Coronavirus disease (COVID-19) 2020

[M Malice]

Glad you are feeling better.
It’s amazing how in such a short time we have gone from knowing no one with the virus, to knowing so so many who either have or have had the virus.
No one that I know has had it too bad. All only reasonably minor symptoms and for fairly short periods.

I do know one Family who are all not vaccinated (was waiting for the Nova Vax apparently). The two children (teenagers) come down with the virus, both just flew type symptoms, nothing too extreme and the parents didn’t get it at all. Living in the same household.
So God only knows whether the vaccinations do anything anyway.
I am due for the booster now and really not sure if I want to get it as I think we are at the point where I would just prefer to get it and build a natural immunity anyway.

Apparently Novavax is very close to getting authority for use in Australia.

Yep, being fully vaccinated(Astrazeneca) and now with natural immunity on top I'll probably not bother with the booster unless it is made compulsory and then I'd go with the more traditional type vaccine in Novavax as the booster.

 

[Section 5]

Glad you are feeling better.
It’s amazing how in such a short time we have gone from knowing no one with the virus, to knowing so so many who either have or have had the virus.
No one that I know has had it too bad. All only reasonably minor symptoms and for fairly short periods.

I do know one Family who are all not vaccinated (was waiting for the Nova Vax apparently). The two children (teenagers) come down with the virus, both just flew type symptoms, nothing too extreme and the parents didn’t get it at all. Living in the same household.
So God only knows whether the vaccinations do anything anyway.
I am due for the booster now and really not sure if I want to get it as I think we are at the point where I would just prefer to get it and build a natural immunity anyway.

Dalions
Get the booster what have you got to lose
Some household people just won't catch the virus. I read an article (can't locate at present) 25% avoid getting the virus in household especially if vaccinated
That is still 75% who will get Omicron and have nil symptoms up to very unwell

 

[Dalions]

Dalions
Get the booster what have you got to lose
Some household people just won't catch the virus. I read an article (can't locate at present) 25% avoid getting the virus in household especially if vaccinated
That is still 75% who will get Omicron and have nil symptoms up to very unwell

We are booked in for tomorrow afternoon so I will go ahead and get it but not completely sure I want to, but I will.

 

[Section 5]

Apparently Novavax is very close to getting authority for use in Australia.

Yep, being fully vaccinated(Astrazeneca) and now with natural immunity on top I'll probably not bother with the booster unless it is made compulsory and then I'd go with the more traditional type vaccine in Novavax as the booster.

Glad you are getting over covid
I agree with your friends you were lucky to have had the 2 Astra shots
As i mentioned to Dlions nothing to lose by getting the booster
Seeing you have had covid, check with GP or someone else in the official health field for the timeframe of a booster because you are still recovering
Nova Vax approved today will be out and about by end of February. But who knows with the way distribution of everything is at present
I would not wait that long if GP says you are good to go earlier for the booster
Stay safe

 

[Section 5]

We are booked in for tomorrow afternoon so I will go ahead and get it but not completely sure I want to, but I will.

Well done. Don't back out
I was a little sore around the injection site for 2 days nothing else for this oldie

 

[Dalions]

Well done. Don't back out
I was a little sore around the injection site for 2 days nothing else for this oldie

That is all I got for the first 2, so hoping for a similar outcome.

 

[briztoon]

We got our boosters on Tuesday. A little sore Wednesday around the injection site.

However my wife has a rather swollen lymph node under the arm she got her injection in, she’s in a bit of pain and discomfort.

Apparently 5% of people who get the Pfizer booster get swollen lymph nodes. 10% for Moderna.

Best medical advice is to get your booster in the opposite arm from where you got your second vaccine.

 

[POBT]

I hate wearing a mask. Hate it with a passion.

But masks mandates have been the best bang for buck virus control IMO. It comes at a very small monetary cost and an almost negligible loss of personal liberty. In return, we get a good level of protection which only increases with widespread compliance.

I admit that previously I wore a mask because the law told me to. Now I wear it because it's just sensible to do so.

 

[The Flying Belgian]

I hate wearing a mask. Hate it with a passion.

But masks mandates have been the best bang for buck virus control IMO. It comes at a very small monetary cost and an almost negligible loss of personal liberty. In return, we get a good level of protection which only increases with widespread compliance.

I admit that previously I wore a mask because the law told me to. Now I wear it because it's just sensible to do so.

Beards + mask = sweaty, sweaty, sweaty.

But yeah, I seriously don't get the reluctance. Yes they're uncomfortable but if you're not wearing one it's an act of defiance, selfishness or stupidity (or combinations thereof).

 

[The Flying Belgian]

Apparently 5% of people who get the Pfizer booster get swollen lymph nodes. 10% for Moderna.

I had swollen glands in my neck for a good couple of months after my second dose.Nothing after the booster though.

 

[dlanod]

However my wife has a rather swollen lymph node under the arm she got her injection in, she’s in a bit of pain and discomfort.

Wife and I both got exactly that after our boosters. Cleared up in about three days, but it was pretty crap putting deodorant on in the meantime.

 

[Viceregal]

That’s very very stiff to pin on Jobe. He did what he was asked of by the club. How was he to know exactly what was happening. Pairing him with Wayne Carey is extremely extremely harsh!!

Carey is a harsh comparison but Jobe isn't exactly innocent in the drugs saga either.

- pretty sure that I was just following orders was supposed to have been discredited (albeit widely used since) some time ago...

- subjective I suppose - when I see Jobe I automatically think of someone who was personally a drug cheat and who professionally (as captain) led his fellows into an ethical and medical abyss.

Actually thinking about it now I am totally out of step since as a society we now celebrate injecting unknown substances with unknown side effects based on Authority for a perceived greater good ... perhaps the Dons were just ahead of their time.

 

[briztoon]

Actually thinking about it now I am totally out of step since as a society we now celebrate injecting unknown substances with unknown side effects based on Authority for a perceived greater good ... perhaps the Dons were just ahead of their time.

Which part is unknown?

I’m sure medical scientists know exactly what’s in such substances.

Probably just as many unknown substances in most packaged foods these days.

 

[knaf]

- pretty sure that I was just following orders was supposed to have been discredited (albeit widely used since) some time ago...

- subjective I suppose - when I see Jobe I automatically think of someone who was personally a drug cheat and who professionally (as captain) led his fellows into an ethical and medical abyss.

Actually thinking about it now I am totally out of step since as a society we now celebrate injecting unknown substances with unknown side effects based on Authority for a perceived greater good ... perhaps the Dons were just ahead of their time.

Did you forget the icons?

 

[Viceregal]

Which part is unknown?

I’m sure medical scientists know exactly what’s in such substances.

Probably just as many unknown substances in most packaged foods these days.

Did you forget the icons?

Well to quote from the TGA website (our version of the FDA) ... COVID-19 vaccines undergoing evaluation

"All COVID-19 vaccine applications are being treated with the greatest priority as part of the Department of Health's response to the pandemic. Under normal circumstances, TGA's assessment (for both provisional and general registration) begins once all information to support registration is available. For COVID-19 vaccines, the TGA has agreed to accept rolling data to enable early evaluation of data as it comes to hand.

Many of the large-scale clinical trials that will provide evidence of safety and effectiveness are still progressing and these results will be provided to the TGA as they become available. The TGA will also evaluate quality data (such as how the vaccines are manufactured).

The TGA will only be in a position to make a provisional registration decision for a vaccine once all required data relating to safety, quality and efficacy has been provided and assessed.

With rolling submissions, collaboration with international regulators, and proactively working with sponsors, it is expected the evaluation of COVID-19 vaccines will be significantly expedited without compromising on our strict standards of safety, quality and efficacy. However, the timeframe for the evaluation of each vaccine will ultimately depend on when the complete data package is provided by sponsors. We have not yet received a full data package from any company."

So the answer to 'which part is unknown', just from that site, is 1) whether they are safe, 2) whether they are effective, 3) how they are manufactured, 4) when the companies will be providing the TGA the data to make those determinations (which at this point no company has provided) ... and not part of that quote but the long term effects are, by definition, unknown since we lack access to a functioning time machine.

So no I did not forget the icons but I will put one in here now for you!

 

[dlanod]

Well to quote from the TGA website (our version of the FDA) ... COVID-19 vaccines undergoing evaluation

"All COVID-19 vaccine applications are being treated with the greatest priority as part of the Department of Health's response to the pandemic. Under normal circumstances, TGA's assessment (for both provisional and general registration) begins once all information to support registration is available. For COVID-19 vaccines, the TGA has agreed to accept rolling data to enable early evaluation of data as it comes to hand.

Many of the large-scale clinical trials that will provide evidence of safety and effectiveness are still progressing and these results will be provided to the TGA as they become available. The TGA will also evaluate quality data (such as how the vaccines are manufactured).

The TGA will only be in a position to make a provisional registration decision for a vaccine once all required data relating to safety, quality and efficacy has been provided and assessed.

With rolling submissions, collaboration with international regulators, and proactively working with sponsors, it is expected the evaluation of COVID-19 vaccines will be significantly expedited without compromising on our strict standards of safety, quality and efficacy. However, the timeframe for the evaluation of each vaccine will ultimately depend on when the complete data package is provided by sponsors. We have not yet received a full data package from any company."

So the answer to 'which part is unknown', just from that site, is 1) whether they are safe, 2) whether they are effective, 3) how they are manufactured, 4) when the companies will be providing the TGA the data to make those determinations (which at this point no company has provided) ... and not part of that quote but the long term effects are, by definition, unknown since we lack access to a functioning time machine.

So no I did not forget the icons but I will put one in here now for you!

Ah, no.

See the bolded section? The part about "all required data relating to safety, quality and efficacy", i.e. safe, effective, how they are manufactured, etc, being required for provisional registration?

Now have a look at the top of the page and note how all the vaccines listed have said provisional registration?

That means the data TGA wants has been provided and reviewed. The part you're quoting does not apply to those, it applies to applications still in progress per the very first line you copied - "All COVID-19 vaccine applications are being treated with the greatest priority as part of the Department of Health's response to the pandemic."

The second part of that first paragraph outlined the process the TGA used:

"Under normal circumstances, TGA's assessment (for both provisional and general registration) begins once all information to support registration is available. For COVID-19 vaccines, the TGA has agreed to accept rolling data to enable early evaluation of data as it comes to hand."

i.e. normally the TGA demands a complete set of data at point of application. Under the current circumstances, they modified the process to allow an application to be submitted prior to all data being received. However the registration was only issued once said data was received. It just lets the TGA and the pharma company move in parallel rather than the TGA blocking progress on everything because they're waiting on one specific item.

So yes, registered vaccines are known to be safe. They are known to be effective. Details of their manufacture are known. And the TGA has all that data.

 

[briztoon]

Well to quote from the TGA website (our version of the FDA) ... COVID-19 vaccines undergoing evaluation

"All COVID-19 vaccine applications are being treated with the greatest priority as part of the Department of Health's response to the pandemic. Under normal circumstances, TGA's assessment (for both provisional and general registration) begins once all information to support registration is available. For COVID-19 vaccines, the TGA has agreed to accept rolling data to enable early evaluation of data as it comes to hand.

Many of the large-scale clinical trials that will provide evidence of safety and effectiveness are still progressing and these results will be provided to the TGA as they become available. The TGA will also evaluate quality data (such as how the vaccines are manufactured).

The TGA will only be in a position to make a provisional registration decision for a vaccine once all required data relating to safety, quality and efficacy has been provided and assessed.

With rolling submissions, collaboration with international regulators, and proactively working with sponsors, it is expected the evaluation of COVID-19 vaccines will be significantly expedited without compromising on our strict standards of safety, quality and efficacy. However, the timeframe for the evaluation of each vaccine will ultimately depend on when the complete data package is provided by sponsors. We have not yet received a full data package from any company."

So the answer to 'which part is unknown', just from that site, is 1) whether they are safe, 2) whether they are effective, 3) how they are manufactured, 4) when the companies will be providing the TGA the data to make those determinations (which at this point no company has provided) ... and not part of that quote but the long term effects are, by definition, unknown since we lack access to a functioning time machine.

So no I did not forget the icons but I will put one in here now for you!

dlanod provided a much better reply than I would have.

All I would have said is that;

1) the TGA knows how they are manufactured, as an example we are/were manufacturing AstraZeneca here after all.

2) the TGA knows what’s in them, as that’s part of the application process. It’s a requirement of any medication for the active ingredients and quantity to be listed on the label.

 

[LIONS08]

Watch them come for Crozier going down…. Far from the first time a player has had an esg put on them. Won’t be the last. It’s a common diagnostic tool! I’m not sure why the go the vax and not long term side effects from actually having covid!!!

 

[MSB ROYS]

Hopefully the final nail in the coffin for ivermectin.

 

[dlanod]

Hopefully the final nail in the coffin for ivermectin.

Haha hehe.

It's like religion at this point, you don't convince most people to change their beliefs with peer-reviewed studies unfortunately.

 

[briztoon]

 

[M Malice]

This would have been considered a "conspiracy theory" and/or "misinformation" not all that long ago, statistics can be manipulated. Listen to the whole 95 seconds... the WOW/mike drop moment for me is from around the 1 minute mark.

 

[dlanod]

This would have been considered a "conspiracy theory" and/or "misinformation" not all that long ago, statistics can be manipulated.

Huh. I thought this was common knowledge - it kicked off way back at the start of the pandemic and was documented as such by the various health authorities. The practice was adopted/recommended globally because the importance of having fast and relatively accurate data outweighed having very late and hence useless data because of the difficulty of assigning exact cause of death in a lot of cases.

The "conspiracy theory" part was the insistence by some, in the face of all evidence, that during the bad COVID outbreaks that people "dying with" COVID somehow outweighed people dying from COVID, despite other data like death rates obviously spiking above the norm. Once everyone's vaccinated and severe COVID cases reduce, the balance between the two changes significantly.

 

[M Malice]

Huh. I thought this was common knowledge - it kicked off way back at the start of the pandemic and was documented as such by the various health authorities. The practice was adopted/recommended globally because the importance of having fast and relatively accurate data outweighed having very late and hence useless data because of the difficulty of assigning exact cause of death in a lot of cases.

The "conspiracy theory" part was the insistence by some, in the face of all evidence, that during the bad COVID outbreaks that people "dying with" COVID somehow outweighed people dying from COVID, despite other data like death rates obviously spiking above the norm. Once everyone's vaccinated and severe COVID cases reduce, the balance between the two changes significantly.

You must have perceived it differently than I did, IMO there was a lot of eye rolling and derision when people bought up the possibility that the numbers could be skewed/manufactured to suit a narrative because people with multiple comorbidities were being counted as died "from Covid" when the major factor in their death could have been a previous chronic condition.

On the highlighted I agree, as with every subject the outliers on both sides of a discussion exaggerate.

BTW posting that same link to an unedited response to a question to Scomo in a presser in 2* other Covid related threads got me permanently banned from the non footy related board/threads on big footy eg. General Discussion, SRP, Media and Entertainment etc.

*Out of from what I can tell is dozens of Covid threads on big footy.... that's fine I can live without it but it screams of censorship of speech from a duly elected sitting Prime Minister and I am no fan of his or politicians in general.

 

[dlanod]

You must have perceived it differently than I did, IMO there was a lot of eye rolling and derision when people bought up the possibility that the numbers could be skewed/manufactured to suit a narrative because people with multiple comorbidities were being counted as died "from Covid" when the major factor in their death could have been a previous chronic condition.

Fully on board eye rolling and derision of claims that the numbers were skewed/manufactured to suit a narrative. There was a reason for COVID deaths to be counted that way, and globally dying from substantially outweighed dying with as could be determined by any basic analysis of death rate increases. I never saw those claiming otherwise ever providing anything other than third hand blog posts, fake numbers, and flu references.

Australia is a bit funnier because of our very low death numbers - I haven't dug into our numbers specifically but it's possible that ours were disproportionately one way or another. However I haven't seen anyone offer any actual evidence until about February this year, when state and national health authorities starting talking about a transition due to the high vaccination rates.