Next Generation

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Around the Wicket said:
At least Lyon won't be short of a bowl come NZ.. 46 overs in first innings and still going.
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It's always interesting watching the difference between how Shield and international teams play Lyon.

He never really dominates Shield cricket with batsmen playing him comfortably. Yet at international level teams poke and prod around.

Warne was the same, never as effective at Shield level.
 
Yoda_ said:
tokenism selection incoming, Maxi Klinger style who debuted at 36 or something in the T20i format?
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Even then, Klinger only got selected because half the regular T20 side were in India for a test match that started the next day.

It'll take a lot more than one article from Daniel Cherny to get anyone into an Australian side.
 

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Foucault1989 said:
It's always interesting watching the difference between how Shield and international teams play Lyon.

He never really dominates Shield cricket with batsmen playing him comfortably. Yet at international level teams poke and prod around.

Warne was the same, never as effective at Shield level.
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The pitches don't offer alot for spinners in Shield cricket though, the most successful bowlers in Shield are medium pacers.
 
Foucault1989 said:
Couldn't agree more. It's just dumb, low percentage cricket. The modern way seems to be take risks at all costs, consequences don't matter. If you're in trouble, don't try and tough it out, hit your way out of it. It is absolutely frustrating!

On another note, so good to see Pucovski make a ton with patient, conventional batting. A joy to watch.

He is the best youngish batsmen in the country. No one comes close. Forget Bancroft, Renshaw and Harris - if Pucovski stays mentally and physically healthy, he is the best option.
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Agree with Pucovski. He's had a rough trot and I was beginning to think a Test career was all but over for him, but today's 131 was a good start. If he can build on that, there's definitely a Test spot waiting for him in future.

As for taking risks, if the situation demands it then go for it, but we are seeing players playing ridiculous shots in situations that demand getting the head down and building on good starts. I've been a huge fan of Alex Carey, but that shot he played yesterday cost the Redbacks any chance they had of victory. Not good enough.
 
hugecannon said:
Nic Maddison in the frame as opener, if Smith doesn’t contribute or when Kwahja retires?

His record for Victoria over the last few years has been impressive
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If it wasn't for his disastrous, unearned first stint in the Test team he'd be one of the next in line. He's been brilliant for Victoria and fully deserves a shot if Smith opening doesn't work out.
 
I was firmly in the Renshaw camp, but he's made a string of low scores.

If we needed an open right now, I'd go with someone in form like Bancroft or even Maddinson

However if Smith stays at the top, maybe they see Renshaw as Khawaja's successor in a year or two due to his age, and want to give him as much as experience with current side as possible
 
Foucault1989 said:
My worry with Maddison that his issue is between the ears. Not sure he has that edge to make it in test cricket. I think he is a very good Shield batsmen and that's his ceiling.

All the talent in the world but not the grit to play tests.
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He got stitched up massively early in his career. Hopefully time away has helped him, and if his form continues he’ll be hard to ignore
 

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big_e said:
Bancroft needs to bat in the middle order for a while to prove he can cover anywhere in the top six, which is why Renshaw is there.
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You can move smudge down if needed and change the order which they have shown recently

But no E this is just more than Renshaw batting in the middle order he can't make a run there or at the top atm..thats the point he is totally out of form

if you want someone to cover the middle order pick a Webster or a young Will even Maddison

the simple fact is Renshaw is scoring no runs wherever he bats and should not be in the conversation for the next reserve bat in the squad
 
Westend said:
You can move smudge down if needed and change the order which they have shown recently

But no E this is just more than Renshaw batting in the middle order he can't make a run there or at the top atm..thats the point he is totally out of form

if you want someone to cover the middle order pick a Webster or a young Will even Maddison

the simple fact is Renshaw is scoring no runs wherever he bats and should not be in the conversation for the next reserve bat in the squad
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Yeah, they're not shifting the batting order around that much for potentially one game.

I see it a bit like when JL made his way onto a few tours because he could keep wickets if necessary. Was he the next best batter? No. Was he the next best keeper? Of course not. Was he good enough to do either, if required. Yes.

I'm serious. Have Bancroft bat in the middle order for Gloucestershire all winter, and then again when the Shield starts next season and then he's in the frame again. Let him keep a few times in grade cricket as well and suddenly he's in the mix as the reserve player for the Sri Lanka and West Indies tours next year.
 
Foucault1989 said:
It's always interesting watching the difference between how Shield and international teams play Lyon.

He never really dominates Shield cricket with batsmen playing him comfortably. Yet at international level teams poke and prod around.

Warne was the same, never as effective at Shield level.
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Or even district level a few times he played it. State team mates rarely had issues with him. I remember one game in particular where Reifel (more than handy bat mind you) completely annihilated him.
 
The only spinners in recent times who I recall being hard to batsmen to get after are Steve O’Keefe and Johan Botha (obviously an outlier).

Any bowler who tosses it up is vulnerable, and all are hamstrung by poor captaincy.

The ones who succeed at test level tend to be captained well. Look at all of them who failed under Ponting, versus Lyon under various others.

I firmly believe that Jason Krejza had the attributes but was mishandled.
 
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Black Diamond said:
The only spinners in recent times who I recall being hard to batsmen to get after are Steve O’Keefe and Johan Botha (obviously an outlier).

Any bowler who tosses it up is vulnerable, and all are hamstrung by poor captaincy.

The ones who succeed at test level tend to be captained well. Look at all of them who failed under Ponting, versus Lyon under various others.

I firmly believe that Jason Krejza had the attributes but was mishandled.
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Had a few temperamental issues as well
 
Westend said:
You can move smudge down if needed and change the order which they have shown recently

But no E this is just more than Renshaw batting in the middle order he can't make a run there or at the top atm..thats the point he is totally out of form

if you want someone to cover the middle order pick a Webster or a young Will even Maddison

the simple fact is Renshaw is scoring no runs wherever he bats and should not be in the conversation for the next reserve bat in the squad
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Smith averages nearly 60 and wants to open and you would move him for young mate who averages half that. They already changed the batting order to accomodate one West Aussie who doesn't deserve his place in the batting order......
 
The 747 said:
Smith averages nearly 60 and wants to open and you would move him for young mate who averages half that. They already changed the batting order to accomodate one West Aussie who doesn't deserve his place in the batting order......
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yeah whatever 747 just make crap up again to suit your hating WA narrative

if your read the post its about renshaw pathetic form and being in the test squad compared to other players in the shield

the response was to Big E stating that Bancroft needs to bat in the middle order to get a spot in the squad

big_e said:
Bancroft needs to bat in the middle order for a while to prove he can cover anywhere in the top six, which is why Renshaw is there.
Click to expand...
 
Westend said:
yeah whatever 747 just make crap up again to suit your hating WA narrative

if your read the post its about renshaw pathetic form and being in the test squad compared to other players in the shield

the response was to Big E stating that Bancroft needs to bat in the middle order to get a spot in the squad
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I read the post and don't disagree with what you say about Renshaw's form. But Bancroft is an opener and big_e is right he would need to show he can bat anywhere in the top 6 to be reserve batter.

Bancroft is not going to displace Smith or Usman. Your incredible bias (which you seem oblivious to) means you seriously suggest that Smith should move from where he wants to bat to accommodate a WA player. There is no way you would ever argue that for a player that came from somewhere else.

Sook about my WA hate (I dont hate WA I just tire of how incredibly biased WA supporters are on this board) if you want, but it's true.
 
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