Coach Michael Voss

[BM123]

Our skills haven't recently been this poor. The crowded forward line created by slow ball delivery magnifies the need to be highly skilled receivers.
Good sides will concede goals through unavoidable errors and simply being beaten at a contest, but their willingness to attack abates this.

Willingness to attack is easy to find but the better sides are motivated to defend too. Even with a defensive game plan we look fragile defensively. Tackling is poor, players slipping over, big name players jogging as their opponent runs off them etc

Yet to see another clubs playing group get chewed out as much as ours do for lax defensive efforts by former players commentaing on our game.

 

[bmaurizio]

Not blaming Vossy totally, there are a complexity of issues underlying poor team performance, he's our head coach and would have know the risk that comes with under performance, the post is inextricably tied to wining. Supporters have endure much for the past few decades, unfortunately for any new coach the pressure is huge.
Friday nights game is so very important, we should bring home the 4 points, Fingers crossed , hope Vossy helps get us there too, Go Blues

 

[Just Kreuzing]

Our endevour & work rate are fine Vossy has us firing well, our problems are skill , speed, and a lumbering, intractable game plan.

Only need to improve on 3 areas....

1- When we have the ball
2- When they have the ball
3- When its in dispute

 

[The Blue Weirdo]

Willingness to attack is easy to find but the better sides are motivated to defend too. Even with a defensive game plan we look fragile defensively. Tackling is poor, players slipping over, big name players jogging as their opponent runs off them etc

Yet to see another clubs playing group get chewed out as much as ours do for lax defensive efforts by former players commentaing on our game.

What I find disturbing is our backline was pretty good until about 3 weeks ago.
But are they succumbing to repeated midfield defensive inability, due to constantly selecting collectively slow mids in an increasingly quicker AFL world?
Current selection integrity must be wheighing heavy on morale...they are all team mates after all.

 

[Sonny Jim]

Richmond fans want coach Damien Hardwick sacked after embarrassing loss

A snap poll of Richmond fans want coach Damien Hardwick sacked after the weekend’s embarrassing loss to GWS. The Tigers kicked just three goals in Saturday’s 88 point loss to the Giants, their lowest score since 1961. The result has club legends seething. Kevin Bartlett labelled the first half...

www.3aw.com.au

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/teams/richmond/richmond-coach-damien-hardwick-admits-he-could-have-been-sacked-last-year/news-story/fea211cae16a5ecbfdf335f4eed49a41

Ehhhhh fans and old guard wanted him gone in 2016.

I believe he started 0-9 with a percentage of 49% as well with Richmond.

I remember this, won myself 2 bertcocchi hams on KBs show on SEN because of this!
10/10 would bertcocchi again.

 

[Sonny Jim]

I

2013 15 wins, 2014 12 wins, 2015 15 wins, 2016 8 wins 2017 18 wins & a flag!
Completely different situation to us! U can understand why they were calling for him & why the club “stuck fat”.
We are currently going backwards!!!
When was the last time u can remember that the playing group was performing this badly & the game style so bad?

The club just has to work its way through it.

Deal with it.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

I just want the players to play for the Monogram, to realise that they are only here because of the work of others, that the blood sweat and tears of thousands of Carlton players and millions of fans reside in that monogram. If they represent it well, they will be remembered in history. If they do not, no one will remember their name.

 

[Jeremias]

Haha no way come on they're wrong. Jeez to make those 3-4 awful errors two weeks in a row, it was a choke. Nothing more nothing less.

I agree, had nothing to do with coaching.

Just as a number of skill and application errors each week have nothing to do with Voss or his game plan.

Which is exactly why it’s crazy to single him out as the problem.

 

[TheNudist]

I want Vossy to move the magnets around and adjust the game plan to reinvigorate the team. We have the cattle for him to do it. He needs to get creative and build off of the fundamentals that he’s hopefully instilled in the team so far. TDK as second ruck and resting forward. Silvagni in the backline. Saad on a wing.

 

[Jeremias]

So what you’re saying is there is no correlation between game plan & how the players perform, ok then.

No, never said that. What a strange and very long bow to draw.

Funny how none of u have touched on the game plan issue but u all to a man believe Voss needs more “support” why exactly does he require “support” if what he’s doing is tactically sound & improving the players?

None have touched on the game plan issue? That's not true at all.

Most accept there are issues with it, they just acknowledge it's likely not the only reason we are where we are.

 

[lukep_86]

Did you watch the game on Sunday mate? We had twelve players with zero tackles at half time.... not sure how that constitutes fine endeavour and work rate...

Saad didn't even lay one for the whole game...

And I'd like to see your reasoning behind blaming Vossy for that one...

Agreed, he can't lay tackles for the boys. Although sometimes I wish he could because at least then we'd know they'd stick.

Can't blame Voss for us missing easy goals either, who knows what the results could have been if our boys nailed most or even some of the goals they missed.

 

[macky99]

We played Russian roulette last year. It didn't get the job done and even bottom sides managed to shave off huge leads off us. Would've made finals if we didn't choke but it happens. Players haven't learnt how to deal with opposition gaining momentum yet. Plus it's a bigger risk when even your best goal kickers are suspect under pressure.

I find it difficult to believe that we always forgive the players for been poor defensively as a group. Anytime a coach tries to add a defensive edge to the team we complain. Other clubs live by it and it's part of their culture. We on the other hand support the club that has it's captain of all people targeted as the go to guy to play off.

"Just let them play!" Cliche has gotten old.

No problem having a defensive edge which is required, but analyse the successful teams Geelong last year & Collingwood and Melbourne all teams with the ability to score heavily.

The balance is totally wrong and we are going no where unless the coaching team enable the group the play with more freedom & having a better balance as everyone has mentioned slow build up then long bomb to Harry or Charlie, so predictable teams are just rebounding so quickly because of this poor game plan.

We were not getting beaten like we are recently ridiculous comparison.

 

[Kreuuuzeurns]

I agree, had nothing to do with coaching.

Just as a number of skill and application errors each week have nothing to do with Voss or his game plan.

Which is exactly why it’s crazy to single him out as the problem.

You don't think being so focused on Charlie and Harry has an impact on the way we move the ball and decision making?

We don't lower the eyes near enough, and when under pressure at the clearance we resort to bombing it long in the hopes one of them can mark the ball or at least halve the contest.

We have lost the ability to forward handball and create an outnumber which was a big reason for our success in the first 10 rounds last season. When we kick short and low in the forward half of the ground we actually look very good. I love the ways Owies in particular has been presenting at the ball and it flows when his type of lead is rewarded. A lot of kicks go aimlessly straight over his head. Both of these things go hand in hand. Finding uncontested ball at the contest and the ability to make the right decision with the ball, and to execute.

For me a lot of this is because of shifts in game plan as a direct response to the ways in which we lost games last year. We take less risks with the ball and set up to play the game away from the corridor to minimise counter attacks. Good in theory but we have gone too far the other way, we can barely find ourselves in a winning position and when we do have chances to kick away we aren't putting the foot down.

 

[jackn]

Correct … I’m starting to understand now why the playing group didn’t get along with Stocker … he was the George Constanza of the playing group … disgraceful that a player with the qualities that we so desperately lack was let go …

Coach involved in that decision?

 

[HereComesJuddy]

Interesting reading the number of posters here who are suddenly laying the blame on our players.

Where were you all two years ago when the howling for Teague's blood began and the players were lauded for mutineering against their coach?

This list is far better than Teague's, is unhindered by Covid sanctions and has a fully functional development team. It has six current and former AA's, two Coleman medalists, the Brownlow medalist and is finally at the age profile that we've been seeking for the last eight years. I'd go so far as to say it is the best balanced list we've had for twenty five years and yet....eight and a half wins in the last twenty two matches.

If it was all the coach's fault two years ago why is it the fault of the players now?

I've said that I don't want to sack the coach, as I said two years ago, I'm sick of that sh*t. But in finally deciding to stick fat with a coach, have we picked the right one?

Interesting times ahead.

Imo Teague wasn't a great coach and it was time to move on from him. In saying that, I don't think we have a great list and I certainly don't think our leadership group is up to it.

As for Voss... he can coach imo. But needs quality by his side in the coaches box. I strongly believe a united coaching group and quality tactical nouse would make our team better than what we are. Currently our coaching group doesn't fill me with excitement.

 

[Sonny Jim]

Ok, so.
Everyone agrees we need to change our style of play.
And most agree that whether Voss is a good coach or not that the team ethos/strategy is capable of change.

So, how do people believe we should play for the remainder of the year?
If finals really is a bust, what strategy do we employ and train from here on out?

 

[Jeremias]

You don't think being so focused on Charlie and Harry has an impact on the way we move the ball and decision making?

Sure it can, but a reliance on those two isn't the only reason we do what we do. We don't just make mistakes when looking for them.

We don't lower the eyes near enough, and when under pressure at the clearance we resort to bombing it long in the hopes one of them can mark the ball or at least halve the contest.

This is an issue with composure rather than coaching. I'd argue our on-field leaders are often more at fault for this than the coaching staff.

We have lost the ability to forward handball and create an outnumber which was a big reason for our success in the first 10 rounds last season. When we kick short and low in the forward half of the ground we actually look very good. I love the ways Owies in particular has been presenting at the ball and it flows when his type of lead is rewarded. A lot of kicks go aimlessly straight over his head. Both of these things go hand in hand. Finding uncontested ball at the contest and the ability to make the right decision with the ball, and to execute.

Yes, coaching issue.

For me a lot of this is because of shifts in game plan as a direct response to the ways in which we lost games last year. We take less risks with the ball and set up to play the game away from the corridor to minimise counter attacks. Good in theory but we have gone too far the other way, we can barely find ourselves in a winning position and when we do have chances to kick away we aren't putting the foot down.

Agreed, there are overarching issues with the way we are playing that can be traced back to coaching, but individual skill errors are largely on the players themselves.

 

[SurreyBlue]

Voss needs to make some big statements with selections this week. Not the kids but McGovern, Saad, Weitering, and Cripps should all be in the firing line. Let’s see how he plays this. The ball is well and truly in his court.

 

[HarryFlashman]

No, never said that. What a strange and very long bow to draw.



None have touched on the game plan issue? That's not true at all.

Most accept there are issues with it, they just acknowledge it's likely not the only reason we are where we are.

So when u draw a long bow
“The players would love you - seemingly absolving them of all responsibility.”
It’s fine, but I use the same argument back & it’s a stretch. Ok, that makes heaps of sense.
If u can’t see the game plan is flawed & that is a major contributor to poor player performance there’s not much more to say to you.
That’s not absolving anyone, that’s working on finding a root cause.
You don’t find it curious to why most players have dropped off so drastically instead of just saying it’s just there fault?

 

[Jeremias]

So when u draw a long bow
“The players would love you - seemingly absolving them of all responsibility.”
It’s fine, but I use the same argument back & it’s a stretch. Ok, that makes heaps of sense.

It's not the same argument though.

So yes, laying the blame on the coach is almost by definition suggesting the players are not at fault, whilst I'm still not sure I said anywhere that there's no correlation between game plan and performance, just that they can be separated.

If u can’t see the game plan is flawed & that is a major contributor to poor player performance there’s not much more to say to you.

I don't think I ever said that. In fact I'm certain I haven't. Of course game plan is a factor but it is not the only factor, and it's largely irrelevant when discussing the instances I highlighted (which you have still ignored).

You don’t find it curious to why most players have dropped off so drastically instead of just saying it’s just there fault?

Never said it's solely on the players. I find it curious but I also think the reasons are somewhat clear.

 

[Gointocarlton]

I can't be the only one who after 10 mins can tell if we're switched on or not. Unfortunately I've played this game for years regardless of the coach. There is something about mental strength that alot of our players don't have.

POOR ON FIELD LEADERSHIP, EOS.
In the first qtr in Sun, they kicked their 2nd, 3rd and 4th goals (3 in a row) without a Carlton player laying a glove on the footy. Not one single possession from us, game was essentially over. Last week it was one of our goal less qtrs that did the damage.
Where are our leaders calling in some blokes into a quick huddle and reading them a quick riot act?
I remember reading a story about Hodge. He was notorious for calling the guys together at the centre bounce after a team got on a run of goals, looking them in the eye one by one and saying to them something along the lines of:
We win the next contest not matter what, is that clear?
And more often than not, his demands were met. We don't appear (looking in from afar at least) to have a leader to do a "Hodgey" on the players when needed.

 

[BM123]

Voss needs to make some big statements with selections this week. Not the kids but McGovern, Saad, Weitering, and Cripps should all be in the firing line. Let’s see how he plays this. The ball is well and truly in his court.

Milne, Dal Santo dropped

STARS Nick Dal Santo and Stephen Milne have become high-profile casualties of the Saints' struggles, being dropped for Friday's match.

www.perthnow.com.au

Dropping duo gave Saints integrity: Lyon

St Kilda coach says results vindicated the one-week demotion of Dal Santo and Milne

www.afl.com.au

I don't know how I'd feel if Mcgovern isn't dropped to be honest. After his first squib that ended up with Collingwood scoring their first goal I knew we were in for a rough day.

 

[katmanblue]

Porque no los dos

The playing group have been through how many coaches now? The coach has changed, the players haven't, nor have the results.

On SM-F926B using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Blue1980]

Anyone wanting to sack Voss should watch Dimmas press conference. Stick fat and support each other in dark times. We bring the knife out after 10 games lol

Either vossy admits the game plan is a dud and changes or he will be gone at seasons end.

The game style isn’t working and won’t work.

 

[Blue1980]

Kick ass game plan, player development, improvement, finals & 3 flags does help the argument to “stick fat”

Also people talk about 2016 at Richmond, they’d made finals 2013-15, had 15 home and away wins twice. We haven’t won 15 or more home and away wins since 2000.