List Mgmt. 2025 List Management 📃

[TENACIOUS]

This is a negotiation where I feel all parties should be comfortable in walking away.

The money St Kilda are offering is ridiculous for someone who has done as little as TDK has. It is absolutely in his best financial interests to take every cent of it.

Same as the money for Harley Reid, kids done SFA.

Now days.. Player wage demands are insane and the salary cap isn’t growing enough to meet them..

Then you get list like ours where there is a huge gulf in talent between the top and bottom players.

 

[Prem17]

Same as the money for Harley Reid, kids done SFA.

Now days.. Player wage demands are insane and the salary cap isn’t growing enough to meet them..

Then you get list like ours where there is a huge gulf in talent between the top and bottom players.

Agree but also yeah and no on the last point.
I think that part of the problem has been the inability of this squad to maintain intensity over any given period, eg '23.
Then you add injuries like last year and it all goes to shit.
The coaching panel and mc should wear a lot of the blame for the fade outs because their hasn't been a good level of selection integrity.
McGovern and Williams have been woeful in the first 4 rounds. 'Gov was better yesterday.
We were just lucky that Carroll showed that he was up to the level.
In previous years senior players haven't been dropped for poor form. When players do get an opportunity through injury the expectation levels are through the roof, partly because they are thrown in only after everything reaches disaster point, as Carroll was.
This time it turned out well but others have been let down by the system, Binns exhibit A.

 

[blues4flag]

Agree but also yeah and no on the last point.
I think that part of the problem has been the inability of this squad to maintain intensity over any given period, eg '23.
Then you add injuries like last year and it all goes to shit.
The coaching panel and mc should wear a lot of the blame for the fade outs because their hasn't been a good level of selection integrity.
McGovern and Williams have been woeful in the first 4 rounds. 'Gov was better yesterday.
We were just lucky that Carroll showed that he was up to the level.
In previous years senior players haven't been dropped for poor form. When players do get an opportunity through injury the expectation levels are through the roof, partly because they are thrown in only after everything reaches disaster point, as Carroll was.
This time it turned out well but others have been let down by the system, Binns exhibit A.

Carroll hasn't been available for selection. Voss made it clear in the presser that they've been keen on getting him into the side.

Binns is a very different proposition. Clearly the MC have strong doubts on whether his game translates to AFL level. In contrast to Hollands, Cowan, Lord and now Carroll, who all possess AFL attributes in spades.

 

[BrianSetzer]

Cain Ackland, Robbie Warnock, Marc Pittonet....

And we let Sam Jacobs go

 

[Aphrodite]

Sainter88 QUIT the react trolling!

 

[Beyond Blue]

Wasn't Austin that chose Frank. It was a combination of the coaches (Voss) and Agresta.

Austin ticked it off but really it should be on the recruiting manager this one.

Austin is the list manager so ultimately its his decision.

 

[FitzroyBlueBagger]

Back in the day, played with many good trainers that did nothing on match day.
We have fallen for this trap (Evans), Dustin Fletcher would be classed as a terrible trainer yet played 400 AFL games was an absolute gun.
It's a tough call and one I would not like to be making but, going for two small forwards (Evans White) looks a bad move for list balance. Having 6 small forwards to pick from while essentially having Young as tall back up with the next best in development, is questionable.

Back in the day, played with many good trainers that did nothing on match day.
We have fallen for this trap (Evans), Dustin Fletcher would be classed as a terrible trainer yet played 400 AFL games was an absolute gun.
It's a tough call and one I would not like to be making but, going for two small forwards (Evans White) looks a bad move for list balance. Having 6 small forwards to pick from while essentially having Young as tall back up with the next best in development, is questionable.

Evan’s was not the right choice, we don’t have a great overall record SSP/MSD when it comes down to identifying players with the required skill sets…

 

[tarczonandjane]

Evans has to have been selected to play a style of game which was shown up in the early weeks of the season. If our intention is now to somewhat evolve away from that type of footy, then I must admit to feeling sad for him as a human being. Because it will be a long season in the reserves.

 

[Soapy V]

Evan’s was not the right choice, we don’t have a great overall record SSP/MSD when it comes down to identifying players with the required skill sets…

Re: Evans

During pre season he was solid but never stood out for me. His selection surprised me and as I said at the time there must be a reason

What I do remember is he had some runs in match sims across HB and looked quite good. His ball use is actually very good. He is a lovely kick of the ball. With White etc I wonder whether we should try this as we have him all year as IMO he isn’t a small fwd

 

[FitzroyBlueBagger]

Agree on both points.
Common sense says that a player that has played only 3 games per year can't demand a huge salary, or obtain a high pick for his club but unfortunately common sense is an extremely rare commodity.

If he plays very little senior football by the end of the season, you couldn’t rationalize him anywhere a first round pick…
But that said, having multiple clubs wanting his services, competition will be competitive, driving up his value based on what a club is willing to offer him and compensate GWS accordingly..

 

[tarczonandjane]

Re: Evans

During pre season he was solid but never stood out for me. His selection surprised me and as I said at the time there must be a reason

What I do remember is he had some runs in match sims across HB and looked quite good. His ball use is actually very good. He is a lovely kick of the ball. With White etc I wonder whether we should try this as we have him all year as IMO he isn’t a small fwd

That’s an interesting insight, Soapy. I had no idea.

It all gets back to my view that while we don’t have the list to play Hawthorn-style football, I am sure we can make some changes to make improvements to our run and kicking.

 

[Soapy V]

That’s an interesting insight, Soapy. I had no idea.

It all gets back to my view that while we don’t have the list to play Hawthorn-style football, I am sure we can make some changes to make improvements to our run and kicking.

Fair point.

Can we play like Hawthorn? Not exactly but we can run and use the ball

IMO it looks like we have adjusted over last few weeks to try and run and spread more

My criticism is we haven’t adjusted early enough or drilled this. We wasted a pre season and we don’t do the basics well

I still believe we have a list to be a lot better than we are

 

[tarczonandjane]

Fair point.

Can we play like Hawthorn? Not exactly but we can run and use the ball

IMO it looks like we have adjusted over last few weeks to try and run and spread more

My criticism is we haven’t adjusted early enough or drilled this. We wasted a pre season and we don’t do the basics well

I still believe we have a list to be a lot better than we are

How much do you think our off-season planning was relying on Jagga to bring the run and spread? Were all eggs in his basket? Or was there no effort to build run and spread at all?

 

[Wickzki]

Austin is the list manager so ultimately its his decision.

It's not that simple.

It's a collaborative effort

When you have the recruiting manager (who's primary responsibility is to build for the long-term success of the club) AND the coaches (most often short sighted) in agreement you take that advice otherwise what's the point of having a recruiting manager.

This is part of why I believe Austin is the least of three evils when it comes to footy department head, recruiting manager and list manager at Carlton

 

[Wickzki]

Evans has to have been selected to play a style of game which was shown up in the early weeks of the season. If our intention is now to somewhat evolve away from that type of footy, then I must admit to feeling sad for him as a human being. Because it will be a long season in the reserves.

Frank's alright. Had we not signed him he would've been playing for our reserves without an AFL lifeline. He's got an upgraded season than where he thought he'd be after he got delisted.

Now he's getting paid SSP money and has a chance to be a depth player. The downside for him is that we used our other SSP slot on another small forward and he's showing something worth developing.

 

[Soapy V]

How much do you think our off-season planning was relying on Jagga to bring the run and spread? Were all eggs in his basket? Or was there no effort to build run and spread at all?

He trained all pre season in middle and he would have helped but wouldn’t have changed structure

Every pre season training session was the same. Contest and defence. It was the focus

Coaches used to say win the ball and then run. Issue for me is it was simplistic and never drilled or structured and all the they did was bomb it long. IMO because of this, under any pressure we struggle

Just my take

 

[The Return of the Paf]

You've misread that mate. It's:

"Carlton has to plan for a Cripps-less list and also build midfield capability."

It was still advocating for a 'whatever it takes' raid for Reid - no wonder I was confused. Those kinds of acquisitions always backfire on us... not only because we are putting too much trade capital into just one player but also because it gives us a distorted view of how we should proceed with other list changes.

Trying to win one for Judd/Cripps/'?' has crept into our culture and has made us zigg when we should zagg, and vise versa.

 

[TENACIOUS]

With Carroll seemingly filling a missing void at HB, with pace and foot skills.

Hopefully it allows us to push Moo into the midfield, when he’s back. Where he’ll give us a point of difference, aggression, pace and foot skills.

 

[Soapy V]

With Carroll seemingly filling a missing void at HB, with pace and foot skills.

Hopefully it allows us to push Moo into the midfield, when he’s back. Where he’ll give us a point of difference, aggression, pace and foot skills.

Welcome aboard

 

[Red Bull]

Evan’s was not the right choice, we don’t have a great overall record SSP/MSD when it comes down to identifying players with the required skill sets…

Frank taken in the SSP

Isaiah Dudley taken in the SSP

One has some serious wheels … the other must have some serious photos.
What are our scouts watching …

 

[Just Kreuzing]

Frank taken in the SSP

Isaiah Dudley taken in the SSP

One has some serious wheels … the other must have some serious photos.
What are our scouts watching …

Obviously the photos…….

 

[kreuze_missile]

Same as the money for Harley Reid, kids done SFA.

Yep, he’s about to get superstar money and contract that necessitates he is a perennial All Australian to justify it.

Paying a huge premium for potential is straight up gambling. Fools game.

 

[GT619]

When did I blame Kemp?

by not taking mcmahon because kemp copped a long term injury

 

[swuzzlebubble]

What's the plan for MSD then?
We'll surely take a key forward .

 

[sweethoney]

TDK looks to have paused talks on his contract. Has a big decision to make. It’s notn looking good for us I am afraid.

Hopefully he’s watching fox footy atm