Current Trial The Delphi Teen Murders - Video of killer found in Libby's phone * TRIAL

[Kurve]

The police kept saying he's been arrested but not once did they say charged. In USA does arrested = charged?

He was charged with two counts of murder on Friday.

Authorities said that Richard M. Allen, 50, of Delphi, Ind., was taken into custody last week and charged with two counts of murder Friday in the killings of Liberty German, 14, and Abigail Williams, 13, whose bodies were found in 2017

Allen pleaded not guilty in a preliminary hearing, Carroll County Prosecutor Nicholas McLeland said in a news conference Monday. Allen is being held at the White County jail without bond and has hearing dates scheduled for January and March 20.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2022/10/31/delphi-abby-williams-libby-german-killings/

 

[kaiserchief13]

He was charged with two counts of murder on Friday.

Authorities said that Richard M. Allen, 50, of Delphi, Ind., was taken into custody last week and charged with two counts of murder Friday in the killings of Liberty German, 14, and Abigail Williams, 13, whose bodies were found in 2017

Allen pleaded not guilty in a preliminary hearing, Carroll County Prosecutor Nicholas McLeland said in a news conference Monday. Allen is being held at the White County jail without bond and has hearing dates scheduled for January and March 20.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2022/10/31/delphi-abby-williams-libby-german-killings/

And yet none of this was spoken about in the press conference by the police officers wanting their 5 minutes of fame. Instead god mentioned....

 

[Kurve]

And yet none of this was spoken about in the press conference by the police officers wanting their 5 minutes of fame. Instead god mentioned....

Yep. It was hard to sit through.

As Wosh pointed to a bit further up, prosecutors might be considering asking for the death penalty and which could explain some of the secrecy.

 

[kaiserchief13]

Yep. It was hard to sit through.

As Wosh pointed to a bit further up, prosecutors might be considering asking for the death penalty and which could explain some of the secrecy.

I get they don't release any facts about the case but explain what exactly has just happened and what the process is moving forward. That's what the purpose of a police press conference should be

 

[FR0GGY]

And yet none of this was spoken about in the press conference by the police officers wanting their 5 minutes of fame. Instead god mentioned....

Pretty sure towards the start they said charged with 2 counts of murder.

 

[Kurve]

I get they don't release any facts about the case but explain what exactly has just happened and what the process is moving forward. That's what the purpose of a police press conference should be

Agree, if they're that confident they have the right man securing $20m bail for a guy who works in a pharmacy we'd think they could be a little more forthcoming and assuring the public with at least the minimum of what's expected in the US.

Maybe they just found this guy and he wasn't on their radar at all ever and they're still waiting for more DNA analysis, or suspicion others are involved or knew or he's selling identities or something and they need time to investigate.

 

[jimmy_jamz]

Just listened to the “down the hill:delphi murders” podcast. In Indiana? there’s no differentiation with 1st degree, 2nd degree and accessory, they’re all counted as a murder charge. There might be a bit more to come yet. Did I see someone post about a dead brother having the same gait as on the released video? Just an uneducated possibility on my part though

 

[Truckosaurus]

Anyone expecting the sheriff from a small town in Indiana not to mention God when announcing the charging of a suspect in the murder of two girls is always going to be disappointed.

 

[mighty_lions]

the rumour goes this has all happened by chance and not related to kegan Kline, that he stole something from a neighbour and was caught red handed and because it was felony he had to submit DNA which matched

 

[ep2018]

the rumour goes this has all happened by chance and not related to kegan Kline, that he stole something from a neighbour and was caught red handed and because it was felony he had to submit DNA which matched

I've read it too on Twitter, apparently blood stained clothing was found hidden in the house when it was searched too which is still being DNA tested. It's interesting if true as police came out a few months ago saying the girls were missing some clothing and it was likely taken as a souvenir as is what a lot of these creeps tend to do.

 

[Jamurp]

Remember reading about this case late at night a few years ago, hearing the audio and all, was obviously very creeped out. Can't believe they've finally made an arrest, I honestly thought this would struggle to ever get solved. Here's hoping this really is the perpetrator and justice can finally be served.

 

[Awakening]

Are they not releasing probable cause details in case there are others involved?

 

[Kurve]

Are they not releasing probable cause details in case there are others involved?

Could be.

"This investigation is still very much ongoing," added McCleland, speaking to a large crowd of media and Delphi residents who gathered to hear news of the arrest. "We're keeping the tipline open, the tip email open. We encourage everybody to continue to call in tips -- not only about Richard Allen, but also about any other person you may have. For that reason and for the nature of this case, the probable cause [affidavit] and the charging information has been sealed by the court."


A probable cause affidavit explains WHY an individual has been charged with a crime, outlining the defendant’s alleged actions that led to his or her arrest. State law requires that a probable cause affidavit be publicly filed in most criminal cases after a defendant has been charged.

The fact that the prosecutor and law enforcement are keeping the document secret in such a high-profile case is troubling to some legal experts.

"It is surprising," said Novella Nedeff, who spent nearly two decades as a public defender and now teaches law at Indiana University. "I dare say on the state level, I can't think of ever hearing of a probable cause affidavit being held 30 days after an arrest was made."

Nedeff told 13News that releasing probable cause information helps ensure due process for the defendant while also allowing the public to scrutinize the justice system and ask important questions. In this case, both due process and transparency are in jeopardy because the evidence against Allen is being kept secret.

Indiana Code 5-14-3-5.5 requires that “before a court may seal a public record … it must hold a hearing” and notice of the hearing “shall be posted at a place designated for posting notices in the courthouse.” It is not clear whether a hearing with proper public notice was conducted before Allen’s probable cause affidavit was ordered sealed.

This is why police are keeping important court records secret in Delphi case

Police and prosecutors are not releasing details about why they believe Richard Allen murdered two girls on the Monon High Bridge in 2017.

www.wthr.com

 

[BigPond101]

One of the girls Aunt interacted with the killer when she went into the pharmacy to get funeral pictures developed from an interview on reddit

"I went into the store to print photos of Libby for the funeral, and he was the one who helped me," German said. "I was a mess trying to get the images off my phone. Once they were printed, he looked at me and said, 'I'm not gonna charge you for this.'"

 

[SquiffyRae]

One of the girls Aunt interacted with the killer when she went into the pharmacy to get funeral pictures developed from an interview on reddit

"I went into the store to print photos of Libby for the funeral, and he was the one who helped me," German said. "I was a mess trying to get the images off my phone. Once they were printed, he looked at me and said, 'I'm not gonna charge you for this.'"

I will admit of all the wild rumours floating around right now, it's bizarre that this (honestly one of the fakest sounding of the lot) is the one that's confirmed by the family to be true. Freaky coincidence.

As speculated on Reddit makes you wonder if Allen might have made himself a copy. And say said copies were found as part of the search. It wouldn't be proof of murder but that would be a very awkward piece of circumstantial evidence to try and explain away

 

[SquiffyRae]

It's difficult to tell what's rumour and what's fact at the moment but some of the rumours would be very interesting if true

1) If it was because he stole something from a neighbour, that's some "Ted Bundy was caught by traffic cops" level of luck considering it looks increasingly likely the investigation had a lot of evidence but no POI to match it to
2) If the whole felony + DNA testing etc. angle is true, it's also significant as that implies there was DNA that was able to be collected from the crime scene which is very good news. DNA is just the sort of evidence juries and prosecutors love because it's extremely hard to explain away
3) If souvenirs were found, that would just be the cherry on top. Hopefully Allen's got the services of a very good lawyer who will in all likelihood go "you're screwed, change your plea to guilty and we can get the death sentence wiped"

It reminds me a lot of the Claremont serial killer case. I hesitate to say the case was cold, more stagnant. They had some decent evidence but it didn't help to point them to the person. Then it just happens that a complete fluke delivers the much-needed break and things move very quickly from there.

The only thing that bugs me somewhat is if Allen came to police attention completely out of the blue, wtf was up with the earlier comment that they didn't believe the community was in danger. If they really didn't know who committed this crime, they couldn't keep an eye on a suspect so they had no way to make that guarantee. Unless they had a person pretty firmly in mind that eventually turned out to be nothing.

This is definitely a case that I would love to hear the details of just how they caught this guy

 

[mighty_lions]

It's difficult to tell what's rumour and what's fact at the moment but some of the rumours would be very interesting if true

1) If it was because he stole something from a neighbour, that's some "Ted Bundy was caught by traffic cops" level of luck considering it looks increasingly likely the investigation had a lot of evidence but no POI to match it to
2) If the whole felony + DNA testing etc. angle is true, it's also significant as that implies there was DNA that was able to be collected from the crime scene which is very good news. DNA is just the sort of evidence juries and prosecutors love because it's extremely hard to explain away
3) If souvenirs were found, that would just be the cherry on top. Hopefully Allen's got the services of a very good lawyer who will in all likelihood go "you're screwed, change your plea to guilty and we can get the death sentence wiped"

It reminds me a lot of the Claremont serial killer case. I hesitate to say the case was cold, more stagnant. They had some decent evidence but it didn't help to point them to the person. Then it just happens that a complete fluke delivers the much-needed break and things move very quickly from there.

The only thing that bugs me somewhat is if Allen came to police attention completely out of the blue, wtf was up with the earlier comment that they didn't believe the community was in danger. If they really didn't know who committed this crime, they couldn't keep an eye on a suspect so they had no way to make that guarantee. Unless they had a person pretty firmly in mind that eventually turned out to be nothing.

This is definitely a case that I would love to hear the details of just how they caught this guy

with that comment, its a small town they don't want everyone living their lives on edge, and whilst they hadn't arrested anyone obviously people could be at danger

I have always thought the kegan Kline link was not related and just a coincidence, I can't wait to see the probable cause affidavit

 

[SquiffyRae]

It's definitely looking increasingly likely that Keegan Kline had nothing to do with it.

Which is an uncomfortable thought. You have one child predator who is currently rotting in the slammer who was apparently catfishing a future murder victim but then when said girl is murdered almost immediately after the catfishing it was a completely different creep who in all likelihood saw an opportunity and pounced.

The odds of that are astronomical but it's looking like that's exactly what happened. And if that's the case that is one of the most insane coincidences and most extreme examples of bad luck I can remember in reading true crime

 

[FR0GGY]

Interesting the warrant to search his property was 2 weeks before the arrest.

 

[Kurve]

the rumour goes this has all happened by chance and not related to kegan Kline, that he stole something from a neighbour and was caught red handed and because it was felony he had to submit DNA which matched

Just reading this which might lend some credibility to the rumour the police raided his house for some other reason. Took his car, which he may or may not have had at the time of the murders, clothes books and other things the neighbours probably couldn't identify. Maybe newsclippings or other significant items in the shoebox?

There seems to have been some lag between that and the murder charges.

Not much is known about Allen, who lives in Delphi with his wife and is reportedly being held at White County Jail. CNN reports that Allen’s neighbors saw police searching his house two weeks ago, with authorities reportedly towing away his SUV and leaving the property with several of his belongings, including clothes, books, a shopping bag, and a shoebox and digging out two areas in the backyard.

https://www.thecut.com/2022/11/what-we-know-about-the-delphi-murder-case.html

 

[SquiffyRae]

The big rumour doing the rounds (which I have to stress is still very much a rumour) is that what led to his arrest was as follows:

Allen supposedly broke into one of his neighbour's garages to "borrow" some tools. It wasn't really confirmed whether he was actually swiping them or just trying to sneakily borrow them before putting them back. Either way he was supposedly caught red-handed which led to police being called.

Now this is where the rumours aren't quite clear on what got him. Some say that as opening a garage door to swipe tools is technically a felony break and enter, under Indiana law Allen had to get his DNA taken and it all went from there. Others say that the house search was what did it and they found items of interest while collecting evidence for the B&E. Either one would explain the couple of weeks delay between the search and arrest for murder while they processed evidence.

Whole thing is giving me CSK vibes. Don't think Allen was on the radar until there was a connection made to another crime (in this case a current one rather than a historic one)

 

[Terrafirma]

If this is the fireworks video, the comments in here are saying it's not Allen, it's his brother in law who died but yeh the gait looks the same. It's very distinctive.

From about .15

Yeah doesn't look like him in the face when he turns around. The build is perfectly in line with the bridge guy video though.

 

[Kurve]

The big rumour doing the rounds (which I have to stress is still very much a rumour) is that what led to his arrest was as follows:

Allen supposedly broke into one of his neighbour's garages to "borrow" some tools. It wasn't really confirmed whether he was actually swiping them or just trying to sneakily borrow them before putting them back. Either way he was supposedly caught red-handed which led to police being called.

Now this is where the rumours aren't quite clear on what got him. Some say that as opening a garage door to swipe tools is technically a felony break and enter, under Indiana law Allen had to get his DNA taken and it all went from there. Others say that the house search was what did it and they found items of interest while collecting evidence for the B&E. Either one would explain the couple of weeks delay between the search and arrest for murder while they processed evidence.

Whole thing is giving me CSK vibes. Don't think Allen was on the radar until there was a connection made to another crime (in this case a current one rather than a historic one)

I watched a longish video last night featuring Paul Holes, I didn't post because it was uninteretng but for a news clip right at the very end.

It reports: Unmarked police cars showed up and they went first to his shed not entering the house. Allen hung around outside with his wife for hours getting in and out of his car while the neighbours really were watching with their "binoculars", taking snaps.

Quite a few hours later, the Sheriff showed up and they waited a bit longer before entering the house, it's assumed they were waiting on a warrant.

More unarked police cars showed up until there was 8 or more at the house.

 

[Terrafirma]

Libby's Grand Father Mike Patty says he can't understand how someone could do something like this and carry on living as per normal.

That part has always been the one I struggle with. These killers must have no conscious. What makes them think killing innocent children is ok and how do they live with that? What makes up a murderer like the Delphi Killer? Perhaps one day personality testing will uncover future killers like the one alleged to have committed this crime>

 

[Terrafirma]

It's difficult to tell what's rumour and what's fact at the moment but some of the rumours would be very interesting if true

1) If it was because he stole something from a neighbour, that's some "Ted Bundy was caught by traffic cops" level of luck considering it looks increasingly likely the investigation had a lot of evidence but no POI to match it to
2) If the whole felony + DNA testing etc. angle is true, it's also significant as that implies there was DNA that was able to be collected from the crime scene which is very good news. DNA is just the sort of evidence juries and prosecutors love because it's extremely hard to explain away
3) If souvenirs were found, that would just be the cherry on top. Hopefully Allen's got the services of a very good lawyer who will in all likelihood go "you're screwed, change your plea to guilty and we can get the death sentence wiped"

It reminds me a lot of the Claremont serial killer case. I hesitate to say the case was cold, more stagnant. They had some decent evidence but it didn't help to point them to the person. Then it just happens that a complete fluke delivers the much-needed break and things move very quickly from there.

The only thing that bugs me somewhat is if Allen came to police attention completely out of the blue, wtf was up with the earlier comment that they didn't believe the community was in danger. If they really didn't know who committed this crime, they couldn't keep an eye on a suspect so they had no way to make that guarantee. Unless they had a person pretty firmly in mind that eventually turned out to be nothing.

This is definitely a case that I would love to hear the details of just how they caught this guy

100%. A complete fluke is all it takes or is that also divine intervention.? In a case like this which has been cold for years what was Allen thinking if he decided to break into a neighbors garage? (If true). In the case of CSK we got to hear what pinned BRE in the end and DNA was a huge part of that. But you make a huge point in saying if Allen is the killer and was hiding in plain sight and they had the killers DNA then the community was still potentially in danger.