Bring in Tom Williams against the Tiges Petition

[dogupya]

Why is it rushing, illogical arguement!!!!

if he's fit and ready, throw him in... This lets take it easy policy is rubbish... He is far behind in his development as it is, get him out there playing and crashing into a few blokes...

I mean I can see why everybody is so cautious, because we have so many winners on the park at the moment... Who would you drop??

 

[Pupster]

Apparently he played well for Werribie, but the blokes played 20 matches of footy in his life, and been injured the last 3 years, still needs a few more weeks i think!

 

[Rocco Jones]

Why is it rushing, illogical arguement!!!!

if he's fit and ready, throw him in... This lets take it easy policy is rubbish... He is far behind in his development as it is, get him out there playing and crashing into a few blokes...

I mean I can see why everybody is so cautious, because we have so many winners on the park at the moment... Who would you drop??

Bit like chucking in an adult who can't swim straight into the deep end because he is so far in development.

Fitness isn't the only issue, we can't forget about his long term development as a player. Remember when we got him everyone was saying he really needs to learn to play the game, having only played about 15 games of footy. Since then he has played what? 6-8 games? Do we forget this because we have gotten over a bigger concern in the mean time?

 

[Wind Sock]

Why is it rushing, illogical arguement!!!!

I mean I can see why everybody is so cautious, because we have so many winners on the park at the moment... Who would you drop??

Well, some people wre suggesting bring Tom in for, guess who? Darce and Murph. You see, they are struggling at the moment coming back from long term injuries and need to go back to the 'bees for confidence.

Now, I see a slight lack of logic in that line of thinking.

 

[topdog]

i i i i i i i i i i i i i i i i i

I don't know why everyone things we are rushing him. He isn't a teenager. He has been named at werribee as among the best everything week he has played. We have lost 2 games in a row. You obviously bring in a player that has been preforming best in the reserves. Just forget that it is Williams, if he has played so well he deserves a game, full stop. I wouldn't want he in the team if he wasn't playing well for werribee, like Street last week.

 

[Captain Sensible]

Its not a knee jerk reaction after the same shit has happened 2 weeks in a row

Yes it is. It's a classic knee jerk reaction


1/ Have you seen Tom play?

2/ Do you eally want to lose to Richmond?


One of the reasons we lost on saturday night was we bought Street in for some stupid reason-How does bringing in a bloke whose going to be similiarlarly limited qualify as anything other than a knee jerk reaction.

 

[mjp]

I actually believe by playing him this week - after the senior side has had two bad losses - is setting him up to fail. He is not the saviour - yet - and coming into a side that is down on confidence will not help him.

Things are not that bad. We have lost in April to two pretty good sides (though I admit to expecting St Kilda to slip this year!). It is not time to panic - it is not time for new strategies. It is time to hold firm with what has worked over the last 18-months, and to simply play better footy.

I have no doubt there will be changes this week - taking 3 ruckman in last week simply did not make sense - but we are getting outrun at the moment and adding a young, untried kpp does not really address that.

 

[ErnieSigley]

I have no doubt there will be changes this week - taking 3 ruckman in last week simply did not make sense - but we are getting outrun at the moment and adding a young, untried kpp does not really address that.

Spot on.
Adding Tom Williams to the side will not fix our main problems from the past 2 weeks.

I'm 50/50 about it at the moment.

 

[topdog]

But I don't believe any midfielders have played well at werribee. Maybe in a couple of weeks with Hahn. I still believe it wouldn't effect him and the team if he played. It would get some hope into the supporters. Hopefully enough hope to get to about 30,000 members forget about 32,000 based on the last 2 weeks, which is unfortunate but the reality.

 

[Pigdog]

I actually believe by playing him this week - after the senior side has had two bad losses - is setting him up to fail. He is not the saviour - yet - and coming into a side that is down on confidence will not help him.

Things are not that bad. We have lost in April to two pretty good sides (though I admit to expecting St Kilda to slip this year!). It is not time to panic - it is not time for new strategies. It is time to hold firm with what has worked over the last 18-months, and to simply play better footy.

I have no doubt there will be changes this week - taking 3 ruckman in last week simply did not make sense - but we are getting outrun at the moment and adding a young, untried kpp does not really address that.

Teams have worked us out...They aren't allowing us to play the footy we want to play. Over the past 18mths we have been the best in the comp at creating a scoring opportunity from a kick in, this year teams are setting up a zone in the middle of the ground and not allowing us to move the ball quickly, this has happened in the last 2 games and we have not been able to find away around it.

Our forwardline is a disgrace, the only 2 blokes who look liked touching the ball were Higgins and Johnson, abit Power did kick 2 goals in 2 min, but did very little else. Our half forwardline is getting destroyed, Gia and Murf cant get there hands on it, we have no tall option there as Darcy and Minson are playing too deep and are not mobile enough.

We desperately need another tall in defence, if Wight and Harris cant hold Richardson and Schultz we will be in trouble, Morris and Hargrave cant play tall.. Its just a matter of time before Williams plays, this week, the week after, in 4 weeks time I dont care, they will play him when they think he is required....He will be on a hiding to nothing, but I would rather him in the team, playing a half or so, learning what it is all about than a Morris or Hargrave getting chopped up by a taller/ stronger player...

 

[G-Mo77]

I have no problem with it at all, if you swap him for Street who did nothing and who shouldn't have been picked in the first place I don't see how it could hurt us.

 

[mjp]

We desperately need another tall in defence, if Wight and Harris cant hold Richardson and Schultz we will be in trouble, Morris and Hargrave cant play tall.. Its just a matter of time before Williams plays, this week, the week after, in 4 weeks time I dont care, they will play him when they think he is required....He will be on a hiding to nothing, but I would rather him in the team, playing a half or so, learning what it is all about than a Morris or Hargrave getting chopped up by a taller/ stronger player...

Fair enough, but I bet if you were told prior to the St Kilda game that Riewoldt and Gehrig would kick only 5 goals between them, you would have taken it. I would have - yet that is what happened and the result still went badly against us.

We added another tall defender - Harris - last weekend. Adding another one is not going to help sort out the other problems you refer too. As to the other teams 'working us out', I dont buy that for a second. When we dont run, dont contest and cant hit targets, they have us worked out. When we do? Well, that remains to be seen.

 

[Captain Sensible]

When we dont run, dont contest and cant hit targets, they have us worked out. When we do? Well, that remains to be seen.

That's my take on it too. We need to go back to the things we have done well over the last two years-runnuning with the ball, spotting up targets and kicking goals from all parts of the field-and start doing them better than other teams.



Then we'll start winning again.

 

[Black Dog]

Fair enough, but I bet if you were told prior to the St Kilda game that Riewoldt and Gehrig would kick only 5 goals between them, you would have taken it. I would have - yet that is what happened and the result still went badly against us.

We added another tall defender - Harris - last weekend. Adding another one is not going to help sort out the other problems you refer too. As to the other teams 'working us out', I dont buy that for a second. When we dont run, dont contest and cant hit targets, they have us worked out. When we do? Well, that remains to be seen.

Can't agree more with MJP in the previous posts. I also think when we lose badly it isn't forward or back necessarily but through the middle. In the last two weeks Westy hasn't been as productive, Griffin and Cooney have been down, and Guido playing at half forward and in the middle has been very ineffective. These players need to lift and goals and defensive pressure will follow. Our team structure requires strong running and linking up the ground and good execution of skills from the whole team. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water with a fiercer attack at the ball and the basics like tackling, 1%ers and skills execution, the team will prosper forward and back. We need the blokes who have done the job before to regain that level not bring in players that have proven not to be up to it, or in the case of Tom, not up to it yet.

As to other teams having worked us out, why play on other teams terms? Why accept that? I have a strong faith that this team can break the shackles of hard lock down teams but to do so they're going to have to work harder than they have over the last two weeks.

 

[always right]

The thought of bringing Tom in is tempting.....but won't address our major problems, unless he can help us sort out our centre clearances......which clearly he can't.

Watching the game Saturday night, St Kilda's tactics were obvious.....flood back to prevent us having space to hit our forward targets. The best way to counter this is to get the ball in quickly. By us getting slaughtered (again) in the centre clearances it mean't the ball came forwad from our backline which consequently gave St Kilda time to get players back.

Forget all this talk about Tom Williams, McDougall etc. Talls are not our biggest problem....although they are obviously a concern. The major issue is in the middle where our blokes seem incapable of getting the ascendency. Address that problem and our forward line will be buzzing again. Easier said that done it seems.

The other big concern on Saturday was the way we were smashed in contests. St Kilda have some pretty big boys and they love beating up on our blokes. What was more disturbing though was that it wasn't just their big blokes who dominated. How many times did you see their smaller blokes outmuscle our players? Harvey, Clarke, Montagna and McQualter FFS all won contested ball against their opponents on a regular basis. That says to me there is a mental strength issue for us...not just a physical one. Time for our blokes to take a stand otherwise they will deserve the reputation of being downhill skiers.

It needs to start against Richmond, not renowned for their physical presence.

 

[Pigdog]

Our big problem I feel is our forwardline, not just cant they get there hands on there ball, but they dont do the 1%'ers that are required. They dont chase, harrass , scrap... they are playing like millionaires and are down right lazy. In the first qtr our skipper was jogging after his opponent Sam Fisher, the ball was being carried by I think Gram, instead of busting his balls to chase Fisher he took the easy option and went after the ball carrier. The ball went over this head and Fisher took the ball down the wing and the resulting play resulted in a goal to Clarke. It looked bloody ordinary and was not a good sign from our captain. Too many of our players take the easy option in these situations and this is one of the reasons why we are just an ok team. It is a culture thing and something that has too be stopped. The runner went out to johnson to have a crack at him, johnson should have been dragged, no matter how good a player he is this type of play should not be tolerated..

 

[topdog]

I believe by puting another tall in our defence will help two ways. It will freeup hargraves and morris to go into the centre more, they have the harder bodies required and it will also counter the amount of talls teams play against us.

 

[always right]

Our big problem I feel is our forwardline, not just cant they get there hands on there ball, but they dont do the 1%'ers that are required. They dont chase, harrass , scrap... they are playing like millionaires and are down right lazy. In the first qtr our skipper was jogging after his opponent Sam Fisher, the ball was being carried by I think Gram, instead of busting his balls to chase Fisher he took the easy option and went after the ball carrier. The ball went over this head and Fisher took the ball down the wing and the resulting play resulted in a goal to Clarke. It looked bloody ordinary and was not a good sign from our captain. Too many of our players take the easy option in these situations and this is one of the reasons why we are just an ok team. It is a culture thing and something that has too be stopped. The runner went out to johnson to have a crack at him, johnson should have been dragged, no matter how good a player he is this type of play should not be tolerated..

I'm reluctant to criticise a bloke who has given us so much over a long period of time.....but....I've always wondered how a bloke who seems to be able to go to another gear when he has the ball, never seems to run down an opposition player.

 

[mjp]

I'm reluctant to criticise a bloke who has given us so much over a long period of time.

Why be reluctant? The next time he puts on a block will be the first time he does it. Johnno is a tremendous asset to the team, but he is not perfect, and I dont think anyone expects him to be.

The biggest weakness in his game is that he goes a lot harder when he thinks he is a chance to get the ball - when a hard chase with little hope of success or simple team act is needed, he doesn't commit to the same degree.

 

[Pigdog]

I'm reluctant to criticise a bloke who has given us so much over a long period of time.....but....I've always wondered how a bloke who seems to be able to go to another gear when he has the ball, never seems to run down an opposition player.

Why not.. He is our best and probably highest paid player. He is captain of our club..... He sets the example, everyone else follows.. Its bloody simple, if he bludges why shouldn't everyone else..

 

[always right]

I think if you read my post correctly you'll find we're actually in agreement.

 

[Pigdog]

I think if you read my post correctly you'll find we're actually in agreement.

I know we are...you are just reluctant to criticise him, I am not, anyone in a Bulldogs jumper is fair game, when they are in our "leadership group" it makes it easier as they are there to set the example for our young players...

 

[always right]

I know we are...you are just reluctant to criticise him, I am not, anyone in a Bulldogs jumper is fair game, when they are in our "leadership group" it makes it easier as they are there to set the example for our young players...

Conceded My opening line was more of a throwaway.....simply recognising that the guy has a few credits in the bank, something others in the team don't have.

 

[Butane]

Can a Mod please move this thread to the Geelong Board. In the sub-fourm 'over hype a new recruit board'

 

[stefoid]

no

(and no again because the editor wont let me post a two character reply)