List Mgmt. 2025 List Management Discussion

[rye]

Are people hating on Draper because he cant play? Or because he would be too expensive? Or because it's just unrealistic?

I rate Draper as a Ruckman pretty highly, it would also be interesting to see what our midfield could do with an actual tap Ruckman. Would an upgrade in the forward line of Oscar Allen be better then an upgrade in the midfield?

draper is a significant downgrade on oscar in terms of ruck craft

 

[Tom14]

This is why the first table you showed is greyed out for players drafted after pick 21 in the 3rd year. They don't have a base pay. It's only the regulated payments, i.e match payments, etc that are limited by the AFL.

There's nothing in the EBA that stipulates players drafted after pick 21 have a set base pay, based on previous years performance incentive bonuses.

Yes there is, but you are stuck on your own interpretation that is wrong. This exact issue was actually discussed in last year's draft thread too!

Per the CBA, it's top 20 and all earnings in your first three years are regulated.

So 1-20 get three years and can't sign an extension until Round 6. Pick 21+ get two years but can sign a contract for a third year whenever, and longer deals after that same Round 6 timeframe, but the payments for any extension covering the third year will still be as defined in the CBA (to avoid getting drafted later being a better deal because you can get a massive third year unlike the top 20 picks).

The 21+ don't need to wait till that round 6 but are on regulated payments in that 3rd year as you say.
Getting back to the posters original question. Yes, to only the top 20 get a 3-year deal.
The Fox article i referred to was wrong in stating "— Three-year contracts for players taken in the first round of the men’s draft."
Below from the CBA

(g) No First Year Player drafted at an National Draft Selection Meeting may extend their AFL Standard Playing Contract beyond the term of that Standard Playing Contract until the conclusion of round 6 of the AFL Premiership Season in the first year of that contract except that a First Year Player drafted at Pick 21+ at an National Draft Selection Meeting may be contracted for a third year on regulated payments at any time.
......................................................
Interesting article from the Melbourne Sports Law Association

How First Year Draftees Can Maximise their Earnings with the New AFL Collective Bargaining Agreement (CBA) — Melbourne Sports Law Association

The historic collective bargaining agreement (CBA) signed by the AFL and AFLW last year is bound to shape the trajectory of the sport moving forward. In this article, James Accadia breaks down all the newly-added incentives for first year draftees, and how these changes can impact their future cont

www.melbournesla.com

Contract Extensions

The New CBA imposes restrictions on extending the AFL Standard Playing Contract of a draftee until after round 6 in their first year.[41] An exception to this rule is granted to a first-year player drafted at pick 21 or later, who, on draft night, can extend their initial two-year contract to a three-year Standard AFL Playing Contract.[42]

Following Round 6, players like Reid have the opportunity to negotiate and extend their AFL Standard Playing Contract with their clubs to further maximise their earning capacity.

Also - if you look at the minimum player base salary in the CBA it specifically excludes first to third year players


Not third year players drafted who have a guaranteed 3 year contract - all third year players don't fall within the minimum base payment per annum clause.

 

[Sanchez365]

I don't think he can play, and I don't want to pay a ruckman premium money. He has highlight flash playes like the goal of the year (contender? can't remember if he won it) but otherwise underwhelms.

He is a Ruckman, and could be a very good one, but has been pushed forward by Scott because they have no other options up there besides only rucks.

I'm not that interested in his flashy plays, but he has shown he can be a genuine tap Ruckman. A premium ruck is worth paying for, Gawn in his prime right now I would pay good money for.

I probably wouldn't pay overs to get Draper here right now, mostly because he hasn't proven himself as you have said. But he has a lot of upside IMO as a No1 ruck. He could also stop gap in the forward line of we want to bridge a few years of Oscar still rucking. Perhaps you rate Smith enough to be ready to pick up the mantle when McInerny retires.

Plus there would be some delicious tears of we went back to the essendon well and poached our Danniher replacement from them lol.

 

[Viceregal]

If player A (drafted at say pick 6) and player Z drafted at say pick 87 in 2024 both seemed to turn into potentially generational players in their first two years but for some reason had been drafted to the pit of hell (say St Kilda under Lyon) and were aiming to head to a much better run and awesome club (say the Lions) and the Saints wanted to pay them as much as possible without the option of writing a new contract ...

Player A would be contracted for 3 years and get the standard rate in 2025, the standard rate with maximum allowable bonuses in 2026 and 2027 and then walk to Brisbane out of contract in 2028.

Player Z would be contracted for 2 years and get the standard rate in 2025, the standard rate with maximum allowable bonuses in 2026 and walk to Brisbane out of contract in 2027 to start his Lion's life at whatever rate his management and the Lions work out amongst themselves a year earlier.

Is that right?

 

[briztoon]

Yes there is, but you are stuck on your own interpretation that is wrong. This exact issue was actually discussed in last year's draft thread too!






Also - if you look at the minimum player base salary in the CBA it specifically excludes first to third year players

View attachment 2285418
Not third year players drafted who have a guaranteed 3 year contract - all third year players don't fall within the minimum base payment per annum clause.

Then the EBA should specifically mention that players drafted after pick 20 are subject to a team option 3rd year extension.

 

[briztoon]

If player A (drafted at say pick 6) and player Z drafted at say pick 87 in 2024 both seemed to turn into potentially generational players in their first two years but for some reason had been drafted to the pit of hell (say St Kilda under Lyon) and were aiming to head to a much better run and awesome club (say the Lions) and the Saints wanted to pay them as much as possible without the option of writing a new contract ...

Player A would be contracted for 3 years and get the standard rate in 2025, the standard rate with maximum allowable bonuses in 2026 and 2027 and then walk to Brisbane out of contract in 2028.

Player Z would be contracted for 2 years and get the standard rate in 2025, the standard rate with maximum allowable bonuses in 2026 and walk to Brisbane out of contract in 2027 to start his Lion's life at whatever rate his management and the Lions work out amongst themselves a year earlier.

Is that right?

No, because they're not restricted or unrestricted free agents. We'd have to trade for them.

 

[Tom14]

Then the EBA should specifically mention that players drafted after pick 20 are subject to a team option 3rd year extension.

Final post on this - it is a not a team option 3rd year extension. It is that any third year after being drafted is subject to a set base salary plus performance incentives. The draftee after 21 has to agree to an extension.

We could extend Logan tomorrow for 5 years, but his 2026 season would follow the financial rules for first to third year players.

 

[p4p1]

Are people hating on Draper because he cant play? Or because he would be too expensive? Or because it's just unrealistic?

I rate Draper as a Ruckman pretty highly, it would also be interesting to see what our midfield could do with an actual tap Ruckman. Would an upgrade in the forward line of Oscar Allen be better then an upgrade in the midfield?

Upgrading the forward line is more important than upgrading a ruckman.
The weekend was a good example of why IMO. Compare Darcy’s influence on the game while he was up forward to when he was in the ruck.

 

[Elixuh]

They lost me at EBA.

 

[lionraven]

After reading all arguments and closing remarks we can all agree that Charlie Cameron

23

Charlie Cameron

Age

30

Ht

180cm

Wt

76kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.1

3star

K

8.4

3star

HB

3.7

3star

M

3.0

3star

T

3.2

5star

G

1.5

5star

D

9.6

2star

K

7.9

3star

HB

1.7

1star

M

3.6

4star

T

1.7

3star

G

1.9

5star

D

9.6

3star

K

5.4

2star

HB

4.2

4star

M

1.4

2star

T

3.4

5star

G

1.2

4star

is a good guy. Any contact was incidental and accidental in nature. All charges and suspensions should be overturned. Case dismissed.

 

[Viceregal]

No, because they're not restricted or unrestricted free agents. We'd have to trade for them.

Nods ... but otherwise Z really is better off than A as he gets to escape from Morrabin a year early.

And yes Charlie is a good guy and so (once he changed clubs) was Luke Hodge

 

[Section 5]

Final post on this - it is a not a team option 3rd year extension. It is that any third year after being drafted is subject to a set base salary plus performance incentives. The draftee after 21 has to agree to an extension.

We could extend Logan tomorrow for 5 years, but his 2026 season would follow the financial rules for first to third year players.

Which is good.
Saves clubs from getting too carried away after a player has a couple of promising years.
Also, less incentive on a player to move when he will only be getting the same at another club for that year.

 

[Perrip]

 

[Johnny Bananas]

Did not say he was better, but that is my belief.

Section 5 did, and that's who I was responding to when you began replying to me.

If you offered me Morris or Allen on our list, it is Morris every day of the week.

Again, that isn't the scenario, as we can have both.

Besides, they're two different questions. If you offered me Zorko or Wilmot on our list, I'd take Wilmot because he has another 10-12 years left in him whereas Zorks has a year or two at best. But Zorko is the better player right now.

Logan has well proven he is capable of kicking 50 - which is what I was replying to.

No, he hasn't. He has had a good 5 game run, and we're all hoping he keeps it up all season long, but we don't know if he can do that just yet. He hasn't even turned 20 yet, there's plenty of time for him to improve before we put high expectations on him.

 

[Perrip]

Ten questions with Tom Morris: 'The issue' at play for potential $1.2 million gun Nasiah Wanganeen-Milera

Any other West Aussies potentially exploring returning home to WA? This is outside of Chad Warner

1

Chad Warner

Age

23

Ht

185cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

7.0

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

2.5

2star

M

1.5

2star

T

1.5

3star

CL

0.0

1star

D

7.0

1star

K

4.5

2star

HB

2.5

2star

M

1.5

2star

T

1.5

2star

CL

0.0

1star

D

7.0

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

2.5

3star

M

1.5

2star

T

1.5

4star

CL

0.0

1star

and Kysaiah Pickett

36

Kysaiah Pickett

Age

23

Ht

171cm

Wt

73kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

8.0

2star

K

4.7

2star

HB

3.3

3star

M

0.7

1star

T

2.6

4star

G

0.6

4star

D

8.0

2star

K

4.7

2star

HB

3.3

2star

M

0.7

1star

T

2.6

4star

G

0.6

4star

D

8.0

2star

K

4.8

2star

HB

3.2

3star

M

0.8

1star

T

2.4

4star

G

0.8

4star

- via Billy on Facebook
Morris: "Brandon Starcevich

37

Brandon Starcevich

Age

25

Ht

188cm

Wt

90kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

9.2

2star

K

6.5

3star

HB

2.6

2star

M

2.8

3star

T

2.0

4star

MG

185.3

3star

D

9.5

2star

K

7.3

3star

HB

2.3

2star

M

3.6

4star

T

2.1

3star

MG

187.9

3star

D

8.6

3star

K

5.4

2star

HB

3.2

3star

M

1.4

2star

T

1.8

4star

MG

181.2

3star

, but West Coast have cooled on him. I think he is keen to stay at Brisbane and the Lions are keen to keep him.
"The complexities of concussion mean that this might take a while, but I'm not sure he's as destined for WA as we all thought 12 months ago."