Trade Alert:
Geelong West Sparrows trade pick 14
Tenderwarriors trade tuttys future second round selection
tenderwarrior
Geelong West Sparrows trade pick 14
Tenderwarriors trade tuttys future second round selection
tenderwarrior
Keeper Lg. Extra letters... 2018 List Management thread
- Thread starter Rockford
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Agreed
agreed
- Thread starter
- #154
A bit caught between two minds with trading. I traded out Hanners thinking he hadn't contributed in the GF (being injured) so I didn't need him and that I could add a future premium with pick 6. After speaking to a couple managers I thought I should probably be focusing a little more on the current season and had been chasing a replacement inside mid. Cotchin is a year older than Hannebery but boasts comparable stats. Adding Prestia as depth is handy in the event of injuries over the season. Tomlinson, I don't consider a "downgrade" exactly so it works for me: Sutcliffe boasts better stats but with Freo *now* deciding to play youth he played a little over half of the games last season. Tomlinson, since finding a role as a KPB has played every game. It's fairly insignificant but if things ever get that dire I'd rather have a guy I know is going to get games than a 50/50 chance to bank Sutcliffe's better stats.
While it's no Goddard, Shuey, Kennedy, Boyd, McVeigh, Westhoff, Lewis and Pick 19 for Sheed, Pick 13 and some other players I'm hopeful that adding Cotchin to my best 22 keeps me in touch with Drew, TW and richcogs for this coming season. If there's any managers out there that want to make deeman an improved offer on the Cotchin, Prestia and Tomlinson package please do. If he'd prefer your offer I'm more than happy to rewind our trade and take my chances in the draft. It's not buyer's remorse, moreso I want to see deeman given every opportunity to improve his list. Now's your chance.
While it's no Goddard, Shuey, Kennedy, Boyd, McVeigh, Westhoff, Lewis and Pick 19 for Sheed, Pick 13 and some other players I'm hopeful that adding Cotchin to my best 22 keeps me in touch with Drew, TW and richcogs for this coming season. If there's any managers out there that want to make deeman an improved offer on the Cotchin, Prestia and Tomlinson package please do. If he'd prefer your offer I'm more than happy to rewind our trade and take my chances in the draft. It's not buyer's remorse, moreso I want to see deeman given every opportunity to improve his list. Now's your chance.
I'll bite....when looking at that trade in comparison to the market this off-season it doesnt align.
Cotchin's value as much as I despise him is compatible to Hannebury. I think everyone would agree with that.
Let's now look at tomlinson and Sutcliffe. I don't recall any similar types being traded this off-season. But tomlinson is more than a year younger, has again very similar stats and like you mentioned played almost twice as many games. I would love to know what these better stats Sutcliffe has are? Because looking at sutcliffes raw stats I see: 1.2 more disposals pg, 1.9 more tackles pg, 1.8 less marks pg, and a significantly worse free kick differential. After looking at all this information, I think you would have to wonder in a rebuild why would you trade for someone older who has less scope for improvement, less chance of getting a game each week and performs similarly at the moment. Massive downgrade for deeman.
Now probably the most comical part of the trade....prestia v Maynard. Should I delve into this one? Let's start with their age... prestia a year younger. Let's then move to career games....Corey did play a game right? I dont need to go any further. 100 Corey Maynard wouldnt be worth prestia.
So the end result of this trade is prestia+cotchin+some of the remaining value from tomlinson for pick #6. Yet pick #6 is also worth Hannebury? Tomlinson+cotchin for 6 + sutcliffe would Yeah be slightly in favour of the team getting cotchin+tomlinson but adding prestia to that is like going in without lube...
Would I submit a better trade offer? Yep. Can I submit a better trade offer? Nope, all those chips have been gambled.
Which leads back to why I am replying. You mentioned my trade with zim last year which it appears you are still bitter about. How about we ask zim those same questions we did last year? How long had he been looking to trade those players ? How many worse trade offers did he receive? And how long has zim been in this league?
You ****ed deeman like you have done to many others in the past and my advice to him was just to be careful when trading and think it through before you push the ok button because particular coaches will try to pressure you into trading.
Cotchin's value as much as I despise him is compatible to Hannebury. I think everyone would agree with that.
Let's now look at tomlinson and Sutcliffe. I don't recall any similar types being traded this off-season. But tomlinson is more than a year younger, has again very similar stats and like you mentioned played almost twice as many games. I would love to know what these better stats Sutcliffe has are? Because looking at sutcliffes raw stats I see: 1.2 more disposals pg, 1.9 more tackles pg, 1.8 less marks pg, and a significantly worse free kick differential. After looking at all this information, I think you would have to wonder in a rebuild why would you trade for someone older who has less scope for improvement, less chance of getting a game each week and performs similarly at the moment. Massive downgrade for deeman.
Now probably the most comical part of the trade....prestia v Maynard. Should I delve into this one? Let's start with their age... prestia a year younger. Let's then move to career games....Corey did play a game right? I dont need to go any further. 100 Corey Maynard wouldnt be worth prestia.
So the end result of this trade is prestia+cotchin+some of the remaining value from tomlinson for pick #6. Yet pick #6 is also worth Hannebury? Tomlinson+cotchin for 6 + sutcliffe would Yeah be slightly in favour of the team getting cotchin+tomlinson but adding prestia to that is like going in without lube...
Would I submit a better trade offer? Yep. Can I submit a better trade offer? Nope, all those chips have been gambled.
Which leads back to why I am replying. You mentioned my trade with zim last year which it appears you are still bitter about. How about we ask zim those same questions we did last year? How long had he been looking to trade those players ? How many worse trade offers did he receive? And how long has zim been in this league?
You ****ed deeman like you have done to many others in the past and my advice to him was just to be careful when trading and think it through before you push the ok button because particular coaches will try to pressure you into trading.
- Thread starter
- #156
Send him a better offer and I’ll happily send these guys your way. You can trade for the “chips” if you can do better. Seriously, put your money where your mouth is. Or, ask Deeman if he’d like to reverse the trade (I’ve offered him as much prior to his on trading the pick and he refused).
I’m not bitter about the Zim trade at all. I just read between the lines when deeman told me someone had criticised him in a direct message over the trade and figured it was you. Suspicions confirmed, thanks for biting. I just find it hypocritical that you’ll happily pull the trigger on that but then take a swing at me over this trade. And Zim hadn’t been trying to offload them for ages, he gave himself a couple hours before the window closed and had asked for multiple players of the calibre of Cripps, Treloar and Whitfield (for less than the package he traded you) from myself, richcogs and TW before accepting your Sheed and pick upgrade offer. It’s all in the thread. He had a better offer from me on the table at the moment he accepted your offer, well, in my opinion, which is really what this is about: your opinion. And you thinking it’s the only one that matters. I don’t agree with your assessment on these players in much the same way Zim wouldn’t have agreed that my offer was the better one.
For someone who’s supposed to have “****ed” over a bunch of coaches I’m still the most active manager with trades. Which suggests plenty are still happy trading with me. And, in almost every trade I’ve offered the manager I’ve traded with the option to reverse the trade (as I’ve done in this one too) which is more than you can say for your trade with Zim last season.
That offer stands, if deeman finds a manager that’ll make him an offer he prefers then I’ll happily reverse the trade and take my pick to the draft.
Seems that the one constant is a very willing seller when discussing both trades. Not much difference between them imo, 2 coaches wanting to hit the reset button and probably accepting unders in full value.
Drew, I think your advice to Deeman is good advice, but your anst at Rockford seems unfair given the trade that went down late last year between you and zim.
Anyway, I am leaving my thoughts on this there... Try to play nice chaps!
Anyway, I am leaving my thoughts on this there... Try to play nice chaps!
My issue is around the sutcliffe/Maynard for prestia/tomlinson part and exactly what you have said Jordie_tackles . "Two coaches pushing the reset button". Deeman has traded for two players of a lower quality that are older than the two he traded out. How is that pushing the reset button?
Surely everyone would agree cotchin and Hannebury carry similar values?
Surely everyone would agree cotchin and Hannebury carry similar values?
How is Sutcliffe/Maynard and Prestia/Tomlinson any different to...
"Drew receives: Brendan Goddard, Luke Shuey, Justin Westhoff, Josh Kennedy, Jordan Lewis, Jarrod Mcveigh, Matthew Boyd, zim round 2 draft pick, zim round 4 draft pick
Zim receives: Dom Sheed, Nathan Freeman, James Aish, Sam Wright, Tom Clurey, Kurt Murtimer, Jordan Foote, drew round 1 draft pick, drew round 2 draft pick"
Surely this ends the debate...
Is Tomilson such a great fantasy player? He's a talent, but i look at those stats and say meh. Maynard rated very highly at Melbourne. If he gets a regular gametime (and i accept that's still a big IF at this stage), he'll be fantasy gold.
No doubt the trade favours Rockford, but i'm comfortable its not at the extreme level (particularly given they both have different priorities for their list).
I think your focusing on Tomlinson Sutcliffe and Maynard who are shit. The deal was Prestia and Cotchin for 6.
Much like your deal was Goddard, shuey, Kennedy for a swap of first for and early second and a second and some ok players
As a Melbourne man I agree, Maynard will be fantasy relevant when he plays and is supposedly on a steap incline.
This. Tomlinson isn't at all fantasy relevant, i had him as depth at best.
Also this. If Maynard does come in and puts up big numbers then I'll have a nice inside mid in his prime that I can on trade for another pick.
In summary, i overpaid a bit, gambled on pick 6 and Maynard, but I didn't see anyone else offering up a high pick for Cotchin. Maybe I should've waited a bit and did pull the trigger hastily but coaches need to chill. I'm fine with it and will continue my quest to get draft picks so I can clear out this trash list i have.
This finger pointing at trades is not cool, I'm pretty sure Zim is sick of reading about his trade with Drew, likewise I'm already sick of this discussion over my trade. Rockford & Drew won the trades we get it, move on. Just my 2 cents.
- Sep 4, 2005
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Will be making a statement when I can get to a PC
- Sep 4, 2005
- 7,100
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Good afternoon all, interesting discussion today, perhaps the WAFL kicking off has influenced the nature of these discussions today.
Firstly going back to my trade with Drew23 last season. You are incorrect Rockford in saying I did not try and offload these guys for a long time. I did send out feelers for much of the season, it's just that I had not fallen into the position of having the weaker hand until later in the season. One thing I think everyone needs to accept that a good squad has more bargaining power than a weak rebuilding squad and it's only logical that deals will favour stronger squads. If every trade had to be 100% equal then hardly any trades would happen.
I think you guys are taking a very simplistic view at my trade. Looking closer at the trade one thing I did do all season is analyse everyone squad in detail and what position their list was in. Pretty much there was 3 stand out squads and one or two so so squads where they could win it with some luck. Then there was mine which was stranded in the middle of the road heading towards being poor and then the rest pretty much had no business is being interested in a Goddard, Lewis or Kennedy (ETC). There was clearly no point in trying to sell these old players to Jordie_tackles or Tutty. I had a very small target audience. I threw together quite a few outrageous proposals to get the conversation happening.
Something is only worth what someone pays for it. Only a few clubs had any need for these types and since they had strong squads already they were driving a hard bargain and not willing to give up much. Just like I'm having a real hard time selling Betts and Sandilands who will win a whole category for a new home. Pick 6 was no option in any deal for Betts and no better deal was on the table for my older guys last season. And no Rockford, Kad Stewart (who got delisted) and Sam Simpson (who you delisted) was not a better deal offered after the fact. At least the players Drew gave are still on an AFL list lmao.
If I did sell in my view the deals would have been even worse this season Highlighted by the lack of interest in Betts. At least Sheed is already a gun. Aish a former pick number 7 has been a disappointment but there is no guarantee that this seasons pick 7 will be any better. If he can average what he did against the dees last season ill be happy. 22 touches, 8 marks, 4 tackles and a goal. Freeman most likely will do a hammy and be delisted next season, but he did play very well in the VFL and if he can do a Higgins and get his body ok he will be better than Kad Stewart lol.
In doing this deal I also considered the consequences if I just held onto them. And that would be another mid table finish and a weaker draft position for next year. Also predicting a poor year it gives me a better waiver position to target free agents we all miss. This was a major factor in doing this deal with Drew.
It is very clear the guys who need them wont be giving up much to secure these guys. I'm consistently getting offers with players they would happily just delist for the FA pool.
I also prefer to look at the overall result much like the real Bulldogs trade period. We took a bath on Stringer but overall it ended up pretty good.
So quite a few 30 year olds and Sheuy and Stevens out for :
Pick 5 (LOL Round 1)
Pick 13 (DYN Round 1)
Pick 19 (LOL Round 2)
Pick 27 (DYN Round 2)
Pick 28 (RR Round 2)
Pick 33 (LOL Round 3)
Pick 46 (LWP Round 4)
Sheed
Aish
Freeman
Foote
Most likely a 1-3 order in the next draft
is something I'm happy with.
So please refrain from using my deal in examples of a poor one.
As for deeman87 deal there, he also only has a target audience of 3-4 clubs to trade to, and in those these clubs only had pick 6, 12 and 14 to play with. These coaches are reluctant to give away their youth. So deeman either holds onto players who do nothing for his list or grab pick 6 while he can. So I dont disagree with the trade.
In other news I now want a pick between 25-30 if anyway is selling.
You did, and to be fair they scared me off
With that in mind...
Trade Alert!
First Trade:
Warriors receive: Pick 41, Pick 42, Pick 44 and Pick 53
Tributes receive: Wil Langford, Josh Thomas and Tutty future 4th round selection.
Warriors were very happy to pick up Langford and Thomas last year, but we needed to make list space for the second trade of the day...
Second Trade:
Wombats receive: Jayden Hunt, Jake Lever, Taylor Garner, Pick 14, Pick 41, Pick 42, Pick 44 and Pick 53
Warriors receive: Nathan Jones, Allan Christensen, Brad Ebert, Stephen Hill, Daniel Rich, and WW future 4th round selection
I might post a detailed report of this trade later. for now, Tutty and deeman87 to confirm.
L_W_P and Rockford, can you Gents update the 1st page of this thread.
For now, that leaves me with Pick 39 to take to the draft. I think I am done until then.
Agreed
Welcome to one of my fav players in the league to watch, my boy Jayden! Hopefully Lever quickly endears himself to me as well.
New trade block - Deledio, Henderson, Impey, Laverde, Mcevoy, D Pearce, Rohan,
Looking for kids, future picks and pick upgrades/more picks in this draft.
New trade block - Deledio, Henderson, Impey, Laverde, Mcevoy, D Pearce, Rohan,
Looking for kids, future picks and pick upgrades/more picks in this draft.
- Thread starter
- #171
Just to be clear, I wasn't using your trade as an example of a poor one. I was using it in comparison to my topping up with Cotchin compared to Drew's top up prior to the deadline last season. I thought it was a bit hypocritical given the similarities between the two situations (as you've detailed).
- Thread starter
- #172
You did, and to be fair they scared me off
With that in mind...
Trade Alert!
First Trade:
Warriors receive: Pick 41, Pick 42, Pick 44 and Pick 53
Tributes receive: Wil Langford, Josh Thomas and Tutty future 4th round selection.
Warriors were very happy to pick up Langford and Thomas last year, but we needed to make list space for the second trade of the day...
Second Trade:
Wombats receive: Jayden Hunt, Jake Lever, Taylor Garner, Pick 14, Pick 41, Pick 42, Pick 44 and Pick 53
Warriors receive: Nathan Jones, Allan Christensen, Brad Ebert, Stephen Hill, Daniel Rich, and WW future 4th round selection
I might post a detailed report of this trade later. for now, Tutty and deeman87 to confirm.
L_W_P and Rockford, can you Gents update the 1st page of this thread.
For now, that leaves me with Pick 39 to take to the draft. I think I am done until then.
Going to update now, I'll need you guys to sanity check it for me tenderwarrior Tutty deeman87
You did, and to be fair they scared me off
With that in mind...
Trade Alert!
First Trade:
Warriors receive: Pick 41, Pick 42, Pick 44 and Pick 53
Tributes receive: Wil Langford, Josh Thomas and Tutty future 4th round selection.
Warriors were very happy to pick up Langford and Thomas last year, but we needed to make list space for the second trade of the day...
Agreed, I wasn't ever going to use all of my picks in this draft. Both these guys will be a help to the tributes going foward, and it is nice to add another pick back in for next year
Delisting:
Matt Dea
Nevil Jetta
Luke Brown
also have Jenkins and Greenwood up for trade
Matt Dea
Nevil Jetta
Luke Brown
also have Jenkins and Greenwood up for trade
- Sep 4, 2005
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