Traded Dylan Shiel [traded with future 2nd to Essendon for #9 and future 1st round pick]

[mickd]

Given verbal confirmation to Essendon about 3 weeks ago

Please tell us more. Sounds juicy

 

[mickd]

Bang on. Juddy hates the place so much now he's even on the board and actively playing a role in getting Shiel over. The bastard!

He obviously loves the place but regret in not taking Carlton to the next premiership as a player would have hurt him. Same as bucks.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Lol. 2007 trades.

2018 trades..

I say 10 years.

Shiel will be like Juddy. After his football career is over, won't be surprised that Shiel works for Visy.

Hawthorn has no association with visy, so that would just be odd.

 

[tuma]

Shiel to cfc for prosperity or to the Dons for love. More likely to the blues. Money doesn't grow on a tree.

 

[Procrastinator35]

Shiel to cfc for prosperity or to the Dons for love. More likely to the blues. Money doesn't grow on a tree.

Sounds like he's Saints bound then.

Ohhh the Irony!

There's always a distinct residue of bloated ego in every Chelsea post.

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

How do the Hawks do a trade that will in anyway satisfy the Giants?

 

[Burtman]

How do the Hawks do a trade that will in anyway satisfy the Giants?

We have two years worth of picks, it’s not really that hard to work out.

 

[YEMOC NAYR]

How do the Hawks do a trade that will in anyway satisfy the Giants?

Pretty much what they do is say this is what we have, thanks for Shiel
GWS aint in a position to keep him, he wouldn't be leaving if that wasn't the case.

 

[halfback dasher]

Given verbal confirmation to Essendon about 3 weeks ago

Lol, just ....lol

 

[Colonial]

Pretty much what they do is say this is what we have, thanks for Shiel
GWS aint in a position to keep him, he wouldn't be leaving if that wasn't the case.

Keep on talking.

You ain't getting a star for shits and giggles.

Pay something to get something.

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

Pretty much what they do is say this is what we have, thanks for Shiel
GWS aint in a position to keep him, he wouldn't be leaving if that wasn't the case.

They have some leverage if Shiel nominates Hawks, but GWS would be well within their rights to get equal to market rate and if it is not considerably more than what they will get as free agency compo 12 months later GWS will just retain him, their salary cap must be tight but their are ways for them to massage this and certainly don’t think they will take understand purely because that is all the Hawks have.

 

[davis_756]

Pretty much what they do is say this is what we have, thanks for Shiel
GWS aint in a position to keep him, he wouldn't be leaving if that wasn't the case.

They just get rid of lobb and we have this discussion again next year, they won't be trading him if it is not beneficial to them.

 

[F_therest]

We have two years worth of picks, it’s not really that hard to work out.

I'm seeing a lot of Hawks posters saying pick 14 & Ceglar...which frankly is an insult.

I know you got Mitchell for 14 but even at the time i thought that was big unders...proven correct. Not sure what Swans were thinking. GWS should learn from this.

Pick 14 is nice but not a high % of being a gun and Ceglar is a second string ruckman, not a no.1 ruck. Losing him wouldn't hurt Hawthorn in the slightest.

If GWS wanted Ceglar better off just doing a separate straight swap trade, like a 3rd rounder.

 

[blueblooded]

Now I’ll preface this by saying I understand we won 2 games this year but I just had a look at the Hawthorn list and the amount of players that are 30 plus or nearing 30 that are important is staggering. There’s about 10 or 12 names there.
If you’re choosing Hawks over Carlton for success the flag better come next year.

The Hawks list reminds me of the Carlton list in 2001/2002 before it fell off the cliff.

Giving away first rounders to plug holes in the dam wall is not what the Hawks need to be doing now.

Holding on for dear life just like Sydney and Geelong are and all of these clubs will be lucky to tread water in the next 2-3 years before they have no choice but to completely bottom out.

Hopefully Shiel and these types are getting the right advice around short,medium and long term success. Not what’s happened in the last 10 years. Carlton was a powerhouse in the 90s too and then early 2000 came and we lost SOS, Bradley, ratten, brown, rice, McKay, diesel, sexton, Christou etc etc between 98-2002 and while we were still competitive in this period without saluting once the end came it came hard. I see no other way for Hawks, Cats and even Sydney in the next 2 or so seasons. Plugging holes in the wall won’t make a difference.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Now I’ll preface this by saying I understand we won 2 games this year but I just had a look at the Hawthorn list and the amount of players that are 30 plus or nearing 30 that are important is staggering. There’s about 10 or 12 names there.
If you’re choosing Hawks over Carlton for success the flag better come next year.

The Hawks list reminds me of the Carlton list in 2001/2002 before it fell off the cliff.

Giving away first rounders to plug holes in the dam wall is not what the Hawks need to be doing now.

Holding on for dear life just like Sydney and Geelong are and all of these clubs will be lucky to tread water in the next 2-3 years before they have no choice but to completely bottom out.

Hopefully Shiel and these types are getting the right advice around short,medium and long term success. Not what’s happened in the last 10 years. Carlton was a powerhouse in the 90s too and then early 2000 came and we lost SOS, Bradley, ratten, brown, rice, McKay, diesel, sexton, Christou etc etc between 98-2002 and while we were still competitive in this period without saluting once the end came it came hard. I see no other way for Hawks, Cats and even Sydney in the next 2 or so seasons. Plugging holes in the wall won’t make a difference.

Ahh Bigfooty, where age and potential is key, rather than actual output.

 

[TheFourPillars]

Now I’ll preface this by saying I understand we won 2 games this year but I just had a look at the Hawthorn list and the amount of players that are 30 plus or nearing 30 that are important is staggering. There’s about 10 or 12 names there.
If you’re choosing Hawks over Carlton for success the flag better come next year.

The Hawks list reminds me of the Carlton list in 2001/2002 before it fell off the cliff.

Giving away first rounders to plug holes in the dam wall is not what the Hawks need to be doing now.

Holding on for dear life just like Sydney and Geelong are and all of these clubs will be lucky to tread water in the next 2-3 years before they have no choice but to completely bottom out.

Hopefully Shiel and these types are getting the right advice around short,medium and long term success. Not what’s happened in the last 10 years. Carlton was a powerhouse in the 90s too and then early 2000 came and we lost SOS, Bradley, ratten, brown, rice, McKay, diesel, sexton, Christou etc etc between 98-2002 and while we were still competitive in this period without saluting once the end came it came hard. I see no other way for Hawks, Cats and even Sydney in the next 2 or so seasons. Plugging holes in the wall won’t make a difference.

You're living in the past. Drafting is not the only way to get top end talent to your club. In fact trading for a gun player makes more sense because u know what youre getting

 

[Bardo State]

Giving away first rounders to plug holes in the dam wall is not what the Hawks need to be doing now.

Giving away first round picks for A-grade talent that will be around for at least half a decade on the other hand.

If a team wins 15 games and has the opportunity to add a player like Shiel to their list for a reasonable price and doesn't, that's just about malpractice.

If I was Shiel, I'd probably have more confidence in the Geelong/Sydney model than the Carlton model when it comes to list management.

 

[blueblooded]

Ahh Bigfooty, where age and potential is key, rather than actual output.

Keep your head in the sand mate no dramas at all, be fantastic to see the Hawks become irrelevant again just because you thought you could hold on just for that 1 or 2 years too long just like what’s happening now. Same thing happened in the 90s after the glory years of the 80s but Hawks supporters forget how steep the cliff was then.

I look forward to the next few years as there is a massive change of the guard coming. Geelong, Hawthorn and Sydney will be irrelevant if they keep making list management decisions to keep up with the joneses as they have been. The last 2 finals series already show teams starting to fly past you and there’s more behind them.

 

[TeeJay Blue]

Ahh Bigfooty, where age and potential is key, rather than actual output.

Yet everybody is overrating the output of their club and are talking about the potential of their club winning a flag.

Blues supporters have to cop the whole 'Hawthorn, St. Kilda, Essendon are closer to a flag than Carlton'. We answer back 'Are they really?'.

I think the wisest of men would come to a similar answer. Nobody f***ing knows and nobody should act like they f***ing do!

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Keep your head in the sand mate no dramas at all, be fantastic to see the Hawks become irrelevant again just because you thought you could hold on just for that 1 or 2 years too long just like what’s happening now. Same thing happened in the 90s after the glory years of the 80s but Hawks supporters forget how steep the cliff was then.

I look forward to the next few years as there is a massive change of the guard coming. Geelong, Hawthorn and Sydney will be irrelevant if they keep making list management decisions to keep up with the joneses as they have been. The last 2 finals series already show teams starting to fly past you and there’s more behind them.

Wow. It’s like you’re been stuck in an underground bunker and have missed Hawthorn regenerate their list on the run over the last 2 years and finish top 4 after supposedly being destined to the bottom 4 after 2016 concluded.

All this other stuff about the 80’s and 90’s though, I mean, it’s great and all, but it really just sounds like you really want it to happen more than it being based on reality.

 

[bradburygold]

What we can all agree on is that carlton supporters seem to want and rate Shiel even more than hawthorn supporters do

 

[hk89]

Now I’ll preface this by saying I understand we won 2 games this year but I just had a look at the Hawthorn list and the amount of players that are 30 plus or nearing 30 that are important is staggering. There’s about 10 or 12 names there.

Once you remove retired players, and those who didn't play a single game for us in 2018, there are 8 players who will be over 30 by this time next year.

Carlton have a few players in that bracket too. Not as many as us, but Carlton appears to rely on their old guys more than we've relied on ours.

If you look at Hawthorns top 7 average supercoach point scorers for the year (for want of a better comparison stat), McEvoy is the only one who will be 30+ by this time next year, and he's only just turned 29 a couple of months ago. Carlton had Simpson, Murphy, Thomas and Kreuzer in their top 7 average supercoach scorers, all guys who will be over 30 by this time next year. In fact Krezuer is the only one of those 4 who will be under 32 by this time next year.

This isn't to say guys like Burgoyne and Roughy are unimportant, they and a few of the other old guys are not far outside our top 7, but they just aren't the top few contributors like the old blokes at Carlton are.

If you’re choosing Hawks over Carlton for success the flag better come next year.

Why? Because Carlton have such a good record at rebuilding? Even if we need to go to the bottom again first, I'd back Hawthorn having their next flag before Carlton.

The Hawks list reminds me of the Carlton list in 2001/2002 before it fell off the cliff.

Unless we are about to get caught for massive salary cap breaching, your situation in 2001/2002 isn't very relevant to us. You fell off a cliff partly because the sanctions you received for your cheating made it very hard to do any list regeneration.

Giving away first rounders to plug holes in the dam wall is not what the Hawks need to be doing now.

Yeah, that served us really badly last time we tried it after we finished poorly in 2009 and 2010. Seems to me we were a bit unlucky with injuries at the wrong time in finals and finished top 4 home and away. Giving away our first rounders for ready made players like we did with Mitchell and O'Meara seems like it is exactly the thing we should be doing right now. Windows don't open very often , and even if its narrow we are best off having a shot.

Holding on for dear life just like Sydney and Geelong are and all of these clubs will be lucky to tread water in the next 2-3 years before they have no choice but to completely bottom out.

I'd much rather be treading water making prelims year after year like Sydney and Geelong have, than treading in shit for years like Carlton have. Sydney especially have been very close a few times, Geelong could have snagged a flag during this period with a bit more luck too.

If you think Carlton are ready to pounce on the competition , why ask for a priority pick this year? You think Shiel doesn't notice that shit?

Hopefully Shiel and these types are getting the right advice around short,medium and long term success. Not what’s happened in the last 10 years. Carlton was a powerhouse in the 90s too and then early 2000 came and we lost SOS, Bradley, ratten, brown, rice, McKay, diesel, sexton, Christou etc etc between 98-2002 and while we were still competitive in this period without saluting once the end came it came hard.

Seriously dude, that entire period was tainted by your massive cap cheating. You fell in a heap at the end of it because a) you were severely punished and b) it is hard to build a premiership list when you have to stay under the cap.

I see no other way for Hawks, Cats and even Sydney in the next 2 or so seasons. Plugging holes in the wall won’t make a difference.

Except it did last time Hawthorn did it. Sydney have been doing it for years and making grand finals regularly.

At the end of the day Shiel may pick Carlton, but if he does everyone knows it will be because it is the best $'s choice for him. Nobody trusts Carlton will not **** up another rebuild.

 

[Great8]

Bang on. Juddy hates the place so much now he's even on the board and actively playing a role in getting Shiel over. The bastard!

Kennedy couldn’t be happier that he was turfed out the door

 

[Iceman!]

We have two years worth of picks, it’s not really that hard to work out.

Don't forget that we also have a full list of players as well to work with, even if they were not included in a trade with the Giants directly. People suggesting we may not have the currency to get a deal done is more hopeful than anything else.

 

[MasterSamurai]

Once you remove retired players, and those who didn't play a single game for us in 2018, there are 8 players who will be over 30 by this time next year.

Carlton have a few players in that bracket too. Not us much as us, but Carlton appears to rely on their old guys more than we've relied on ours.

If you look at Hawthorns top 7 average supercoach point scorers for the year (for want of a better comparison stat), McEvoy is the only one who will be 30+ by this time next year, and he's only just turned 29 a couple of months ago. Carlton had Simpson, Murphy, Thomas and Kreuzer in their top 7 average supercoach scorers, all guys who will be over 30 by this time next year. In fact Krezuer is the only one of those 4 who will be under 32 by this time next year.

This isn't to say guys like Burgoyne and Roughy are unimportant, they and a few of the other old guys are not far outside our top 7, but they just aren't the top few contributors like the old blokes at Carlton are.



Why? Because Carlton have such a good record at rebuilding? Even if we need to go to the bottom again first, I'd back Hawthorn having their next flag before Carlton.



Unless we are about to get caught for massive salary cap breaching, your situation in 2001/2002 isn't very relevant to us. You fell off a cliff partly because the sanctions you received for your cheating made it very hard to do any list regeneration.



Yeah, that served us really badly last time we tried it after we finished poorly in 2009 and 2010. Seems to me we were a bit unlucky with injuries at the wrong time in finals and finished top 4 home and away. Giving away our first rounders for ready made players like we did with Mitchell and O'Meara seems like it is exactly the thing we should be doing right now. Windows don't open very often , and even if its narrow we are best off having a shot.



I'd much rather be treading water making prelims year after year like Sydney and Geelong have, than treading in shit for years like Carlton have. Sydney especially have been very close a few times, Geelong could have snagged a flag during this period with a bit more luck too.

If you think Carlton are ready to pounce on the competition , why ask for a priority pick this year? You think Shiel doesn't notice that shit?



Seriously dude, that entire period was tainted by your massive cap cheating. You fell in a heap at the end of it because a) you were severely punished and b) it is hard to build a premiership list when you have to stay under the cap.



Except it did last time Hawthorn did it. Sydney have been doing it for years and making grand finals regularly.

At the end of the day Shiel may pick Carlton, but if he does everyone knows it will be because it is the best $'s choice for him. Nobody trusts Carlton will not **** up another rebuild.

POTY!!