- Feb 6, 2016
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Stocker?
List Mgmt. Our Midfield
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Stocker?
not a factor this year imo.
With Garlett, Im prepared to give him time. Has plenty of upside.It’s a great post but why do people write off players like Garlett & Fasolo so easily???
Garlett is a young footballer and learning a new role. Finally fit
Fasolo hasn’t played any consistent football for nearly 2 years. Has class and a goal kicker
Give them a chance. Amazing what fitness, experience and confidence can do
Interesting how people now rate Cuningham. Very different last year
With Fasolo, its more about what his strengths are. We already have 3 super viable marking options in charlie l, mckay and mcgovern.
We dont need more marking targets, we need crumbers, pressure players and complimentary players for our big boys. Fasolo isnt better than any of the other 3.
While this is a midfield thread I guess Fasolo and Garlett could be thrown in there at a pinch.
On Garlett ...he has the discipline I reckon. He didnt fly for marks at all when he could have. He waited back and mopped up often, Very good signs.
Fasolo will be a weapon very quickly. He has goal sense and ran hard all game after a broken wrist. Once the guys start to work with that he will come into his own.
Its going to take a little while for a new midfield to come to grips with multiple foward options. But what a luxury to have.
On Garlett ...he has the discipline I reckon. He didnt fly for marks at all when he could have. He waited back and mopped up often, Very good signs.
Fasolo will be a weapon very quickly. He has goal sense and ran hard all game after a broken wrist. Once the guys start to work with that he will come into his own.
Its going to take a little while for a new midfield to come to grips with multiple foward options. But what a luxury to have.
Big key to wins this year is getting Kennedy fit and firing. We just need that bigger body to help Cripps. I was surprised Charlie wasn't thrown in at some stage which makes me think he is carrying an injury. Setterfield is an elite talent but needs another pre season to be a big bodied influence
IMO with what we have we need another big body to step in and help Cripps. Kennedy & Jack are possibles.
When we have Cripps Ed Kennedy Dow Fisher Setterfield Stocker SPS Walsh O'Brien as options it looks awesome. I'm still hopeful on Pickett & Lang and I rate Gibbons. Another quality big body at years end would be very handy as we develop. With a Top 10 I really believe it will be on the table to land a 25 year old gun mid.
JMO
IMO with what we have we need another big body to step in and help Cripps. Kennedy & Jack are possibles.
When we have Cripps Ed Kennedy Dow Fisher Setterfield Stocker SPS Walsh O'Brien as options it looks awesome. I'm still hopeful on Pickett & Lang and I rate Gibbons. Another quality big body at years end would be very handy as we develop. With a Top 10 I really believe it will be on the table to land a 25 year old gun mid.
JMO
Liam Stocker after the bye explosive speed from stopagges aggresive and beautiful kick either side of the body.
With , O’Brien and Sam Fisher will come on later on.
All three will at skill, finesse and speed. Liam has grunt too.
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I think we somehow see marking targets as being tall players, but this shouldn't exclusively be the case.
We just need players that are capable of beating their opponent/s in the air and then on the ground, along with being capable of kicking goals.
Easier said than done of course, but have a look at just how much of a difference a Cameron made for Brisbane last night.
( I didn't see the whole game but the highlights alone, showcase what I'm saying)
We've got nothing like that.....not even close right now, although Fasolo can beat opponents in the air.
Re. Midfield.
I'm not expecting to see Stocker at all this year and especially so, if we remain relatively injury-free.
This isn't necessarily a bad thing, as I'm just as happy for what we had on the park last Thursday to be the group that's there in round 23.
Good call. No need to rush him in if he's not ready, either fitness or otherwise. He'll become a weapon for us.
Depending on what long term injuries we may sustain during the first half of the year, would love to see us pick up Sam Fisher basically as a 'freebie' in the mid season draft.
Would really further consolidate our young midfield group so we can concentrate on trading in/drafting what our list then requires at the end of the year such as another young ruckman and a running half back.
Interesting midfield image on centre wing.
Setterfield manning up on the attacking side of the ball-in.
Samo directing traffic with Walsh as defensive cover.
Fisher closing in on Cripps' tagger.
These two really work well together in close.
The play didn't pan out as the ball went out of bounds again.
But the plan was there,
Fisher blocks for Cripps.
The Captain storms through, collects the ball whilst Fish has slipped forward along the boundary to collect from his skipper.
Midfield is coming together slowly but I think we have a few complimentary pieces of the puzzle.
Setterfield manning up on the attacking side of the ball-in.
Samo directing traffic with Walsh as defensive cover.
Fisher closing in on Cripps' tagger.
These two really work well together in close.
The play didn't pan out as the ball went out of bounds again.
But the plan was there,
Fisher blocks for Cripps.
The Captain storms through, collects the ball whilst Fish has slipped forward along the boundary to collect from his skipper.
Midfield is coming together slowly but I think we have a few complimentary pieces of the puzzle.
Jabba73
Hall of Famer
Thanks Kingy, picture could use more arrows and circles.
Love these types of analytical posts. Anymore screenshots from stoppages or centre bounces you could post up?
brilliant imo. Fish and Crippa are made for each other. Equal hunger for the contest, just that Fisher is my size
so the mind is willing but the body is small.
Jabba73
Hall of Famer
My mind is small and the body unwilling.brilliant imo. Fish and Crippa are made for each other. Equal hunger for the contest, just that Fisher is my size
Might have to consider a career in politics
That's the kind of play where I'd love to see Kennedy running the heavy block line with Fisher in space to provide an option to receive the ball.
None the less, it's great seeing the way our young mids are gelling together.
Also, I had a look at our round 1 mids last year and compared the numbers to Thursday's game.
2018: Cripps 36, Ed 29, Murphy 23, Fisher 21, Mullett 16, SPS 16, Dow 11, Kennedy 4. 8 players, total disp 156, average 20, median 18.5.
2019: Cripps 32, Murphy 29, Setters 24, Walsh 24, Cuningham 22, Fisher 22, Dow 21, SPS 18. 8 players, total disp 192, average 24, median 24.
You could swap out Cuningham for Ed and it adds 3 to the total but doesn't make any notable change to average or median. Probably not fair to count Kennedy as he did his ankle in the 1st quarter, take him out and 2018 becomes 152, 22 & 21.
Either way, it's good to see our midfield has a better spread this year and hopefully without any of those low-teens output we had last year.
Dow, SPS, Cuningham all could average around the 20 mark and I reckon O'Brien could join them if he earns re-selection. Fisher, Walsh, Setters and Kennedy (if fit & re-selected...) a touch higher, maybe in the 22-25 range. Cripps should be 30, Murph high 20s and Ed will depend on role but 22-25 seems about right.
TOG numbers were worth noting too. Cripps down from 94% to 89% which is good, 94% is ******* crazy for a mid. Murph & Ed high 80s, Fish about 80%, all three similar both years. Dow up from 71% to 76% and Samo from 77% up to 86%. Cuningham 79%, Walsh 82% in his first and Setters a low 66%, although that does make his 24 disposals a little more impressive, get him up to 80% TOG and that translates to around 29/30.
It's actually not unrealistic to expect that our midfield group, even with the kids, could average 25 disposals and 80% TOG, which I'd be pretty happy with.
JustaBattler
Everyone Looks Better In Blue
- May 31, 2012
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You'd think disposal efficiency and impact should improve with experience and fitness as well.
Hard to fit them all in if fit but can easily be the most talented and deep in the league inside 2 years
Kruezer Setterfield Dow
Walsh Cripps O'Brien
Up forward Fisher & Cuningham
Then 3 of Kennedy Stocker SPS Curnow on the bench
Still hopeful on Pickett Gibbons Polson & Lang as well plus whoever we add this year.
Kruezer Setterfield Dow
Walsh Cripps O'Brien
Up forward Fisher & Cuningham
Then 3 of Kennedy Stocker SPS Curnow on the bench
Still hopeful on Pickett Gibbons Polson & Lang as well plus whoever we add this year.
Jabba73
Hall of Famer
TDK & McKay as big targets up forward. McGovern as a mobile 3rd option and Charlie playing as an X factor player loose around the forward half of the ground.
TDK & McKay as big targets up forward. McGovern as a mobile 3rd option and Charlie playing as an X factor player loose around the forward half of the ground.
And then get Willo Macreadie Marchbank & Doc back into the defence
JustaBattler
Everyone Looks Better In Blue
- May 31, 2012
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In my dreams I'd have Carlton midfield made up of big skilled units who just run through and over opposition....as the starting proposition first quarter soften 'em up - then you move the faster players in to capitalize on traumatized opposition.
As the bigger bodies develop and get fit- it will be harder for the smaller chaps - they wil have to show a fair amount of factor X.
JaB would play these 6 in the big games as starting on ball - in a year or so....
Williamson Cripps Charlie
TDK Kennedy Setterfield
Bench: SPS Dow Stocker Fisher
and the bench players will have to be high impact capable as well as able to rotate through various positions.
Probably the rugby bloke in me speaking - as well as years of watching Carlton midfield being torn to shreds by bigger opposition .
In my dreams I'd have Carlton midfield made up of big skilled units who just run through and over opposition....as the starting proposition first quarter soften 'em up - then you move the faster players in to capitalize on traumatized opposition.
As the bigger bodies develop and get fit- it will be harder for the smaller chaps - they wil have to show a fair amount of factor X.
JaB would play these 6 in the big games as starting on ball - in a year or so....
Williamson Cripps Charlie
TDK Kennedy Setterfield
Bench: SPS Dow Stocker Fisher
and the bench players will have to be high impact capable as well as able to rotate through various positions.
Probably the rugby bloke in me speaking - as well as years of watching Carlton midfield being torn to shreds by bigger opposition .
I like it. I think we need another big bodied extractor type in the middle to help Cripps. Kennedy could be it. Maybe even Jack. Setterfield is big enough and can be outside or inside. He’s that good and clean.
Stocker could play a more contested role
Dow is similar but a bit smaller. SPS the same.
The there is the run of Fisher Cuningham & O’Brien. Hopefully Pickett
I’d like to see us add a Menegola type if we can. Big body who can win the ball and go forward and kick goals. What we need and very underrated.
I’d also leave Williamson back. His poise and his left foot are a major positive back there plus with everything he has been through let him settle
All good
If we're going to exclude those older than Doc and only count current listed players, I think I'd lean towards something like this:In my dreams I'd have Carlton midfield made up of big skilled units who just run through and over opposition....as the starting proposition first quarter soften 'em up - then you move the faster players in to capitalize on traumatized opposition.
As the bigger bodies develop and get fit- it will be harder for the smaller chaps - they wil have to show a fair amount of factor X.
JaB would play these 6 in the big games as starting on ball - in a year or so....
Williamson Cripps Charlie
TDK Kennedy Setterfield
Bench: SPS Dow Stocker Fisher
and the bench players will have to be high impact capable as well as able to rotate through various positions.
Probably the rugby bloke in me speaking - as well as years of watching Carlton midfield being torn to shreds by bigger opposition .
FB: Marchbank, Macreadie/Goddard, Newman
HB: Docherty, Weitering, Williamson
FOL: De Koning, Cripps, Dow
C: Walsh, Setterfield, O'Brien
HF: Petrevski-Seton, Curnow, Fisher
FF: Cuningham, McKay, McGovern
INT: Kennedy, Stocker, Plowman, Pickett
That centre square combination is plenty big; Cripps 195, Setterfield 192, Dow 187. Setters & Dow just need to fill out a bit more which will come in time.
On either wing we've got run, ability to accumulate, a serious left peg. Walsh & O'Brien the obvious long term wingers for mine, with Walsh also moving inside at times.
Starting forward of them is Samo, Fish & DC. Pace, x-factor, a nasty step, great ball use, damaging players, and in/out mid rotations to boot.
Off the bench Kennedy can play Cripps' big-bodied physical role when he's forward or on the bench, Stocker closer to Dow's role as that burst mid. Both can also go forward. Then there's Pickett... mostly hope on my behalf there, but geez I'd love him fit and just killing it, breaking lines as an impact player off the bench, working from hbf>wing>hff.
As another rugby bloke... you never go all out on size as you get killed on the counter or outmaneuvered. It feels like the days of running two big centres and two traditional wingers are pretty much over. Even though you win a lot of metres through physical domination there's not enough versatility and you get caught out by missing certain skillsets around the park. It feels like these days the in-vogue setup involves replacing the big outside centre with a smaller, faster bloke who is a decent distributor and dropping one of the wings for effectively a 2nd fullback.
I'm sure Cripps, Kennedy & Setters could do well in the square, but I'd probably rather one of the 3 in there have a serious turn of pace for the exit and I prefer the likes of Walsh, O'Brien, Fisher, SPS, Cuningham being the ones coming in from the wings/hff to continue the ball movement forward or try and apply pressure to the opposition and limit their ability to spread (in the event where we don't win the clearance). Having the 3 'big dogs' means you can have 2 around the ball at any given time with the other forward or on the bench. We do want some size & strength in there, but we also want to balance that with outside run, speed, agility & other 'flashy' skillsets to provide the best outcome in the middle.
Just got Kayo so should be able to post some more in future games.
Might try to add some lines and stuff just for Jabba.
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- #1,049
Let's just say we get one of Coniglio or Kelly this year.
Let's also assume that Stocker becomes the presence we saw him to be, next year.
We all want all of our players to flourish, but how do we spread around the midfield depth, without spreading ourselves thin through the TPP.
That's nothing we have to worry about today, but alike what came about for GWS, this may be something that fronts us in the not too distant future.
I can't see a fail in the group; Cripps, Setterfield, Walsh, Dow, Fisher and Petrevski-Seton.
Kennedy I'm 50/50 on and taking on the first proposed assumption, adding Stocker and Coniglio/Kelly, we could find ourselves with too many midfielders to go around, as could we possibly have 9 genuine mids trying to fit into a team of 22 and I'm not even including Cuningham, O'Brien and Williamson here?
Can it work when you take into account the whole mix of the team?
Let's also assume that Stocker becomes the presence we saw him to be, next year.
We all want all of our players to flourish, but how do we spread around the midfield depth, without spreading ourselves thin through the TPP.
That's nothing we have to worry about today, but alike what came about for GWS, this may be something that fronts us in the not too distant future.
I can't see a fail in the group; Cripps, Setterfield, Walsh, Dow, Fisher and Petrevski-Seton.
Kennedy I'm 50/50 on and taking on the first proposed assumption, adding Stocker and Coniglio/Kelly, we could find ourselves with too many midfielders to go around, as could we possibly have 9 genuine mids trying to fit into a team of 22 and I'm not even including Cuningham, O'Brien and Williamson here?
Can it work when you take into account the whole mix of the team?
gardiner stand
Premiership Player
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Good problem to have Harks
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