Best 18 Present and Future

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Mead

Norm Smith Medallist
Mar 2, 2002
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Perth
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Eagles
Now that all the hullalaboo and whatnot of the trade period is over, I thought it'd be interesting to take another look at
a.) What our figurative best 18 is going to look like next year, &
b.) what our best 18 will be a couple of years hence. I'm not going to bother trying to put together a hypothetical interchange, because it simply varies too much from week to week depending on form, our opponents, injuries, etc etc.


Backs:
Present-Reid Macintosh Collica
A bit of a no brainer this one. When fit, Macintosh is still on par with Fletcher as the best FB in the competition. Combined with Reid and Collica, we have a balanced, experienced FB line, capable of dealing with any size and shape of forward.

Future- Humm Lynch Collica
Humm could be developed into an archetypical small defender- Gritty, tough as nails, and a great tackler. IMO, Lynch should become our new key defender. He has the size, strength, and marking ability to be an excellent FB, as well as a modicum of pace. Also, I love the idea of having a guy who can comfortably boot the ball 60m doing our kick ins. I get the impression Collica is going to remain a fixture at the eagles for years to come as our midsize defender in the last line of defence. Other options back here include Glass, Carrol, and possibly Haynes.

Halfbacks:
Present- Green Jakovich Hunter
After a stellar season, it seems like Jako could go on forever, and I sincerely hope he does. There are a few players he has a bit of trouble with, but by and large, he cheerfully bitchifies marquee CHFs week in, week out. I get the impression his resurgence this year had a lot to do with having more solid HB flankers to back him up, and this is where the Green and Hunter duo come in- they're both young, relatively fast and tough defenders who've blossomed under Worsfold. Green is a very strong mark, and Huntaaaaaaaa is just a headcase. They fit very well together, adding some extra run off half back whilst Jako anchors the defence. Also might be worth keeping Morrison waiting on the interchange to allow Hunter to switch forward if needs be. Green/Jakovich/Hunter = could be as potent as Mckenna/Jakovich/Worsfold, and remain so, until Jako eventually fossilises, sometime in the next few centuries.

Future- Green, Gaspar, Hunter
Green and Hunter are ready now, Gaspar should slot in against some of the more mobile CHFs next year and over the next few seasons he has the smarts and raw ability to take over the reins from Jako when he's ready.

Centreline:
Present- Fletcher Chick Judd
This looks pretty dangerous. In theory, Wirrpunda/Chick/Judd would be the absolute best centre line, but Wirra and Chick are too damaging up forward to keep them both in the midfield at the same time, so I'm guessing they'll rotate through there. Judd and Fletch make a lightning quick wing combination, the only thing stopping the latter from being a true blue ribbon player is his lack of consistency. Chick, meanwhile, makes a handy mr fixit onballer, laying tackles, going in and under with Kerr, shepherding for Cousins, and doing the sort of grunt work that won him a B&F at Hawthorn. The first person who mentions 'Headland' can go to hell. (not that I'm bitter or anything :))

Future- Adkins Fletcher Judd
Ok, I'm obviously stretching it a bit by naming a guy who none of us had heard of till yesterday, but Adkins does have the right pedigree to be a top flight midfielder in the future. As far as I'm concerned, if he's fit, throw him in the deepend. We need to know whether or not he can play- now.

Ruck-
Present- Gardiner, Cousins, Kerr
A bloody good combination,and one made a lot better by having Chick as the third real onballer. If Gardiner can find consistency, he'll be a superstar, and Cousins and Kerr are still on the improve to even loftier heights.

Future- Cox, Cousins, Kerr
Obviously, Gardiner probably isn't going anywhere in a hurry, but I do get the impression that as he matures more as a player he could spend more time at CHF, mostly because I get the feeling Cox has it in him to be a better 'pure' ruckman than Gardie, which is a pretty bold statement, I know. Cousins and Kerr, meanwhile, should have at least half a decade of peak quality football together, provided they don't punch each other's lights out.

Half Forward:
Present- Wirrpunda, Macdougall Pe. Matera
Obviously Gardiner is an option at CHF, but I'm of the opinion that 2003 needs to be the season where Doogs becomes a bona fide AFL player. Theoreticaly, his status as a high pick in the draft should indicate that he has the ability to be an elite CHF, and in his first game last year, he actually showed a fair bit. He has the potential, he's had a long development period, and now comes the time for the payoff. Chuck him in the deep end I say. Wirrpunda will no doubt spend a fair amount of time in the midfield when he ain't tearing it up on the forward line. Peter Matera, meanwhile, should play out his career on the HFF- his silky skills, experience, and defensive tackling are handy, but on top of that, the fact is he is still probably the most accurate kick on goal in our team, and one of the few players of his size in the league who can comfortably kick 50m+ with deadeye accuracy. On top of that, he still has more pace than most defenders, making he and Wirrpunda a notably slippery couple of flankers. Obviously Chick is also a significant possibility here.

Future- Embley Macdougall Chick
I'm gonna whack on the rose colored glasses for a second, and believe that somehow, somewhere Andrew Embley will actually utilise the incredible size, skill and athleticism he's been naturally gifted with, and become a decent AFL football player. If not, he'll be seeing the door soonish, but if he did, well, he'd be bloody good. Chick will probably spend the twilight years of his career on the half forward line when he gets too old for the midfield caper.

Forwards:
Present: Ph. Matera Wilson Jones.
The first two spots are no brainers. Rowan Jones, however, is obviously a bit more of a smokey. Why do I think he should play as the midsize forward? To function along with Matera and Wilson on the full forward line, we need an exceptionally smart footballer who knows how to create space for them, draw off defenders, and just generally not get in their way. Furthermore, he needs to be able to take a decent mark, make good position, and apply defensive pressure to keep the ball bottled up. That description basically suits Jones to a T, and with our present midfield stocks, we can spare him for the forward line. I really do think he's got the ability to be a career forward- he played an excellent game in the forward line vs Sydney this year when Wilson was out, and kicked a number of opportunistic goals.

Future: Sampi, Wilson, Munro
Sampi looks to be a class object, and Munro actually came good towards the end of the year, most notably vs Essendon, of course. Now about Wilson's future. I honestly believe he could play for maybe another 5 years yet, despite his age. Players tend to retire in their early thirties because some recurring injury they sustained earlier on catches up with them, eg McKenna's back, Kemp's concussion, and no doubt in the future, Milli's hamstrings and Roo's calves. Now in Wilson's case the fact that he started AFL, and indeed football in general, very late is a big factor in his favor, because he hasn't had a decade of physically demanding AFL footy, training and weekly plane travel to accumulate the collection of injury niggles that most 30 year olds would have. In addition to that, Full Forward is probably the least physically demanding position on the field, if you look around, most of the dinosaurs of the league either play FF or FB, so that also suggests he won't be heading out soonish. Finally, he's very fit, built like the proverbial brick dunny, and considers a broken collarbone to be a minor inconvenience. Given that noone else in the league plays FF quite like he does, I can't see West Coast putting Porno out to stud (not the best choice of phrase) until they absolutely have to, which I don't think will be for a while yet.
 
Mead....good writeup. A few I disagree with but before I get into that I must first pull you up on Ried (Read) and MacIntosh (McIntosh). :D Just for future reference :D

I just came off as an arseh*le didnt I :D

Anyways....

Lynch as the future Full Back, Im not sold on. He plays CHB in the WAFL and plays it very well. Im suspect on his speed aswell. Can he stay with quicker, smaller full forwards? I thought he was a perfect replacement for Jakovich.

Gaspar is an interesting one. With Jako still going strong at CHB and McDougall coming through at CHF...where does that leave him. Can he take over from Milli at FB or would he be wasted that far back in defence. Should we push McDougall to FF when Wilson retires to allow Gaspar to play CHF? And also if Cox does really come on and we move Gardiner to CHF? Where does Doogs go, and in turn Gaspar go?
 
Originally posted by jod23
Mead....good writeup. A few I disagree with but before I get into that I must first pull you up on Ried (Read) and MacIntosh (McIntosh). :D Just for future reference :D

I just came off as an arseh*le didnt I :D
'Tis better than coming off as someone who should really learn not to post long and involved writeups when they're just back from a boozeup :D
The scary thing is I *knew* that I was spelling them incorrectly, the alcohol, and my lack of a brain just took over and decided to make a prat of myself. Honest ;)


Originally posted by jod23
Anyways....

Lynch as the future Full Back, Im not sold on. He plays CHB in the WAFL and plays it very well. Im suspect on his speed aswell. Can he stay with quicker, smaller full forwards? I thought he was a perfect replacement for Jakovich.

Gaspar is an interesting one. With Jako still going strong at CHB and McDougall coming through at CHF...where does that leave him. Can he take over from Milli at FB or would he be wasted that far back in defence. Should we push McDougall to FF when Wilson retires to allow Gaspar to play CHF? And also if Cox does really come on and we move Gardiner to CHF? Where does Doogs go, and in turn Gaspar go?

Hmm, I wouldn't call Lynch agile, but I think he'd be able to stick with a conventional leading FF. He certainly has more pace than the other leading candidate in Glass.
I tend to see CHB as requiring more mobility than FB, anyhoo, but I guess that most likely, our entire spine will be fairly interchangeable, with Gaspar, Glass and Lynch switching between the two key defensive positions depending on who suits whichever opposition player best. Lynch would indeed make a formidable CHB if someone could be found who would handle FB better, but I don't think we have that at present. Both Lynch and Gaspar have the potential to play forward as well, but a lot depends on whether or not someone like Caroll or Glass can become a consistent defender.
When it comes to Cox and Gardiner, I guess my biggest problem with either of them heading for CHF is Cox is a bit lanky, and just seems more of a pure ruckman, and I'm doubtful whether Gardie can ever shake his dreadful kicking action. Fact is, he can't be relied on as a decent chance to a kick a goal from 50m, and unless that changes, we wouldn't be getting full value from him at CHF. No doubt he will spend a fair amount of time forward, and rightly so, but Gardie will always be at his best in the ruck. When Cox fully comes of age, I guess I'd like to see us get complete value from our ruckmen by starting one on the interchange, resting both frequently, but as a consequence, expecting them to be extra mobile, involved in everything, and basically run their opponents into the ground. If we have two very talented ruckmen of approximately equal ability, we can afford to make them work harder than the opposition, because we'd generally have a superior backup on call.
 

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I think everything will take care of itself as long as we develop FULL TIME, CHB and FB and CHF players.

Who they will be, I'm not sure, but we have a few players who could take one, two or all three roles.

Lynch, McDougall, Glass, Gaspar.

As long as these players are allowed to develop into these roles, I can see big things for us.
 
Dunno about Gaspar playing FB, but he can definitely hold down CHB.

And a thing on Lynchy's pace.

He used to be a state 200m champion, so he has the pace, but playing at FF or FB, 200m pace means nothing, it's more like 20m speed that is the most important.
 
Originally posted by ozzult
Dunno about Gaspar playing FB, but he can definitely hold down CHB.

And a thing on Lynchy's pace.

He used to be a state 200m champion, so he has the pace, but playing at FF or FB, 200m pace means nothing, it's more like 20m speed that is the most important.

So you made a point which then became pointless :D
 
Originally posted by jod23


So you made a point which then became pointless :D

True, but just thought I would mention it, because even if you are quick at 200m, you can still be good over 20m.
 
i would like to see lynch play at either FB or FF. while he has the pace all that momentum mucks it hard for him to slow down and turn around.

as for gas i'd love to see jak take him under his wing and groom him for CHB. unfortunatly this means that he won't get much game time in the next year or so.

mead - no room for wirra in your future team. :(
 
Originally posted by noodle
i would like to see lynch play at either FB or FF. while he has the pace all that momentum mucks it hard for him to slow down and turn around.

as for gas i'd love to see jak take him under his wing and groom him for CHB. unfortunatly this means that he won't get much game time in the next year or so.

mead - no room for wirra in your future team. :(

I guess in the future, I like him as an interchange player being used to plug holes in the midfield, up forward and in defence. He can basically play 3 different positions, but where he is most useful to us depends on how the rest of the team develops though.
 
My gut feeling is that we have several players that are automatic choices if fit. A few that are close to being automatic choices and then a lot fighting for the few places left.

Automatic choices if fit :-
Cuz
Gardy
Kerr
Judd
Chick
Milli
Jako
Roo
Fido
BB
Colllica
Prior
Morrisson
Cox
Banfield
Jones
Wirrpunda

close
Hunter
Wooden
Fletcher
Green
Read
Glass
Lynch
Sampi

Well thats more than a full team so what about
McDougall
Munro
Chambers
Haynes
Embley
Sierra
Carroll
and a few more.........

certainly some competition there....
 

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The future is now and I think we have serious problems at FB and CHB.
Macintosh was servicable this year but i think you wouldn't lose a lot by playing Glass down there. You can critisize his kicks etc but how many kicks does Macintosh manage? If Glass was at FB instead of pocket/flank then he wouldn't need to do much kicking. Just sprint, spoil and mark which he did quite well when he played.

Jakovich's last 6 weeks were terrible. He spent more time up forward and on the bench then CHB. My guess is he ran out of legs 2/3 into the season. I have no doubt Woosha will look to try someone there soon. Either Embley, Lynch or Gaspar and use Jako for pretty sparingly, mostly forward.

Everywhere else takes care of itself.
 
Originally posted by El Cid
The future is now and I think we have serious problems at FB and CHB.
Macintosh was servicable this year but i think you wouldn't lose a lot by playing Glass down there. You can critisize his kicks etc but how many kicks does Macintosh manage? If Glass was at FB instead of pocket/flank then he wouldn't need to do much kicking. Just sprint, spoil and mark which he did quite well when he played.

Jakovich's last 6 weeks were terrible. He spent more time up forward and on the bench then CHB. My guess is he ran out of legs 2/3 into the season. I have no doubt Woosha will look to try someone there soon. Either Embley, Lynch or Gaspar and use Jako for pretty sparingly, mostly forward.

Everywhere else takes care of itself.

Just my opinion ... but I think you have fallen off the wagon.
 
Originally posted by Frodo
Prior
Banfield

close
Fletcher
Read

Well thats more than a full team so what about
Chambers
..
I hate disagreeing with you Frodo (because it normally means I will be wrong) but.......

I would have had Fletcher and Read above Prior (one of my favourites) and Banfield.

I'm amazed at how our fans under-rate Chambers - I think he is one of our brightest future stars.

My take on players for next year

Lock it in Eddies (dead certs every game they are fit - roughly in order)
Cuz
Gardy
Kerr
Chick
Jako
Milli
Wirra
Judd
Roo
Fido
Read

Northerly Odds (Most likely to be in side every week - in order)
Jones
Fletcher
Chambers
Morrison
Hunter
Collica
Cox
Wilson
Green

Unknown talents (Wildcards for us)
McDougall
Adkins
Sampi
Lynch
Humm
Munroe (will move a long way up this list this year)
Seaby
 
well the way i see it is like this for our future team (3-5 yrs)

B: sampi Glass Green

HB: Haynes Lynch Hunter

C: Adkins Kerr Judd

HF: Wirra McDougall Chambers

F: Ph. Matera Wilson Embley

R: Gardiner Cousins Fletcher

Int: cox , read, wooden, jones

well thats the way i see the eagles team in about 3 to 5 years shaping up with the current list of players, hopefully they will get some more talls and rid of some of the underachieving players.
 
future 18?

These are great future teams but they do contain 17 out of 22 that were themselves drafted in the last 3 to 5 years. and only Gardiner, Cousins and (perhaps) Phil matera would have been in the best 22 for each of those five years. So these are teams for one year only because then we have another batch of Judds and Sampis etc. etc. coming through.
So, the real challenge is.... who of these people are going to be in the best 22 over EACH of the next five years? Will McDougall have established himself at CHF and played 100 games? Will Gardiner still be a prime ruckman, AND still be at West Coast. Presumably Cousins will still be running around in the captains spot but will Judd have returned east? And who will be the players who look the goods but then fall by the wayside (as Williams did this year given that he was easily in the best 22 at this stage last year).
Does anybody have a list of the best 22 from this time last year - it might make for an interesting comparison!
 
Originally posted by jod23


Just my opinion ... but I think you have fallen off the wagon.
I guess people were happy with our defense being the "worst" in the league last season...I assume this because most seem happy with the same exact backline for 03, which i can't see magically improving.
 
I don't see it becoming a super outfit by next year, but i do see it improving. Collica will hopefully bounce back to 2001 form, and Hunter/Green will continue to Improve. Also we SHOULD get read back which will hopefully if he can get back to form fill the small defender void which was our MAJOR weakness, otherwise Sampi or Humm will. And of Course Jako and Milli to keep going strong. Throw in Gaspar/Glass/McDougall etc and i think we will have a decent backline, which HOPEFULLY with the midfield and forward mix won't see too much of the ball down in defense;)
 

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