Essendon 2000 has to be the greatest Team of all Time?

[The Dark]

They got lucky in 1999, good luck to them, they got the cup and wouldn’t give a shit. There’s no myth though, Essendon constantly destroyed them.

Apart from in the finals in 1998.

 

[Ren]

It was only like 5-6 goal wins, wasn't "destroying them" and it was only in the 1999 home and away season, North Melbourne did beat Essendon a number of times throughout the late 90s, too, like in that 1998 qualifying final. There's also been teams like Sydney 2005 who lost to their grand final opponent twice in the same season and still beat them in the grand final. Home and away season as a template isn't really valid, since finals is a completely different dynamic, we saw it with Port vs Sydney, last season, Port kept beating Sydney for 8 seasons straight until they met in finals. I think the prelim showed Essendon just weren't mature enough to compete for the premiership, a lot of teams have to go through heartache to mature to that premiership level. North were the hungriest team of 1999 because of the 1998 GF, similar to Essendon in 2000 because of the 1999 prelim.

I agree home and away form is irrelevant when it comes to finals form. In 2021 melbourne just snuck in against geelong but obliterated them a few weeks later in finals.

 

[jdstorm]

This x a zillion.

Essendon the Lleyton Hewitt of footy.

Snagged one in between two great dynasties ... North in the 90s and Brissy threepeat.

Not quite.

More like a Marat safin. Lots of unfulfilled potential.

the best modern comparison is the current Bevo Bulldogs.

Bont = Hird
2016 = 1993

Just a completely stacked team that should have far more than 1 flag and 1 GF loss.

Except in 2000 everything just went right for Essendon and they put it together as well as any other team has ever done .

 

[HalloweenJack]

I changed my vote to No because the greatest team would have more than 1 flag to their name. Having said that there is no doubt that Essendon's 2000 season is the greatest season by a team.

 

[Fadge]

Suggest the fact we have 40% of people voting the affirmative, we have our answer.

What other team, that people posting on here would have seen in their lifetimes, would get anywhere near that number of votes?

I can't even think of who the second best single season team is after Essendon 2000.

It's like nominating who the second best cricketer in the history of the game is after Bradman.

 

[Percel]

the all time greatest season ever, filthy that the doggies beat them. Could have been perfect

 

[Toump Ass]

Honestly that 2011 team we had was insane, and it wasn't as though we were shit in the grand final, Geelong were just unbelievable.

Until the last quarter that was the best football I've ever seen, both sides playing at an unbelievable level.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

I changed my vote to No because the greatest team would have more than 1 flag to their name. Having said that there is no doubt that Essendon's 2000 season is the greatest season by a team.

I mean to my eye the context of the original post was a single season? To only win one flag with that team from 99-01 sticks out like a sore thumb.

It is undeniable by anyone that Essendon 2000 is the single best season ever however teams like Brisbane, Hawthorn etc etc are obviously dynasty like periods.

I do wonder if a team will ever be able to do what Essendon did and go one further. Can't see it happening in the modern game though.

 

[jdstorm]

I mean to my eye the context of the original post was a single season? To only win one flag with that team from 99-01 sticks out like a sore thumb.

It is undeniable by anyone that Essendon 2000 is the single best season ever however teams like Brisbane, Hawthorn etc etc are obviously dynasty like periods.

I do wonder if a team will ever be able to do what Essendon did and go one further. Can't see it happening in the modern game though.

Academy Rules being such an advantage make it somewhat possible. We’re already seeing the Swans and Lions pull away from the pack due to it.

Dogs are also a chance if they manage to put it all together. Ridiculous team and some big father son luck

 

[HalloweenJack]

I mean to my eye the context of the original post was a single season? To only win one flag with that team from 99-01 sticks out like a sore thumb.

It is undeniable by anyone that Essendon 2000 is the single best season ever however teams like Brisbane, Hawthorn etc etc are obviously dynasty like periods.

I do wonder if a team will ever be able to do what Essendon did and go one further. Can't see it happening in the modern game though.

I 100% agree. I've backtracked and gone back to yes.

The Bombers 2000 season was unparalleled and unlikely to be equalled or bettered.

Geelong in 2008 if they had won the GF would have come close. However Geelong weren't as dominant, a few close to closish wins and a thrashing by Collingwood during the H&A. Apart from the Bombers loss to the Bulldogs they never looked like losing a game.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

I 100% agree. I've backtracked and gone back to yes.

The Bombers 2000 season was unparalleled and unlikely to be equalled or bettered.

Geelong in 2008 if they had won the GF would have come close. However Geelong weren't as dominant, a few close to closish wins and a thrashing by Collingwood during the H&A. Apart from the Bombers loss to the Bulldogs they never looked like losing a game.

True, but even if geelong won that GF, still think essendon has them comfortably.

Essendon 2000 were beating teams by an avg of like 50-60 points every game for an entire season. It was ludicrous. Just utter dominance.

 

[Blind Turn]

no argument from me.

I think that the teams that could have beaten or had a shot at beating them that I’ve seen were Carlton 95, us in 07, and us and the Pies in 11.

I know we had our shot in 08 and mathematically we did, but I think the best footy our side played was actually round 6 onward in 07. It won’t ever be borne out though in the history books because we finished the season 18-4.

Essendon in ‘85 deserves a mention. Lost 3 for the season and demolished a side in both finals that otherwise dominated the 80s.

 

[Mr Meow]

True, but even if geelong won that GF, still think essendon has them comfortably.

Essendon 2000 were beating teams by an avg of like 50-60 points every game for an entire season. It was ludicrous. Just utter dominance.

Essendon 2000 was the most dominant season.

Geelong 2008 would've had the most dominant season if they got the job done on GF day. Better % than Essendon.

Geelong 2007 started 2-3 so were already out of the running. They had the most dominant last 20 games of a season this century though, round 6 onwards.

On paper that Geelong side would smash the Bombers, although the POD key forwards could keep it close (like when Hawthorn had Franklin/Roughead kick about 180 goals between them in 2008, while Geelongs KPFs were Mooney and Lonergan).

 

[Irish BlueBagger]

They can be as hungry as they want, they couldn’t beat Essendon 1999-2001.

6 meetings, Essendon went 6-0

141 - 106
158 - 132
119 - 70
198 - 73
146 - 61
171 - 159

Essendon average score of 156.

Average winning margin of 55 points.

It wasn’t even close.

Pagan and North refused to shut the game down against Essendon, they insisted on going head-to-head in a shootout and the above is what happened when you went head to head in a shootout with that team. It had a forward line of Lloyd, Lucas, Hird, Mercuri, Bewick and others plus goalkicking midfielders. If you gave them space they blew you off the park.

There was that one game in 1999 when Carey kicked 10 in one of the most amazing individual games you’d see, it didn’t matter, they were still comfortably beaten.

It’s hardly a myth, as all the evidence shows, they were nowhere near Essendon over that three-year period.

They got lucky in 1999, good luck to them, they got the cup and wouldn’t give a shit. There’s no myth though, Essendon constantly destroyed them.

They did knock you out of the finals in 1998. You must have conveniently forgotten about that.

Either that or you're cherry picking a selective timeframe to suit your agenda at least.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

Essendon 2000 was the most dominant season.

Geelong 2008 would've had the most dominant season if they got the job done on GF day. Better % than Essendon.

Geelong 2007 started 2-3 so were already out of the running. They had the most dominant last 20 games of a season this century though, round 6 onwards.

On paper that Geelong side would smash the Bombers, although the POD key forwards could keep it close (like when Hawthorn had Franklin/Roughead kick about 180 goals between them in 2008, while Geelongs KPFs were Mooney and Lonergan).

I think Geelong 08 beat Essendon 2000 only because of time advancement.

Gold Coast 2024 would likely beat Essendon 2000 if they played.

Player talent keeps getting better as does advancements in fitness etc etc

 

[TheBigLeftBoot]

Best overall record yes.

But we’d beat them at the MCG and Geelong 08 would beat them. Better talent.

Not sure about the lions and hawks.

Richmond's MCG record in finals against Melbourne based teams in the Dusty era says otherwise

 

[Mr Meow]

I think Geelong 08 beat Essendon 2000 only because of time advancement.

Gold Coast 2024 would likely beat Essendon 2000 if they played.

Player talent keeps getting better as does advancements in fitness etc etc

That '07 side was crazy though. 11 All Australians. 1 player was the League MVP (Leigh Matthews Trophy), a different player won the Brownlow and you could that a couple of others could have been finals MVP.

Like I said, the dodgy start to the year ruled out most dominant season. But then you had peak Ablett, Bartel, Scarlett, Corey, Chapman, Johnson, Enright, Ottens, Milburn, Mackie, Ling, Kelly et al. operating in a crazy space of synergy for 20 weeks.

 

[AlwaysHawks15]

They were in trouble at times in games during the season but at full throttle they had at least 2 extra gears they could go to which other teams didn't. Closest team to them that year was Carlton IMO. That was the year Kouta went beserk and should have romped in the Brownlow than got injured late in the year. Think from memory they won about 10 or 11 in a row at 1 point and we were looking at arguably the most anticipated Home and away game ever at the time. ( Surpassed by the Saints v Cats game of 09). Than the Dogs beat them the week before which ended the streak and the match lost a bit of momentum because of it. Carlton should have played off in the GF but choked against Melbourne.

 

[Xtreme]

Brisbane 2024

Written off early in the season
Stormed home and pwned everyone when it mattered

UP THE LIONS

 

[AlwaysHawks15]

That '07 side was crazy though. 11 All Australians. 1 player was the League MVP (Leigh Matthews Trophy), a different player won the Brownlow and you could that a couple of others could have been finals MVP.

Like I said, the dodgy start to the year ruled out most dominant season. But then you had peak Ablett, Bartel, Scarlett, Corey, Chapman, Johnson, Enright, Ottens, Milburn, Mackie, Ling, Kelly et al. operating in a crazy space of synergy for 20 weeks.

The only team you guys didn't beat that year was us funnily enough. We won early on about round 3. I remember thinking at the time that your mob should have been playing better than you were but something seemed off. Than a few weeks later it exploded and the rest is history

 

[AlwaysHawks15]

Essendon were phenomenal that year.
Carlton probably the only decent side in that top 8 to contend in any other year.

Melbourne were average.
North on the decline after a very decent last few years.
Several other middling teams in and around the bottom part of the eight.
Brisbane, who were a season short of their big launch and three peat.

Essendon were far and away superior to any other team in that particular year, and the most dominant I’ve seen.

We really should have been talking about them as a dynasty team though. 99 they were upset in the prelim and would have rolled the eventual premiers. 2001 they were beaten by a team that performed better on the day, but one in which the Essendon captain himself said he was greatly disappointed by his teams performance.

Regardless of whether it should have been back to back or a three peat, the Bombers team at that time left at least one flag out there.

The Blues were arguably matching them for a large portion of the season. Than Kouta got injured and they fell away a bit and didn't even make the GF because they choked in the QF. Pretty sure at 1 point the Blues were 15-2 or something like that whilst the bombers were undefeated.

 

[AlwaysHawks15]

The Blues were arguably matching them for a large portion of the season. Than Kouta got injured and they fell away a bit and didn't even make the GF because they choked in the QF. Pretty sure at 1 point the Blues were 15-2 or something like that whilst the bombers were undefeated.

15-3 after going on a 13 match win streak they were. They than lost 3 in a row including the bombers match. Ended up losing 5 of their last 7 including 2 finals. Up to round 18 it was them and the Bombers than daylight.

 

[Gavin Excell]

Obviously one of the stellar teams of all time but does beg question.why they failed to make GF year prior or win GF following year

 

[Mr Meow]

Obviously one of the stellar teams of all time but does beg question.why they failed to make GF year prior or win GF following year

Great teams seem to have a 5 or 6 year peak. Not strictly on final season results but where their list is at its best and age profile its strongest.

Geelong 2007-2011. Hawthorn 2011-2016 (despite the '08 flag). Brisbane 1999-2004. North Melbourne 1994-1999. West Coast 1991-1995. 3 flags is around par for a run like that, as far as a truly great side proving itself. Hawthorn had the earlier flag to add and make it 4, while NM and WCE probably left a flag on the table.

That Essendon side's peak was probably 1998-2002, despite the modest finishing position in the first and last seasons of that batch. 1 flag, 2 grand finals and 3 prelims was unders. Hence the focus more on the dominant season rather than it being a truly great side/top run. Maybe it was simply a case of a large group of players only truly peaking for 1 season (I'm not talking about the likes of Hird, Lloyd and Fletcher - but maybe a few others in the next bracket). A slight drop off the year before and after was enough to reveal fatal flaws in finals.

 

[Gavin Excell]

Great teams seem to have a 5 or 6 year peak. Not strictly on final season results but where their list is at its best and age profile its strongest.

Geelong 2007-2011. Hawthorn 2011-2016 (despite the '08 flag). Brisbane 1999-2004. North Melbourne 1994-1999. West Coast 1991-1995. 3 flags is probably par for a run like that, as far as a truly great side proving itself. Hawthorn had the earlier flag to add and make it 4, while NM and WCE probably left a flag on the table.

That Essendon side's peak was probably 1998-2002, despite the modest finishing position in the first and last seasons of that batch. 1 flag, 2 grand finals and 3 prelims was unders. Hence the focus more on the dominant season rather than it being a truly great side/top run. Maybe it was simply a case of a large group of players only truly peaking for 1 season. A slight drop off the year before and after was enough to find fatal flaws in finals.

Admittedly in 2001 they ended up encountering one of the best sides modern era