Possible new Division EDFL

[saint leo]

As you said, Leo, you guys have had a good run. All things considered, you guys did very well considering the location of Nyora. Had a good crop come through together and with a few top-ups were nigh on unstoppable.

Sadly, those days are getting harder to come by as players come out of juniors and move to the city for work, etc.

I still dont think the promotion/relegation system can work to be honest. NNS may have a good year or two and win a flag, that means they would have to go up into a division 1 and almost scare half their players away due to extra travelling distances etc., only to face a club that has access to their pick of almost 5000 footballers (of any ability) within a 20km range. Pretty tough gig to go up a level, I reckon.

Anyway. My nose has roses to smell!

I just think the advantage of relegation/promotion is that clubs can only really have 1-2 years of pain before they are relegated if they are struggling. Instead of regions where it can be years. The middle clubs like LL, Catani, Bunyip and KWR are the clubs which location wise should be in a higher division but realistacally at this stage probably should be lower.

Yeah we were lucky we had about 8 kids that were all born and bred nyora about 19-23 years old, then about another 8 guns that had family connections to the club. Chuck in a good coach and Rory Gilliatte just rolling up asking for a game and it was a good few years.

 

[Surkin]

I've got to disagree with all this.

Koo Wee Rup have a town of over 3000 people to draw on and is only 10 minutes from Pakenham. By your thinking they should be the powerhouse of the EDFL.

Catani on the other hand have a town of 20 people and is an extra 10 minutes from Pakenham. Why on earth would anyone want to play there? Fact is Catani is fantastically run club. As a result they are able to compete with Koo Wee Rup. Same goes for Cora Lynn and Neerim Neerim South. Both clubs are well run and it shows in the results.

 

[Pluggeroo]

I dont think Koo Wee Rup has had particularly bad teams over the last decade. Not premiership worthy teams, mind you, but I dont think they were perhaps coached as well as they could have been.

Darnum interviewed a prospective coach in the off-season of 2006. He told us he wanted $15K to come to Darnum. Of course in those days we were only spending about 30,000 on players, coaches, strapping etc. He said that he had been offered $12K to go and coach Koo Wee but to come to Darnum would require $15K.

Of course with a price like that, we never really considered him at that point and ended up reappointing Adrian Carr for a 2nd year.

But this proves my point about it costing more to get players/coaches to come further. Part of the reason we lost 15 premiership players in 2010 was to do with the travel. The fellas were just sick of it all. The guys from the Prom got sick of training 1:15 away (on a good night with traffic) and the ones from Sale were sick of travelling to all parts of West Gippsland. Every time they played an away game they drove past their home ground first (already 1:20 from home) and then onto the away ground.

Tough for people travelling an hour to get to training, particularly when they drive past a dozen or more grounds on their way. The only way to get them to do it, for at least 1 season is to reward them financially. With 10 clubs inside a 30km radius around Warragul, the players just arent there. You have to go somewhere to be competitive.

Anyway....

 

[Mjrob]

We play in a country league... Travelling comes with it.

We have players coming from South Yarra, Camberwell,CBD, Phillip Island, St Kilda, Nth Melbourne, Mornington, Dromana and Langwarrin to get to training. They could all play closer to home for the same price. But they enjoy the club, people and eachother.

Everyone drives past their home footy ground or 15 other clubs to get there. It happens at every footy club.

 

[Pluggeroo]

What club are you at, Rob?

We had 3 blokes from the Seaford area and they all said the same thing. The cash was certainly still there. The travel was a problem. Matthew Olney played at Darnum for 3 seasons and in the end, wound up at Lang Lang. Reason? Closer to home. Even the money couldnt get him to come any more. Loved the club. Loved the boys he played with, just couldnt travel anymore. Dont think he is even playing at Langy anymore.

Your club gets those blokes whom can handle a little trip from the prom to your club, what hope do the eastern based clubs have? Those same players, under the same conditions, would not travel to Warragul and beyond from their homes. Again, you have to offer bigger coin to get them. Doesnt matter which way you paint it, it is infinitely more difficult to attract players from the outer suburbs to the eastern clubs than to the western clubs. The pool of players, good or bad, is far greater for those closer to the outer eastern suburbs than those around Warragul.

I'm not saying that there has to be a better league and a weaker league. More that there be 2 different leagues within the EDFL. Or two different leagues that are run by one board. Of course there will be stronger clubs and weaker clubs in each league. That's footy. But a couple of leagues of 8 with a final 5 will give clubs more of an opportunity to participate in finals. You might say you are rewarding mediocrity with a final 5 out of 8 teams, but that isnt the case. You would be rewarding the hard work the volunteers from those clubs put in. Even if it is only for a week! 5th wouldnt win a flag in an 8 team comp anyway.

 

[Surkin]

mjrob plays for Cora Lynn plugger. He works in Camberwell and lives in Beaconsfield.

Berwick, Beaconsfield, ROC, Pakenham, Cranbourne, NNG, KWR and Casey are all closer to his home than Cora Lynn. Not to mention another probably 100 clubs closer to his work. I'm sure just about all of them would be willing to pay a player of his quality the same he is getting at Cora Lynn, if not more. I know that he knocks off work at 5.30 and struggles to even make it to Cora Lynn training by the end of their session. It would be much easier for him to play at a club near his work. But he plays with his mates at Cora Lynn because thats what he enjoys doing. He plays there because Cora Lynn is a well run club and everybody is looked after.

Realistically Catani should have nobody playing for them. There is no town and it is further from the South East suburbs than NNG, KWR, CL, Bunyip, Garfield and Longwarry. So that "massive" pool of players you talk about plugger, Catani are 7th in line out of the EDFL club for those guys. Despite this Catani are in the finals year after year because they are the best run club in the league. I don't think they would ever let it get to a situation where they have no juniors like Darnum did this year.

 

[Mjrob]

What club are you at, Rob?

We had 3 blokes from the Seaford area and they all said the same thing. The cash was certainly still there. The travel was a problem. Matthew Olney played at Darnum for 3 seasons and in the end, wound up at Lang Lang. Reason? Closer to home. Even the money couldnt get him to come any more. Loved the club. Loved the boys he played with, just couldnt travel anymore. Dont think he is even playing at Langy anymore.

Your club gets those blokes whom can handle a little trip from the prom to your club, what hope do the eastern based clubs have? Those same players, under the same conditions, would not travel to Warragul and beyond from their homes. Again, you have to offer bigger coin to get them. Doesnt matter which way you paint it, it is infinitely more difficult to attract players from the outer suburbs to the eastern clubs than to the western clubs. The pool of players, good or bad, is far greater for those closer to the outer eastern suburbs than those around Warragul.

I'm not saying that there has to be a better league and a weaker league. More that there be 2 different leagues within the EDFL. Or two different leagues that are run by one board. Of course there will be stronger clubs and weaker clubs in each league. That's footy. But a couple of leagues of 8 with a final 5 will give clubs more of an opportunity to participate in finals. You might say you are rewarding mediocrity with a final 5 out of 8 teams, but that isnt the case. You would be rewarding the hard work the volunteers from those clubs put in. Even if it is only for a week! 5th wouldnt win a flag in an 8 team comp anyway.

I play at CL Plugger. Grew up playing at Rowville and lived 5 minutes from their ground. Left there as a few mates were at CL, watched the 08 and 09 GF's and also got to know alot of the guys before playing there. Left my home club for no more money, but purely the fact CL were successful, has a great culture and I trusted that why would my mates still be there after 1,2,3 seasons if they didnt love it there? I thought it would be good to give it a go for a year... This is now my 3rd season there!

I also like long walks on the beach, enjoy sunny mornings with a coffee and my favorite colour is majenta.

I dont know Olney, but a guy playing at 35whatever years of age is a bit different to compare a fresh faced recruit like Ol'Billy in your original hypothetical!!

Travel happens at every club mate!! Network and recruit the right people together with a well run footy club, then your argument about $$ and travel will seem a bit more irrelevant. Things can turn pretty quick with hard work and smart planning...I still get goosebumps and feel in debt to the blokes behind the bar when they talk about the dark days of CL and how close they were to closing the doors.

I am not discounting your point about the eastern clubs and their battles, but when you compared pakenham,narre warren, ROC etc playing against CL,KWR,NNG etc I had to laugh. Its chalk/Suburb and cheese/Small country town! Your other point about travel is partially invalid. We all travel mate, its apart of playing country footy!!

I agree anyway, the league would be better fitted with an east and west division of 10 teams in each.

 

[saint leo]

I play at CL Plugger. Grew up playing at Rowville and lived 5 minutes from their ground. Left there as a few mates were at CL, watched the 08 and 09 GF's and also got to know alot of the guys before playing there. Left my home club for no more money, but purely the fact CL were successful, has a great culture and I trusted that why would my mates still be there after 1,2,3 seasons if they didnt love it there? I thought it would be good to give it a go for a year... This is now my 3rd season there!

I also like long walks on the beach, enjoy sunny mornings with a coffee and my favorite colour is majenta.

I dont know Olney, but a guy playing at 35whatever years of age is a bit different to compare a fresh faced recruit like Ol'Billy in your original hypothetical!!

Travel happens at every club mate!! Network and recruit the right people together with a well run footy club, then your argument about $$ and travel will seem a bit more irrelevant. Things can turn pretty quick with hard work and smart planning...I still get goosebumps and feel in debt to the blokes behind the bar when they talk about the dark days of CL and how close they were to closing the doors.

I am not discounting your point about the eastern clubs and their battles, but when you compared pakenham,narre warren, ROC etc playing against CL,KWR,NNG etc I had to laugh. Its chalk/Suburb and cheese/Small country town! Your other point about travel is partially invalid. We all travel mate, its apart of playing country footy!!

I agree anyway, the league would be better fitted with an east and west division of 10 teams in each.

Rowville are fliyng again this year, looking the goods to go up to divi 1.

Money helps and its obvioulsy easier for clubs closer to pakenham to recruit players but doesnt mean its impossible for clubs further out to do it. It just means those clubs might have to be a bit smarter and save up some cash and not try to win a flag every year but build up over 3-4 years. Where as clubs like NNG, CL can have a crack at a flag every year.

The key is once you get a player you have to try and keep them as CL seem to do. Its wasted money if someone comes for 1 year on good coin then leaves. If blokes love the club and stick around they will play for less money if it means success.

 

[Mjrob]

Yeh they are! They have the best junior club/program going around. Very strong footy club and always will be with their juniors coming through! The old man coached there for 3 years a little while ago,so thats always been home for me. I still go to their functions and watch everytime we have the week off.

Do you follow that league Saint? Different style of footy to Ellinbank. Our top 5 are pretty even in our 16 team comp, but their top 7 in their 10 team comp are usually pretty even. Always close games and upsets.

 

[saint leo]

Yeh they are! They have the best junior club/program going around. Very strong footy club and always will be with their juniors coming through! The old man coached there for 3 years a little while ago,so thats always been home for me. I still go to their functions and watch everytime we have the week off.

Do you follow that league Saint? Different style of footy to Ellinbank. Our top 5 are pretty even in our 16 team comp, but their top 7 in their 10 team comp are usually pretty even. Always close games and upsets.

They should be OK then if they go upto divi 1 then? Mulgrave were a bit like Rowville, in the finals for a lot of years, finally won a flag, then they got relegated and now look like dropping again, Wantirna South did the same thing.

I have watched a bit of that footy in the last few years, mates played at Waverley and Wantirna South. Division 2 always seems to be the closest division, even the bottom teams that get relegated can beat top sides on their day.

 

[kneelo]

Culture.
Well run club
Maintained junior base

All keys points to having a succesful senior team and attracting senior players.

Yes money can help, but as i said before, you'd be amazed at how little some clubs actually pay their whole list. They actually sell the club rather than getting involved in a dutch auction.

If the club and supporters work hard to help themselves the rewards will come not like some of recent times who continue to keep their head in the sand.

Have a look at the Warrigul/Drouin area. A truck load of houses being built. A heap of new people coming into the area. Has anyone from the Eastern clubs ever thought about doing something as simple as a letter bow drop to let people know that their club exists? I guarantee the answer is no.

They need to get of their backsides and think outside the square because at the moment they are destroying the league as it is at the moment, where kids at other clubs are getting tired of playing one week and then missing 2 weeks because opposition clubs can't field teams.

2 divisions still won't work well for the already "struggling" clubs until they address these problems

 

[saint leo]

Culture.
Well run club
Maintained junior base

All keys points to having a succesful senior team and attracting senior players.

Yes money can help, but as i said before, you'd be amazed at how little some clubs actually pay their whole list. They actually sell the club rather than getting involved in a dutch auction.

If the club and supporters work hard to help themselves the rewards will come not like some of recent times who continue to keep their head in the sand.

Have a look at the Warrigul/Drouin area. A truck load of houses being built. A heap of new people coming into the area. Has anyone from the Eastern clubs ever thought about doing something as simple as a letter bow drop to let people know that their club exists? I guarantee the answer is no.

They need to get of their backsides and think outside the square because at the moment they are destroying the league as it is at the moment, where kids at other clubs are getting tired of playing one week and then missing 2 weeks because opposition clubs can't field teams.

2 divisions still won't work well for the already "struggling" clubs until they address these problems

I agree with most your points but if there are no kids around what can you do?

Lang Lang work hard to get juniors but this year they have no thirds, what else can they do? They cant go and poach kids of neighbouring towns. Its always going to happen in small towns that you will have good groups in the juniors with heaps of numbers and then bad groups where its a battle to get a team everyyear. Saying they are destroying the league is a bit harsh, they probably think NNG, CL, and Garfield are destroying the league.

I know warragul/drouin a lot of kids play soccer so there is a difference over that way.

 

[kneelo]

I agree with most your points but if there are no kids around what can you do?

Lang Lang work hard to get juniors but this year they have no thirds, what else can they do? They cant go and poach kids of neighbouring towns. Its always going to happen in small towns that you will have good groups in the juniors with heaps of numbers and then bad groups where its a battle to get a team everyyear. Saying they are destroying the league is a bit harsh,

I know warragul/drouin a lot of kids play soccer so there is a difference over that way.

You are spot on Leo with the comment "they probably think NNG, CL, and Garfield are destroying the league."
They acually do think that I'm sure. Unfortunately/fortunately the clubs are in the league we should all be thankful that clubs and supporters rock into town and chuck plenty of dough through the gate, canteen and bar/beer booth.

Where there is a perceived bad there seems to be a silver lining. I'm not really talking about Lang Lang as they do work hard for their juniors and they we will come good again, especially now that KWR and LL are starting to grow as towns. They will nurture the kids in their community and will have a good junior base.

It just irritates me when some clubs who struggle on the junior front won't accept advice or help when offered and then cry poor. It's not good enough. They are lucky they are not fined for breaking their pledge to the league.

 

[goodie]

i'm of the view that people should try and play to the best of the ability, if these "western" clubs have the ability to attract better players to our competition, i think its great, i love watching great players running around, even if it is to demise of the club i play at on field sometimes.

Upon saying that i know some of the young lads at NDFC have been quite happy with how they have played lining up some of the good senior players they have come up against and we have even had patches against these sides that suggest we are improving. now it is a matter of rebuilding the club from the ground up using these young blokes who have stuck around as a base. Surely it can only be a great thing for the comp to get stronger and surely will hold these 16-21 y.o from clubs across the league in good steed for seasons to come?

The worst thing i have seen happen is clubs have good young guys coming through be disapointed at on field success, recruit mediocre players a temporary fix only to lose another crop of youngsters because they have been treated shit.