Preview Round 18 - West Coast v Brisbane Lions

[POBT]

Sorry Kezz, I hope POBT can edit this.

Sorted.

 

[Whabbaghetti]

I feel that Brown has gotten to the stage that like Black, he gets a say in whether or not he plays. I do not see Brown wanting a rest, nor do I think he needs one. I think there is more of a problem of people having too high expectations. He is playing in a position where many players are unreliable, regardless of age and experience. Despite not being high up the list for average goals per game, we have had a reasonably good spread of goal kickers, despite at time having terrible supply to the forward 50.

It might be time to release the Moose. I think that the revolving doors of the forward line should continue with Lisle in for Ace. I think Ace was saved last weekend by the club generally preferring against dropping players after one game, as well as his form against GC at home. Lisle will provide extra cover in the ruck to help out Huddo and Merrett on the vast expanses of Subiaco.

I don't think McKeever has been good enough to come into the side, nor do I think he needs to. We have enough tall timber down back with Maguire, Patfull, Lester with Drummond and occasionally Merrett lending a hand.

Crisp, I feel, has not been quite living up to his name in recent games. I think he Beams would provide excellent cover for him. Like Round 1 should be given a run with role and be put to Shuey, with Raines on Kerr. I, like many really would like to see Docherty come into the side. If anyone is dropped, it will probably be Polec, however I am certainly not counting on it, being only one game back into the side.

 

[lionbear]

This game will be interesting, I think we will know Sunday night if we have put the Que in the rack or not, I can't see us winning, but if we get pumped then it could be a long last month for us, solid performance and I think we could win another 2 or 3 games this season and really set up 2013.

I honestly think we could play finals in 2013, how we go on Sunday could really tell us how far we truly are from achieving this.

 

[Haso]

Looking at Burton's injury report video for this week, the feeling is that he is pretty sure that Rocky will be travelling, but he didn't seem quite as sure about Drummo. Given the lack of surety and Drummo junior waiting in the wings, I'm thinking that maybe we will see a rest and a debutant this week. Maybe.

 

[patfullfankezz]

Sorted.

Happiness is

 

[Whabbaghetti]

I forgot about Drummond. Docherty for Drummo is looking increasingly likely.

 

[charles202]

I am very worreid that this could be a blow out, if we finished losing by under thirty point i wouldn't be THAT disapointed (still disapointed after any loss).

In the last five weeks there are four very winnable games, we need to use to use the end of this season as a springboard into next year.

 

[karix]

It might be time to release the Moose. I think that the revolving doors of the forward line should continue with Lisle in for Ace. I think Ace was saved last weekend by the club generally preferring against dropping players after one game, as well as his form against GC at home. Lisle will provide extra cover in the ruck to help out Huddo and Merrett on the vast expanses of Subiaco.

I don't think McKeever has been good enough to come into the side, nor do I think he needs to. We have enough tall timber down back with Maguire, Patfull, Lester with Drummond and occasionally Merrett lending a hand.

I don't understand the hate on Ace's game last week, got himself into the right places, set up two goals, kicked one of his own, had a 3 effort contest with multiple opposition players that resulted in us getting possession and a goal. IMO there was basically a 5% difference between the game he had, which was descent but by no means amazing, and to a break out game where he clunks his contested marks, boots 4 goals and could've carried us to a much easier victory. Surely you don't dump a player who is only 5% off a break out game?

I think Lisle, Merrett and Huddo is too many talls. Unless maybe you rest Browny and put Merrett in defence? Because Lisle has been playing in the forward line in the ressies (with Ace, so maybe they'd work well together in the forward line?)

I'm not too sure on the in's and outs this week due to tiredness/injuries but I suspect players with questionable fitness will be out, and fitter players will come in.

So probably...
OUT: Drummond(inj), Polec, Crisp
IN: Beams, McKeever, Stiller?/Docherty?

 

[POBT]

Happiness is

You read the edit?

 

[Elixuh]

...but he didn't seem quite as sure about Drummo. Given the lack of surety and Drummo junior waiting in the wings, I'm thinking that maybe we will see a rest and a debutant this week. Maybe.

My thoughts as well. If he is 'sore' then I would see Drummo rested given the 6 day turn around, WA travel and Patersons stadium trio.

 

[patfullfankezz]

You read the edit?

Of course I did.

I would have been disappointed if you hadn't reacted

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

I don't understand the hate on Ace's game last week, got himself into the right places, set up two goals, kicked one of his own, had a 3 effort contest with multiple opposition players that resulted in us getting possession and a goal. IMO there was basically a 5% difference between the game he had, which was descent but by no means amazing, and to a break out game where he clunks his contested marks, boots 4 goals and could've carried us to a much easier victory. Surely you don't dump a player who is only 5% off a break out game?

I think Lisle, Merrett and Huddo is too many talls. Unless maybe you rest Browny and put Merrett in defence? Because Lisle has been playing in the forward line in the ressies (with Ace, so maybe they'd work well together in the forward line?)

I'm not too sure on the in's and outs this week due to tiredness/injuries but I suspect players with questionable fitness will be out, and fitter players will come in.

So probably...
OUT: Drummond(inj), Polec, Crisp
IN: Beams, McKeever, Stiller?/Docherty?

Agree with you about Ace. High time he was given an extended run at it. Must be very unsettling, particularly for a tall, to come in for one or two and then go back to a very different standard where you dominate and don't necessarily get to practice the things that count. And a quick comparison of his stats with Browny's from last week will show he had some pretty good company - almost identical in fact.

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

I think Polec, Crisp, Acorn and Bewick will be omitted. In Docherty, Beams, Lisle and Bartlett.

We lose too much pace there me thinks, for the longest ground in the league. Polec out because he looks slower than my auntie, but not Bewick and Crisp. What about Green back in?

 

[Ironmonger]

I remember one goal that Acorn set up with a kick that looked suspiciously like a shank that happened to fall into a teammate's arms. What was the other goal he set up?

His major weapon, his only weapon really, is his marking, and last week he was dropping them all over the place, and didn't have any presence when the ball was on the deck. Didn't make a tackle all game.

Let's also bear in mind that this was off the back of another bad game against the Saints. He needed a good performance to justify his spot as the third tall forward. I reckon we look better with a more mobile third option.

I've been a bit confused by his treatment at times in the past, but he should be dropped this week for Karnezis.

McKeever might be a chance to come in this week after his strong performance on Darling last time we played the Eagles.

 

[Whabbaghetti]

I don't understand the hate on Ace's game last week, got himself into the right places, set up two goals, kicked one of his own, had a 3 effort contest with multiple opposition players that resulted in us getting possession and a goal. IMO there was basically a 5% difference between the game he had, which was descent but by no means amazing, and to a break out game where he clunks his contested marks, boots 4 goals and could've carried us to a much easier victory. Surely you don't dump a player who is only 5% off a break out game?

I think Lisle, Merrett and Huddo is too many talls. Unless maybe you rest Browny and put Merrett in defence? Because Lisle has been playing in the forward line in the ressies (with Ace, so maybe they'd work well together in the forward line?)

I agree that Ace was hardly terrible on Saturday night, in fact he probably played a better game then Brownie. I did feel that he wasn't as effective as he could've been. Ace was given an extended run earlier in the season and while he played some good games, he did drop off and have some poor performances. I suggested it as someone would have to make way in the forward line if Lisle was to come in, and I feel that on average, Ace has been probably the bottom ranked of Brown and Merrett. If Lisle was to come in this round, he could be given an extended run in the seniors. We won't know if Lisle is better in the seniors then Ace or Karnezis unless he gets a go. He also can offer something neither Ace or Karnezis really provide, and that is being able to go into the ruck. If it turns out it works, it gives us the flexibility for Merrett to potentially go back and free up another spot in the forwards for someone else.

If Ace was replaced by Lisle, Beams for Crisp and Docherty for Drummond we would have the same amount of talls as we had against GC. Whilst I wouldn't argue that it worked on Saturday night, West Coast have more tall players then Gold Coast who were missing a number of their key talls.

 

[Jorgo]

I would argue Ace has shown a increased engine this year by popping up further up the field from time to time and also shown laser accurate field kicking to set up team mates on occasion. His goal kicking is also very reliable.

To say he only has one weapon in marking is doing him an injustice IMO.

 

[Bucking Beads]

I'm probably biased but I think Ace will be a star. Give him a fair go please Vossy

 

[Ceebee]

So who is our new player Fatpull ,hope he is good .

 

[patfullfankezz]

So who is our new player Fatpull ,hope he is good .

Yeah, you don't want to know what runs through my head when I read that...

 

[dlanod]

I remember one goal that Acorn set up with a kick that looked suspiciously like a shank that happened to fall into a teammate's arms. What was the other goal he set up?

He set up Bewick's sealer with a long handpass for him to run on to.

 

[MSB ROYS]

Not too optimistic about this game really...

 

[luthor]

He set up Bewick's sealer with a long handpass for him to run on to.

Correct

On any objective assessment, Cornelius had a superior game to Brown by quite a margin.

Ok, Acorn didn't set the world on fire with his hands (in the marking sense) but he didn't drop numerous chest marks, fall over at crucial times or fluff his field kicking

Browny is a champion but that's no reason for him (or anyone else for that matter) to be immune from criticism when he has a poor match.

 

[Baby_Jenks]

I'm unabashed fan of Cornelius and think that he should be played every week from here on in. I get the impression from the coaching staff that they're yet to make up their mind on him (much like majority on here) and an extended run of games should hopefully close the argument one way or the other. The conditions and space at Subiaco should suit him to a T. It's fair to say that his strength over the stretch has been his sticky hands and that was one of the more disappointing things about his game which suggests to me that his confidence is down.
It has been mentioned that he didn't lay a tackle last weekend, neither did Lester who was playing in the midfield (not for the first time either) and yet there's far less cries for him to be dropped.
I would even suggest that Lester gets rested this week. It's been a long season for a second year player coming off a low fitness base. Pattersons is a huge ground and it might be a bit beyond him especially on tired legs.

On a somewhat related note, an interesting comparison that a Richmond fan made to me during the week was that Cornelius is a poor mans J.Riewoldt. Yes, no, maybe?

 

[PattyKwasagun]

I would even suggest that Lester gets rested this week. It's been a long season for a second year player coming off a low fitness base. Pattersons is a huge ground and it might be a bit beyond him especially on tired legs.

On a somewhat related note, an interesting comparison that a Richmond fan made to me during the week was that Cornelius is a poor mans J.Riewoldt. Yes, no, maybe?

I agree that Lester may be running near empty at the moment, but he's only just come back into the team after a rest, and it seems pretty clear that he's now regarded as a fairly established part of the best 22 - probably on par with Golby (when fit, of course). It's an interesting point that hasn't been made really, but Golby, Lester, Harwood and Zorko are the four who seem to have edged their way into our best 22 who weren't there at the start of the year. Always interesting to see who has seemingly cemented a spot in the line up compared to who was expected to at the start of the season.

On topic, though, I can't see Lester being rested. I went a bit over the top with my predicted changes (Lisle, Beams, Docherty and McKeever), although I do think at least two of them would get a run. It would be very, very stiff on Beams if he misses out again, but I'll try not to vent my frustration in the way I did last week if that happens. Starting to think McKeever is a definite in though, and at least one of Cornelius, Karnezis and Lisle will play. At the moment I'm probably leaning towards Cornelius retaining his spot, probably just as the coaches want to give him every chance to prove himself before season ends and list management decisions must be made. It really could be any of those three though.

 

[Ironmonger]

Correct

On any objective assessment, Cornelius had a superior game to Brown by quite a margin.

Ok, Acorn didn't set the world on fire with his hands (in the marking sense) but he didn't drop numerous chest marks, fall over at crucial times or fluff his field kicking

Browny is a champion but that's no reason for him (or anyone else for that matter) to be immune from criticism when he has a poor match.

No, but it is a reason to think he might have a better match next time. Don't see any reason to say the same about Acorn.'

He was awful. Brown was equally awful, but at least Brown had a decent defender on him. Cornelius should be dropped.