Review Who stays, and who goes?

[Land of the Giants]

The end of a disappointing season.

It was always going to be a tough start with Toby's suspension. It didn't take long for the wheels to fall off.

There's going to be a big shake-up across the club, so who stays, and who goes?

XOH, Sproule, Hill and Brander are probably the most obvious for delisting..Maybe one or two of the bigger names who've been round for a while, such as Hopper, Tarsnto,, maybe Whitfield, while they're tradable.

Perhaps Flynn, Ash or Bruhn?

Is it time for Watd to retire?

Thoughts?

 

[PaythePerryman]

The end of a disappointing season.

It was always going to be a tough start with Toby's suspension. It didn't take long for the wheels to fall off.

There's going to be a big shake-up across the club, so who stays, and who goes?

XOH, Sproule, Hill and Brander are probably the most obvious for delisting..Maybe one or two of the bigger names who've been round for a while, such as Hopper, Tarsnto,, maybe Whitfield, while they're tradable.

Perhaps Flynn, Ash or Bruhn?

Is it time for Watd to retire?

Thoughts?

While XO has been pretty bad....if we can get him to kick anywhere near a target he will be a good depth player. Certainly not the type that other clubs will come hard for as he lacks polish.
Keep Sproule. Not bothered with Brander.

Ward has been good I think, and we need true leadership. It's time for that next gen of leaders to come through. Perryman needs to become a leader. So does Green.

Taranto is probably out...even though he wants to stay...(the only way we keep all our best players is by Cogs/whit/Kelly taking a haircut. I can see Kelly doing it. But not Cogs or Whitfield).

As far as trades....I HATE to say it...but Haynes off to the Saints of Dogs could be an option to get off some cash in an area where we are pretty well covered. HH, Aleer and Cumming.

Ash and Whitfield are the players we need to demand more from..both drafted as elite kicks and runners. Ash should be so much further along than he is. Maybe with more room in the midfield he can settle into a position. He's played back/forward/tag/wing. New coach needs to figure out what he 'is'.

Keep Hopper for at least another year. He's a jet and I've always considered him to be the next captain.

Thank f#$k for Sam Taylor.

2023

 

[Hendo_21]

While XO has been pretty bad....if we can get him to kick anywhere near a target he will be a good depth player. Certainly not the type that other clubs will come hard for as he lacks polish.
Keep Sproule. Not bothered with Brander.

Ward has been good I think, and we need true leadership. It's time for that next gen of leaders to come through. Perryman needs to become a leader. So does Green.

Taranto is probably out...even though he wants to stay...(the only way we keep all our best players is by Cogs/whit/Kelly taking a haircut. I can see Kelly doing it. But not Cogs or Whitfield).

As far as trades....I HATE to say it...but Haynes off to the Saints of Dogs could be an option to get off some cash in an area where we are pretty well covered. HH, Aleer and Cumming.

Ash and Whitfield are the players we need to demand more from..both drafted as elite kicks and runners. Ash should be so much further along than he is. Maybe with more room in the midfield he can settle into a position. He's played back/forward/tag/wing. New coach needs to figure out what he 'is'.

Keep Hopper for at least another year. He's a jet and I've always considered him to be the next captain.

Thank f#$k for Sam Taylor.

2023

Happy to keep XO, he's fine depth and with less inside mids he might get a spot in there if we get some injuries in there, Hill gets traded for probably peanuts, Stein can leave, not too fussed with Brander either way

Taranto and Hopper both gone I'd imagine, should be able to get a first and a second for each of them. If Cerra gets traded for 6 last year, both of our guys although slightly older (but not old by any stretch) are much more established and shown can be top of the rotation midfield players. Hope Briggs stays tbh been pretty impressed with him but think he looks to find opportunity elsewhere and we only have ourselves to blame for that. Ward goes again I rekon, would think Phil retires, don't know Keefe's contract situation but would be fine to get rid of him (maybe can't get rid of Keefe and Stein but if it comes down to it would keep Stein). Not trading Whitfield at all, he's exactly the type of players we don't have enough of. Think we'll get a high second for Bruhn, depending on the team maybe a back end first but think that's unlikely. Would be fine letting Haynes go as well, but his contract might make that pretty difficult. Ash really hurt us today up forward had two really good chances to put some points on the board and just couldn't, would really like to see him settle down back, hopefully Yze sees it the same way. Should be walking into the draft with 5 or 6 picks in the top 30, great opportunity to add premium talent and reshape this list.

 

[PaythePerryman]

Happy to keep XO, he's fine depth and with less inside mids he might get a spot in there if we get some injuries in there, Hill gets traded for probably peanuts, Stein can leave, not too fussed with Brander either way

Taranto and Hopper both gone I'd imagine, should be able to get a first and a second for each of them. If Cerra gets traded for 6 last year, both of our guys although slightly older (but not old by any stretch) are much more established and shown can be top of the rotation midfield players. Hope Briggs stays tbh been pretty impressed with him but think he looks to find opportunity elsewhere and we only have ourselves to blame for that. Ward goes again I rekon, would think Phil retires, don't know Keefe's contract situation but would be fine to get rid of him (maybe can't get rid of Keefe and Stein but if it comes down to it would keep Stein). Not trading Whitfield at all, he's exactly the type of players we don't have enough of. Think we'll get a high second for Bruhn, depending on the team maybe a back end first but think that's unlikely. Would be fine letting Haynes go as well, but his contract might make that pretty difficult. Ash really hurt us today up forward had two really good chances to put some points on the board and just couldn't, would really like to see him settle down back, hopefully Yze sees it the same way. Should be walking into the draft with 5 or 6 picks in the top 30, great opportunity to add premium talent and reshape this list.

You'd think we could get Geelong's first for Tanner.
But that leaves nothing for Hopper...I say hold him with the hope to re-sign...but if he has to be moved on we can look at next year's crop of free agents.
Hopper is too good to lose right now.
Davis is a tricky one. We clearly extended his contract to spread out salary cap out...so it's kinda unfair for him to leave money on the table.

 

[Giant Pete]

You'd think we could get Geelong's first for Tanner.
But that leaves nothing for Hopper...I say hold him with the hope to re-sign...but if he has to be moved on we can look at next year's crop of free agents.
Hopper is too good to lose right now.
Davis is a tricky one. We clearly extended his contract to spread out salary cap out...so it's kinda unfair for him to leave money on the table.

I’d give Davis a really long break to heal. We wouldn’t need him for the first part of the season. Let him try and get his hankies right. If he can do that he can come in in the second half of the season if required.

 

[Hendo_21]

You'd think we could get Geelong's first for Tanner.
But that leaves nothing for Hopper...I say hold him with the hope to re-sign...but if he has to be moved on we can look at next year's crop of free agents.
Hopper is too good to lose right now.
Davis is a tricky one. We clearly extended his contract to spread out salary cap out...so it's kinda unfair for him to leave money on the table.

Not sure we will get the first from Geelong tbh, really hope we do and he'd for sure be worth it but just think it's unlikely that's if he even picks Geelong, if they end up getting Hopper then they probably won't get Bruhn as well. Would be good if we can get another year out of Hopper before he leaves but if he's going to leave anyway it might be best to trade him now while he still has a year left on his contract at a cheaper rate which will be valuable to other teams. Unless you think he's in for a career year (pretty reasonable) where he increases his trade value meaningfully enough to make it worth holding a player that doesn't want to be here to his contract.

 

[Giant Strides]

This will be pretty similar to my post in the list management thread:

Out of contract players:

Hill - early highlights had us excited, but really hasn't come on; doesn't impact games enough either offensively or defensively
Bruhn - still young and needs time to develop, but if he wants to go home, we need to find a replacement who doesn't compete with our other inside mids
O'Halloran - presumably will ask for a trade since he hasn't re-signed; lacks good disposal skills and composure at times, but we'll need to replace his zip
Taranto - the heartbreaking aspect is that he seemingly wanted to stay in Sydney, but I do agree that we've got too many slow, inside mids and at times TT's disposal is counterproductive
Briggs - as seen these last two weeks, he isn't ready to be solo ruck, but I think he's good in combination with Preuss or Flynn; so hopefully a new coach will tell him that he's willing to play him as third forward/second ruck and he'll stay for another contract
Brander - delist; he's not a KPF, and his kicking is not precise enough nor his composure; he gets plenty of disposals in VFL but doesn't work in AFL
Davis - I'm really not sure, as I'd need to understand the medical prognosis on his body; he's been a warrior for us, and his best is still OK with his leadership in the backline an important factor. If he wants to play on, it's probably a case of one last year
Keeffe - has been a willing worker and better than I thought in plugging backline gaps in past years, but now getting slower and less agile; if Davis stays another year we should delist him
Stein - behind Keeffe this year whereas I would have him ahead; looked good in defence this week with his mobility a positive, so I'd keep him
Lloyd - he's slowing down, and should be overtaken by guys like Conor Stone, but his experience and long range kicking should get him another year
Sproule - thought he was solid last year, but went backwards this year so I'm in two minds; on one hand I'd be happy to delist him and try someone else, but on the other hand that would leave us just Hogan, Riccardi, Derksen from the MSD, hopefully a draftee and a replacement for Zach, which I think would be unsound
Shaw - doesn't inspire me, but he's just a Cat B rookie so happy to keep him for one more year

Others:
Hopper - I do wonder how real his desire to leave is because the media has a habit of beating up GWS departures; given that he's from NSW and there's no 'go home factor' and he's contracted for another year, I'd definitely be playing hardball with Geelong if they tried to steal him (pick #18, which will go backwards to #20 at least is certainly nowhere near enough IMHO
Brown - I believe he needs to come off the Category B Rookie list, which will reduce the number of list positions available

So, currently we have 45 players: 36 main list, 7 Rookie A (extra one is Derksen from MSD while Fahey was LTI), 2 Rookie B.

Off: 7 (de Boer, Hill, Bruhn, O'Halloran, Taranto, Brander, Keeffe)
Brown comes off the Cat B and onto the main list. If we don't delist Sproule, Stein or Lloyd then someone (such as Peatling) gets upgraded from Cat A to main list.

Before draft: 31 main list (36 - 7 + 2), 6 rookie A, 1 rookie B

Draft capital: 3, 21, 39, + Taranto trade, Bruhn trade, minimal from Hill & XOH trades, 57, 59 with 5 spots open/picks taken to draft

If we wanted to cut harder, then add Stein, Sproule & Lloyd to the delisted group, giving us 7 main list spots, 1 rookie A & 1 rookie B.

 

[Dr Giant]

Firstly don’t let Hopper go. TT I think will be a sad loss, I will cheer for him where ever he goes….unlike Cameron grrr. Hill and Bruhn trades will get us something. Brander big disappointment. Those who think Ward should move in take a cold shower he is a club legend, same with Davis. Haynes is an interesting one, maybe move him on to another club and pay part of his salary. Would like to see what Fahey can offer and I am a huge fan of Connor Stone, just needs some luck. Keep all the rucks, never know when one gets a knee injury (Pruess needs the riot act read to him)

On the coaching front, assistants need to be moved. Keep Mummy and maybe Steve J. Ask Rutten if he wants an senior assistant role, pay him a little more, he probably would love to get out of Essendon and that chess pit. Hopefully with either Yze or Kingsley they put the support in place.

A very disappointing year

 

[Rioli2Rioli]

Would like to see what Fahey can offer and I am a huge fan of Connor Stone, just needs some luck. Keep all the rucks, never know when one gets a knee injury (Pruess needs the riot act read to him)

That bloke has stolen a Career as an AFL footballer
7 years for 28 games and probably earned $3 mil over 3 clubs.

sooner you guys get rid of him the better imo

 

[Hendo_21]

Sam Edmund’s mega trade update on Taranto, Jackson, Gunston, Rioli and more

“They are definitely interested.”

www.sen.com.au

Ian ‘Bobby’ Hill (GWS)

“‘Bobby’ Hill is likely to be there (Collingwood) with him as well.”

Tim Taranto (GWS)

“Tim Taranto

14

Tim Taranto

Age

26

Ht

188cm

Wt

87kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

22.3

5star

K

12.8

5star

HB

9.5

5star

M

3.6

4star

T

5.6

5star

CL

4.1

5star

D

17.0

4star

K

12.0

5star

HB

5.0

3star

M

1.5

2star

T

3.0

4star

CL

5.5

5star

D

15.6

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

8.0

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

4.0

5star

CL

2.2

4star

is on the radar at Collingwood as he is at Richmond.

“He’s set to make a decision on his future by the end of the week. GWS doing their exit interviews at the moment.

“He will meet Adam Kingsley

Adam Kingsley

Age

48

Ht

183cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.9

4star

K

11.5

4star

HB

5.4

4star

M

4.1

4star

T

1.3

3star

No current season stats available

D

16.4

4star

K

10.4

4star

HB

6.0

4star

M

3.0

3star

T

1.0

3star

. He was determined to meet whoever the new coach was going to be out of respect.

“If we’re talking about Taranto, Hopper, Hill, Bruhn – they’ve really dug in, GWS, on keeping Taranto.

“They’ve had a two-year offer and a four-year contract offer on the table for him since mid-year.

“He’s the one that GWS want to keep. Whether he reciprocates that enthusiasm remains to be seen.”

Jacob Hopper (GWS)

“Targeted a long way out by Geelong.

“I think the Cats offer maybe a first-rounder for him and it’s done.

“Hopper’s 26 in February, he does have a year to run on that contract, but I think he’s the one the Cats are absolutely after.”


Probably not going to get much for Hill. but man if a late first from Geelong is all you can get then you have to hold him to deal his deal. Going to get at least that next year in compensation for him if he walks. Also interesting Taranto is the one they're keen on most keeping, his versatility probably a big factor in that I'd imagine, although more of a forward in theory and not really practice just yet.

 

[Colonial]

One of Taranto or Hopper has to go or else Green is definitely gone. Would pick Hopper because he is a "Local" if both want to be at the club.

BUT if Hopper is looking at running away as per rumours and Taranto wants to stay. Then stick with the Bull.

 

[Colonial]

Gone
Hopper or Taranto or unfortunately both.
Hill
Bruhn
Briggs
MDB
Keefe
Riccardi(does anyone want him? If not he will stay)
Stein
Shaw
Brander (glad we didnt waste anything on him)
Fleeton
Sproule

Stay
Greene
Green
Cogs
Kelly
Davis (Gets another year)
Whitfield
Ash
Ward
Ash
Preuss
Cumming
Taylor
Daniels
Haynes
Aleer
Peatling
Hogan
Himmelberg
Idun
Kennedy
Brown
Buckley
Derksen
Hamilton
LLoyd
Perryman
Fahey
O'Halloran
Flynn

Think we are in for a big trade and draft period.

 

[Hendo_21]

Gone
Hopper or Taranto or unfortunately both.
Hill
Bruhn
Briggs
MDB
Keefe
Riccardi(does anyone want him? If not he will stay)
Stein
Shaw
Brander (glad we didnt waste anything on him)
Fleeton
Sproule

Stay
Greene
Green
Cogs
Kelly
Davis (Gets another year)
Whitfield
Ash
Ward
Ash
Preuss
Cumming
Taylor
Daniels
Haynes
Aleer
Peatling
Hogan
Himmelberg
Idun
Kennedy
Brown
Buckley
Derksen
Hamilton
LLoyd
Perryman
Fahey
O'Halloran
Flynn

Think we are in for a big trade and draft period.

Why are we trading Riccardi? He's not dominant by any means but I always think he plays pretty well when he gets a chance, not someone I'd be looking to move on by any means, especially considering our issues up forward with KPF and Hogans durability, he's fine to keep around.

 

[Colonial]

Why are we trading Riccardi? He's not dominant by any means but I always think he plays pretty well when he gets a chance, not someone I'd be looking to move on by any means, especially considering our issues up forward with KPF and Hogans durability, he's fine to keep around.

He is a waste of a spot. Would rather a young kid drafted in for opportunity. He has had his.

 

[Andre the Giant]

Gone
Hopper or Taranto or unfortunately both.
Hill
Bruhn
Briggs
MDB
Keefe
Riccardi(does anyone want him? If not he will stay)
Stein
Shaw
Brander (glad we didnt waste anything on him)
Fleeton
Sproule

Stay
Greene
Green
Cogs
Kelly
Davis (Gets another year)
Whitfield
Ash
Ward
Ash
Preuss
Cumming
Taylor
Daniels
Haynes
Aleer
Peatling
Hogan
Himmelberg
Idun
Kennedy
Brown
Buckley
Derksen
Hamilton
LLoyd
Perryman
Fahey
O'Halloran
Flynn

Think we are in for a big trade and draft period.

FMD did Callaghan and Stone die and we find a twin for Ash?

 

[Colonial]

FMD did Callaghan and Stone die and we find a twin for Ash?

Id rather not.

Nope I wrote Ash twice and Callaghan and Stone were missed.

Obviously Callaghan & Stone stays.

 

[Danny88]

He is a waste of a spot. Would rather a young kid drafted in for opportunity. He has had his.

He has his deficiencies no doubt. But he is a 22 year old Key forward. He has played 29 games. I don't know that 29 games (some of which were down back and on a wing) constitutes an opportunity yet.

For me- the jury is still out. I think he could still be a good player for us

 

[WeedsMullet84]

Sorry for intrusion.

Media keep banging on about GWS needing to do a salary cap 'dump', but all the players they're referencing, aside from Hopper, are out of contract.

Sure trading players like Hopper and Taranto will take some of the pressure off, but it's not a salary cap dump, per se.

Is there anyone currently under contract, on fairly decent coin, that might be put on the trade table to bring down the salary cap issue, as opposed to not just adding to it? I understand some of the GWS contracts are back-ended, which makes the situation a bit more difficult.

 

[Hendo_21]

Sorry for intrusion.

Media keep banging on about GWS needing to do a salary cap 'dump', but all the players they're referencing, aside from Hopper, are out of contract.

Sure trading players like Hopper and Taranto will take some of the pressure off, but it's not a salary cap dump, per se.

Is there anyone currently under contract, on fairly decent coin, that might be put on the trade table to bring down the salary cap issue, as opposed to not just adding to it? I understand some of the GWS contracts are back-ended, which makes the situation a bit more difficult.

Nick Haynes fits that bill but a trade might be pretty difficult to organise for him, still think he has a few years left of being a high quality player who's shown to be quite durable but his back ended contract may worry off some teams. Seems like Hopper is on the way out which should free up some cap apart from that unless there's a surprise I don't think anyone under contract is going to look elsewhere.

 

[BarryAglett]

Sorry for intrusion.

Media keep banging on about GWS needing to do a salary cap 'dump', but all the players they're referencing, aside from Hopper, are out of contract.

Sure trading players like Hopper and Taranto will take some of the pressure off, but it's not a salary cap dump, per se.

Is there anyone currently under contract, on fairly decent coin, that might be put on the trade table to bring down the salary cap issue, as opposed to not just adding to it? I understand some of the GWS contracts are back-ended, which makes the situation a bit more difficult.

I would say you are correct that a 'dump' is not accurate.
The issue would be to make sure we have enough cap space to pay for the bracket of rising players.
Tom Green, Taylor (fresh off AA year), Cumming and Callaghan, will get pay rises and are all required.

We hear names like Whitfield and Haynes tossed around, but it seems unlikely.
But we don't know what the new coach has in mind for the list.

 

[WeedsMullet84]

I would say you are correct that a 'dump' is not accurate.
The issue would be to make sure we have enough cap space to pay for the bracket of rising players.
Tom Green, Taylor (fresh off AA year), Cumming and Callaghan, will get pay rises and are all required.

We hear names like Whitfield and Haynes tossed around, but it seems unlikely.
But we don't know what the new coach has in mind for the list.

How bad is Whitfield's injury? Surely GWS would look at a similar situation to Tom Scully if his injuries are bad enough?

At least it gets him off the books.

 

[Hendo_21]

How bad is Whitfield's injury? Surely GWS would look at a similar situation to Tom Scully if his injuries are bad enough?

At least it gets him off the books.

Bad enough to the point where I'm pretty sure he's going to be getting surgery, certainly not someone I'd be willing to part ways with but I know others on this board feel different. He had some pretty strong performances down the stretch compared to the shell of himself that he was earlier in the year.

 

[Orange Agent]

Sorry for intrusion.

Media keep banging on about GWS needing to do a salary cap 'dump', but all the players they're referencing, aside from Hopper, are out of contract.

Sure trading players like Hopper and Taranto will take some of the pressure off, but it's not a salary cap dump, per se.

Is there anyone currently under contract, on fairly decent coin, that might be put on the trade table to bring down the salary cap issue, as opposed to not just adding to it? I understand some of the GWS contracts are back-ended, which makes the situation a bit more difficult.

Given retention issues I think the guys under contract that are invested in the club and want to be in Sydney are very unlikely to be shopped around. If there are players under contract that are wanting to return to home states, in the past MacCarthy and Hill would be the only ones in this situation who have been denied but other factors were at play, the club has always respected the players wishes. I could never see us doing what Hawthorn did last year and basically asked for bids for nearly anybody on the list.

 

[Giant Pete]

Gone
Hopper or Taranto or unfortunately both.
Hill
Bruhn
Briggs
MDB
Keefe
Riccardi(does anyone want him? If not he will stay)
Stein
Shaw
Brander (glad we didnt waste anything on him)
Fleeton
Sproule

Stay
Greene
Green
Cogs
Kelly
Davis (Gets another year)
Whitfield
Ash
Ward
Ash
Preuss
Cumming
Taylor
Daniels
Haynes
Aleer
Peatling
Hogan
Himmelberg
Idun
Kennedy
Brown
Buckley
Derksen
Hamilton
LLoyd
Perryman
Fahey
O'Halloran
Flynn

Think we are in for a big trade and draft period.

Just getting rid of a lazy dozen???

 

[Colonial]

Just getting rid of a lazy dozen???

**** it why not?