There will be wailing whichever ruckman we trade, if we go down that path. We are in the unusual position of having 3 players who all have claims to be our #1 ruckman, but don't shine as much when #2.
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- Thread starter zeeCFC
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- #102
Would rather we target a KPD to cover for Jamison. If Jamison stays healthy and Watson develops into a general and damaging tall like Sam Fisher, then Henderson can go forward. Even Podsiadly and Lonergan before him have gone back, so Watson shouldn't be discounted. Still have Bootsma and McInnes to be KPD/third tall. Strong back line, strong midfield, strong or competitive rucks and a good tall forward line wins you flags.
I'm mindful of Saints having no tall defenders, but Henderson can play forward and hit more targets than some of our mids. Casboult or Mitchell might be better suited closer to goal with their size and height. They're not as mobile as Henderson and Waite. Like McCarthy as a mobile tall forward/second ruck.
When does Kreuzer avoid jumping into rucks?
If we can get a good return for Warnock or Hampson, then why wouldn't you trade him?
Kreuzer is so much better and complete in the ruck than Warnock it's not funny. He's miles better than Warnock at backing up and getting to the next contest. Or pushing forward.
Doubt that Geelong would be upset with losing Laidler after they gained Horlin-Smith and Schroder.
JustaBattler
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Kicks straight at goal, which is almost our biggest problem of all.
Don't tell me my opinion differs to yours. How dare I?- sorry that is all the respect that bold statement deserves.
You're not particularly interested in the opinions of others unless they match yours. That is one thing which is very clear.
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Mitchell is a straight kick, but no athlete.
Able to move laterally as well which ruck men can't do
Edit : seriously watching Henderson manage to read the flight the ball and jump across the pack to mark it on Monday night was seriously more surprising to me then it should have been.
JustaBattler
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Warnock has the luxury of having both Kreuzer and Hampson give him nice little rest sessions ....
In your hypothetical Warnock against Kreuzer scenario ? - mate the Kreuz would line Warnock up with one tackle and break the runt
that would be when he wasn't running through him, around him and over him.Yes I admit it is my opinion which this time is different to yours
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Kreuzer good player. Very Overrated. There is this perception about kreuzer that he is simply amazing and so far superior to every other ruckmen. Check the career stats for him and warnock. Matty averages 1 more disposal and 1 more tackle every game, warnock averages 4 more hit outs.
Starting 18's are played with just 18 though.....
Pittman was more of CHB/CHF who could play ruck when required and wasn't confined to just playing as a genuine ruckman.
Keating was listed on the bench as was Marsh in their respective grand finals.
I think the fact that the closest team you could come up with was more then 15 years ago suggests that it is a flawed system as the game is so different today. Far more running and rotations.
I'm pleased to see you have now actually offered up some reasoning for your opinion being different to mine, rather than just belittling my opinion. It wasn't too hard, was it?Warnock has the luxury of having both Kreuzer and Hampson give him nice little rest sessions ....
In your hypothetical Warnock against Kreuzer scenario ? - mate the Kreuz would line Warnock up with one tackle and break the runt
Yes I admit it is my opinion which this time is different to yours
Looking at stats greatly underestimates Kreuzer's work around the ball.
Probably should look at effective clearances vs opposition effective clearances when each ruckman is at the contest.
I actually agree with MS. Is Kruez the better overall player? Sure. But we, as a team, just seem to play better with 206 in the ruck
and as he stated, I've seen Kruez run around the opposing rukman plenty of times. I think he does it when he feels he's no chance at winning it (usually an errant bounce)
Love MK. All heart and guts, and clearly bleeds Navy. But for whatever reason, he's not quite the player (yet?) I thought he would be when we took him #1
and as he stated, I've seen Kruez run around the opposing rukman plenty of times. I think he does it when he feels he's no chance at winning it (usually an errant bounce)
Love MK. All heart and guts, and clearly bleeds Navy. But for whatever reason, he's not quite the player (yet?) I thought he would be when we took him #1
About every 2nd centre bounce he competes in.
With Kreuzer after injury he generally comes straight back in to the seniors to find touch.. whereas with Warnock he goes to the VFL for weeks to find touch... hence his stats are better than Kreuzers as Warnock always comes into the side "in ready form"...
Making a mistake and getting something wrong once is fine but only fools make the same mistake twice. New coach comes in, fair enough he wants to give Hampson time and persist with him and try and get his game going on the up and fair enough that he should expect that Kreuzer can hold his own and contribute as a forward. It was a big risk, because we had tried it before with the three ruckmen and every time it had failed. This is something that should never happen again, because surely we are't fools.
Those who did not play their roles Monday night and those who were out run when defensive running was required should be playing VFL this week.
Those who did not play their roles Monday night and those who were out run when defensive running was required should be playing VFL this week.
Suppose the match committee need to stop rushing players in regardless of their importance to the team if they aren't match fit since it just brings the team down. Last year Luke Hodge for Hawthorn actually spent time in the VFL trying to regain his match fitness and he was better for it. No wonder people question our depth when we see younger players passed over for unfit senior players.
See What get me about our Rucks is that NONE push back into the D50 to help out the key defenders. You saw what "BIG BOY" (WoWeee) did on Monday night. Every Aerial ball was killed by him, or fisher. Kruz was playing on a direct opponent v saints and not guarding space so I cant count that
Im happy with what u say. I just didnt want go too negative. Im not a kreuzer fan boy so I'll be honest when judging him. It may take time to get his thumb right and confidence in marking back.
Good point. I didn't see the need to rush Kreuzer back in for Monday night's game, particularly with Levi having put together some good performances in the VFL.
It was fairly obvious that Kreuzer was short of a gallop on Monday night & although there was no VFL game for him to have a run in at the weekend, it wouldn't have hurt to hold him back & give him a run in the VFL this week. Instead we now have a situation where Waite will come back into the side & one of the ruckmen will most likely come out. Given how out of sorts Kreuzer looked on Monday night, it will most likely be him, so ultimately he ends up playing VFL this week anyway & in the meantime the 3 ruckmen set up arguably contributed to us losing on Monday night. A total lose/lose outcome.
Im thinking if there was a game on the weekend he would have played 2's. I reckon they were keen to get a game into him. no way he will be dropped.. He is the golden boy... in saying that he is 1 of the few guys that plays with 100% intensity and passion all the time.
ferrisb
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I was going to post similar myself until I saw Quazza's post. You compare the players and Kruez looks so much more complete a player > more capable up forward, extra grunt work and better down low.
BUT if I think about our best football over the last few years (games or even quarters), it has invariably had 206 at the centre bounce...
If anything I should be biased towards Kruez too. I love his guts and effort and have his number on my jumper...
