we're close to turning the corner. Grundy has been an absolute beast.

We've been a young team for 12 years

 

[BringouttheGimp]

I remember a supposed body language expert saying that the left foot pointing towards you meant that the female was interested in you.
I was at a party sitting near an absolute glamour. I started talking to her and noticed that her left foot was pointing towards me. The only thing was, she had a feet like Fred Flinstone. I stopped talking to her. ******* experts give me the shits.

Come out with me.. i meet at the very least 3 girls a night.

 

[PhiloBeddoe]

Come out with me.. i meet at the very least 3 girls a night.

No thanks, re, I don't really want to go to Kinisi. Haha!
Nah, this was a long time ago. Married for quite a few years.

 

[Vicky Park]

His head was tilted down and eyes up.. clearly an issue with Buckley. Did you actually watch it? His way of deliberately trying to conceal an issue.

Gimpy, I didnt watch it, so I post from a position of ignorance. I concede that.

But maybe Treloar, a young man in the spotlight, was embarrassed at being asked about his senior coach, from a known Bucks hater. A very umcomfortable position to be put in! He doesn't live under a rock, and he would be fully aware of the football politics swirling about him. Difficult.

 

[BringouttheGimp]

Gimpy, I didnt watch it, so I post from a position of ignorance. I concede that.

But maybe Treloar, a young man in the spotlight, was embarrassed at being asked about his senior coach, from a known Bucks hater. A very umcomfortable position to be put in! He doesn't live under a rock, and he would be fully aware of the football politics swirling about him. Difficult.

50/50 I'd say. I get where you're coming from.. not sure there are replays on the internet of 360 for you to have a look at and form an opinion.

 

[BringouttheGimp]

No thanks, re, I don't really want to go to Kinisi. Haha!
Nah, this was a long time ago. Married for quite a few years.

Congratulations!

In this day an age where we are empowered to do as we please.. you've done remarkably well.

The problem these days is that education centres on travelling.. career advancement.. gym.. lavish restaraunts.. excessive dating.. I'm caught up in it as well.. as good a time as i have had.. there's a lot of me that misses the old dirt roads and kicking the footy around as a kid with my cousins every 2nd day whilst the oldies sat on the porch talking shit.

Bring back old family values..