Coach Carlton under Voss

[carlton_99]

This Ross/Voss conversation is ridiculous. Great for the Saints that they have started very well under Ross - wish them all the best this year. But Carlton could not hire Ross without going through "the process". It would just be typical arrogant Carlton hiring someone on reputation and if it failed it would be heavily and rightly criticised as "another Malthouse". Too early to tell whether Voss is our next premiership coach but this whole topic is futile.

 

[L_W_P]

Agree and know you are not having an anti Voss crack.

The best coach could not get the current Blues beyond a mid table side.

I think Voss has a buy in from the players, which is not something every coach gets. I did wonder last year if Teague would have been as successful given a fit Cripps, Curnow etc.

I think what the Blues need to work on is their outside game.

The win a contest -> stoppage -> win a contest -> stoppage setup works for their current midfield of Cripps, Kennedy & Hewett but getting guys like Walsh, Acres & Fisher to really get the ball moving is key to taking advantage of Curnow and McKay.

I also think they need to go all in on a #1 ruck.

Pittonet is a solid hand and TDK has shown glimpses but I think that they need to make a call on one and then use Silvagni as the mobile back up. Playing all of Curnow, McKay, TDK & Silvagni in the front half while Pittonet rucks doesn't work. That's this year's problem to solve.

Long term if you aren't confident in TDK as a #1 ruck then letting him go and getting a top draft pick for him might be the play. Bring in another back up behind Pittnot and use the cash you free up to poach Ben McKay. That then pushes Young to CHB (his best spot IMO) and allows Weitering to get back to playing the interceptor role.

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

Surely you still aren't salty that we beat you guys last year with the worst bottom 6-8 players in the league

off topic.. we were lucky last year to get as far as we did with an ordinary list.

 

[Arr0w]

off topic.. we were lucky last year to get as far as we did with an ordinary list.

Not off topic at all.

If we are making assumptions on Voss, as to his capabilities and the list he has at his disposal, any comparisons you are willing to instigate are open to rebuttal

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

I think you need to trade a KPP, De Koning would make the most sense if you could get true value out of Geelong.

I think trading TDK could be beneficial but I don't think it's necessary and don't think it will happen.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Also the discussion of Ross v Voss is pretty premature, last year we were 8-2 and being talked up as potential flag favourites. Injuries, form, Plowman etc and we fell apart late in the year but at the time I don't think many had doubts on whether Voss was a good selection for us.

12 months is a long time in footy. We were in a similar position last season

 

[Arr0w]

OK.

I'm glad you understand that list depth and ability to develop young players are important in the current era.

No different to any list though

 

[bourbons]

This Ross/Voss conversation is ridiculous. Great for the Saints that they have started very well under Ross - wish them all the best this year. But Carlton could not hire Ross without going through "the process". It would just be typical arrogant Carlton hiring someone on reputation and if it failed it would be heavily and rightly criticised as "another Malthouse". Too early to tell whether Voss is our next premiership coach but this whole topic is futile.

This.

Good trolling material and all, but the idea that people would seriously have been all about Carlton binning a process to go for another messiah type is fairly humorous.

 

[t_94]

This.

Good trolling material and all, but the idea that people would seriously have been all about Carlton binning a process to go for another messiah type is fairly humorous.

‘Process’ is just a PowerPoint presentation full of cliches at the end of the day. Voss isn’t a good coach and Lyon is a very good one.

 

[Arr0w]

‘Process’ is just a PowerPoint presentation full of cliches at the end of the day. Voss isn’t a good coach and Lyon is a very good one.

Still plenty of time to change perception

 

[Freomaniac]

When you're hiring someone for a job, all interested parties apply for the position and you hold an interview. It was up to Ross Lyon to apply for the job and then be interviewed for the vacant head coaches position.

The man had too much of an ego to do that though, and thought the job should be handed to him on a plate. Lyon is a good coach but there's no need for Carlton to have any regrets here imo.

Well I would of been curious had Ross Lyon got the interview and took it.


Because.... Here's how I would of seen your team's next 4 or 5 years...

Would of made finals obviously but probably not win the flag.

Possibly would of been a good 4 year run of finals similar to his saints era of 2008-11 or freos 2012-15 era.

Probably an Elim final win in year 1. High places in years 2 and 3, both years are preliminary finals at a minimum.

Crash out on an Elim final at year 4 and then 9th to 12th in year 5 and complaints of burn out and fatigue and going stale.

I don't know what Vossy will do to your mob this season.

 

[Freomaniac]

We'll see where both Carlton and the Saints are at the end of the year.

My one complaint about Ross Lyon though, is that the style of football his teams play is a bit dour, negative and defensive. His last few years at Fremantle weren't that great either imo.

Well that 2016-19 period under Ross Lyon wasn't great.

In 2016 dockers were 0-10 and crippled with injuries. Ended up 16th with 4 wins.

I am still bitter about that. Had Freo won that game vs Carlton in round 5 and won 6 or 7 wins and still finish 16th, it was a bad drop, but I could of accept that.

In 2017 and 2018, dockers finished 14th with 8 wins and 14 losses.

Both seasons were similar. Had a solid 1st half of the season with 4-6 wins.

After the bye, the team becomes bad. Senior players get injured and replaced with kids. That means kids run out of energy and thrashings and heavy defeats are regular.

2019.... Well this was interesting. Dockers were 8 wins and 7 losses after 15 games. They just squeezed out a narrow win vs Collingwood at the MCG.

Injuries to Alex Pearce, our best tall defender hurt. Then Hogan and Lobb were injured. That's 2 tall forwards out too.

Dockers won 1 game and lost 5. Ended up 9 wins and 13 defeats.

Ross Lyon was sacked.

Had Freo made finals in 2019, Lyon would of coached in 2020.

This also means that Justin Longmuir doesn't become coach in 2020 and Freo doesn't have that 2022 Elim final vs the dogs.

 

[Thrawn]

Until we fix those F50 entries, we won't be contesting anything... except maybe the worst F50 transitioning in the league.

Two Coleman medalists and our entire forward line is flooded because our players take too long to act. They don't take the best option, instead kick it to a contest and hope that Harry or one of our ruckman will mark it. Football nous, you either have it or you don't.

 

[bourbons]

‘Process’ is just a PowerPoint presentation full of cliches at the end of the day. Voss isn’t a good coach and Lyon is a very good one.

Kinda my point.

Not much we can do if Ross the Boss won't even deign to throw together a few powerpoint slides - except bin the process and just hand it to another messiah type, which a lot of people now seem to be suggesting was the option. Like yeah, I'm sure that would have been the prevailing thought round here at the time lol.

 

[Kram]

Waaay to early to make calls on the Voss v Ross call.

 

[NetworkNerd]

Waaay to early to make calls on the Voss v Ross call.

Voss >>>>>> Ross

 

[Taper]

Waaay to early to make calls on the Voss v Ross call.

How about now?
Voss has the Blues humming while Ross has the Saints in no mans land.

 

[My Tilly]

I think trading TDK could be beneficial but I don't think it's necessary and don't think it will happen.

Ah yes, I remember when your supporters wanted to see the back of Tom early last year.

 

[Kram]

How about now?
Voss has the Blues humming while Ross has the Saints in no mans land.

The St Kilda list is very ordinary by comparison to what Carlton has for Voss.

In saying that I rate Voss and would take him before Ross though.

 

[T2B_]

Ah yes, I remember when your supporters wanted to see the back of Tom early last year.

It happens, there were plenty not exactly sold on Tom of the Hawkins variety until he flourished.

 

[T2B_]

It would be interesting what the current Carlton team would look under Ross.

I wasn't against the idea when Ross was available and we were still looking for a coach, but with benefit of hindsight, I'm very glad things turned out as they did.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Ah yes, I remember when your supporters wanted to see the back of Tom early last year

Is this meant to be your big gotcha? "Could be but don't think it's necessary"

I'm positive you could have dug up better melts from myself after our loss to Essendon last year, was ready to see the club burnt to the ground that day.

 

[Blue1980]

How about now?
Voss has the Blues humming while Ross has the Saints in no mans land.

See how things pan out, but I think Vossy has more to work with.

 

[Chism]

‘Process’ is just a PowerPoint presentation full of cliches at the end of the day. Voss isn’t a good coach and Lyon is a very good one.

 

[Juddernaut08]

at the end of the day, Ross is a known entity. gets a team to work hard and play disciplined but ultimately has never won a flag and leaves the list a burnt out shell.

voss is still a work in progress imo. hes not brilliant like. Kingsley or Fly, but he has shown improvement.

saints have a terrible list though so the comparisons arent worth much